No means no, surely?

[notavalidusername]

I'll try to make this as short as I can.

Myself & DP have a 5 year old son. We are waiting for him to be assessed as we are 99% sure he has autism. He has a lot of sensory issues too.

I was upstairs yesterday catching a break and DP was downstairs with the kids. 5 and his little sister had a bicker about a toy that they both wanted. Normally we distract one and it works.

While I was upstairs about to go down, I hear 5 shouting 'no put me down, I don't want to be held like that, I want to get down'. I went down and DP had 5 laying across his lap, wrapped up in a blanket, saying he wants to get down. I tried to do eye contact with DP to nudge him to put 5 down. But he wouldn't. Eventually I said 'he doesn't like it', and DP says 'you weren't here, you don't know what's going on'.

After the longest minute, he put 5 down. Then he stormed upstairs and didn't speak
to me. I tried and he told me not to, which led to us not speaking until this morning. He said he was 'calming 5 down' - which has never worked. Who gets calmed down by being wrapped tightly in a blanket, which crying to get down? Not our son anyway.

I am extremely annoyed that when 5 said no, he wasn't listened to by his dad. We never force the kids to hug/kiss people (including us) if they don't want to. It's their right, body autonomy and all that. DP still maintains he was calming 5 down, which clearly wasn't working. When we spoke this morning (kids at school), I asked him why he didn't send 5 up to his room with his new weighted blanket (which he loves) and he could calm himself down.

I think regardless of what happened prior to it, he should have listened to 5 and put him down instead of wrapping him in a blanket, crying and getting more worked up. I said this to DP this morning and he said 'all the parenting and discipline is on you now, I'll just live here' and stormed off again refusing to talk. I'm all for discipline but this was not discipline.

Sorry that was longer than expected. Who is being unreasonable?

WTF!!!!! That I am sorry is clearly wrong and as a mum that must have been just as traumatising for you to watch and not explode which I understand would have aggravated the situation even more. It is never right to pin a child like that and think your husband needs to give his head a wobble. You need to explain under no circumstances does he ever do that again or he wouldnt even be living there if that was me and my child. Good luck OP x

I dunno, it doesn’t sound exactly pleasant but it also sounds like dad was doing what he thought was right in the circumstance. His comment about you doing all the parenting suggests that you’re often interfering in what he’s doing and suggesting better ways of doing it - is that the case?

i think sometimes as parents we don’t get it exactly right and it’s not useful to have the other parent there pointing out what’s wrong in what we have done

Idk, it's hard to gauge what the atmosphere was like but it sounds like a bit of an overreaction to me. Have you considered that you might micromanage?

I don't 'interfere' as such but I do have some issues with things he does. If our 3yo daughter is annoyed, he'll say 'are you annoyed?', she'll say no and he'll say 'yeah you are'. Which works her up more, sometimes until she's upset. Just like if we have an argument and if he tells me to calm down.. telling someone to calm
down never works. I've called him out on it and he said he's 'just playing'. But to me, 'just playing' shouldn't lead to our children being upset.

Also, I do like 90% of the parenting anyway.

I don't feel like I do micromanage but if something is leading to my children being upset unnecessarily, then fuck yes I will
speak up. He is a grown man.

It sounds like there's a pattern of him ignoring the children's feelings and imposing his on them, then having a tantrum if you challenge him. Thats a problem.
Would he consider parenting classes to change his parenting style? You could go together.

Apparently there's nothing wrong with the way he parents the kids. And if I don't like how he does it, I can do it all myself.

His approach doesn't work but I can understand him getting frustrated if you've decided to berate him again today

Why do you do 90% of the parenting?

Is this through your choice, or his, or work commitments? Do you not have any time to yourself where he parents on his own?

I wasn't berating him again though, he stormed off yesterday so this morning was the first chance we got to talk about it. I laid my concerns out and he wasn't happy, stormed off again

How was your DS after your DH put him down? Did it make him worse?

I can certainly see why this incident upset you. However, trying to look at it from both sides, if your son has a weighted blanket which calms him down, I can see why your DH thought wrapping him up might help, especially if he was in state where DH was worried he might actually hurt himself. That sort of thing does calm some children.

I think I would say that I personally wouldn't have liked what your DH did either, if it was making your son worse. But I don't think the fact that your son was saying 'no, I don't like it' is actually the reason that your DH should have put him down. He should have put him down because it wasn't working, not because your son said no. I don't think being held still during a massive tantrum is at all equivalent to being forced to hug or kiss someone. There are times when it is necessary to do things to a child that they don't like. I'm not saying that this was one of those times, necessarily, but I don't think the 'no means no' argument is the one I would be putting forward to make my point to your DH.

He's not working right now. The plan was for me to be at home with the kids and he happens to be here too. It's just how it goes. I get to sleep in once a week.

There's a lot coming to me right now and I think I've just decided I don't want to be with him. He used to corner me after an argument - not to be physical or anything but to 'get me to talk', which never worked... just angered me when he wouldn't listen to me telling him to stop cornering me. He's got better at it now and doesn't do it but I think I'm over the relationship.

Thanks for the replies

I can see why you have a different opinion to him on those things but honestly they sound very minor to me. When you coparent you have to navigate two different people with potentially different approaches they have every right to have. Sometimes it will be about big things and sometimes, like this, small times that you honestly need to let go. His way is not less valid than yours unless it is obviously unacceptable, we all think we are right.

It's impossible to get the full picture from a snapshot but from what you say here it sounds like you do micromanage.

He was fine after DP put him down. It was clear that wrapping him in a duvet wasn't helping and DS was getting worse. It wasn't a massive tantrum, he doesn't have massive tantrums. He whinged over something he wanted. I would have heard a 'tantrum' but I didn't.

DP's tantrums are bigger than most kids' tantrums.

It comes across that all parenting has to be done 'your' way.

I wonder is that because the majority of parenting is left to me anyway so I've gotten used to doing it.

Sounds like he was trying to replicate the weighted blanket perhaps? I could see why he might have thought that could have helped. It's pretty hard to tell without being there if he was totally out of line or not but people parent differently and we don't all get it right every time.

I have an autistic DS and to be honest I have done similar to your DH. The reason are that

A. Deep touch does calm my DS (not for everyone, depends on sensory profile)

B. Sometimes I need to protect my younger DC more then I need to respect DS's wishes (to be put down so he can get on with attacking her)

What actually went on with the kids bickering? As your DH pointed out you weren't there, and don't seem to have asked, or at least haven't relaid it here. Is it possible that your DS had a meltdown and became a danger to your younger DC (full lose of impulse control), in that state he would not have been able to follow instructions like "go upstairs and use your weighted blanket". I'm not saying your DH did the wrong thing, just that he may have done what seemed like the best thing in the heat of a very difficult situation.

5 took a toy from his sister, she took it back and he cried for it. So DP picked him up and tried the 'calming' technique. I understand doing it if it's something that works - we tried before and it doesn't, never has. DS never becomes a danger to himself, his sister or anyone else. He'll whinge sometimes like a normal child, but he's never had tantrums

Wow what a complete over reaction from you.

OP maybe he was just doing his best in the circumstances. We don’t always get it right all the time. I love the way on mumsnet it’s always the mum who knows best and the dad who is useless.

It sounds like you're after an excuse just to leave him as it will be easier to say he's a shit dad than admit you're the problem.

I can see your Husband's logic with wrapping him in a blanket and holding him if his weighted blanket usually works but he should have put him down when it was obvious that it wasn't working.

Your Husband sounds unnecessarily huffy but you do also come across as if it's your way or nothing.
People have different parenting styles, if you do split you'll need to accept that you can't control how he disciplines them in his time.

From your update, I can see why you react the way you do if you're thinking the kids feel the way you do when you were cornered. You say you're done with the relationship, I think you need to talk to him about that and leave the relationship if that's what you want to do. Bickering at eachother over these things won't help and isn't good for anyone.

I'm on the fence. Sometimes I do not agree with DH's approach with parenting but have to accept that he's going to do things his own way. I've also dealt with situations badly when I've been stressed out with bickering children and would not have appreciated being called out on it. In general we're all just doing our best.

I never said he was a shit dad, but okay :)

And I don't 'need' an excuse to leave him and I sure as hell don't need to justify it to anyone on mn. I simply said more incidences were coming to me which has made me realise it's over. Thanks for your concern though!