In being such a shit parent?

[Skippingthroughthepilots]

DD is 6. I have suspected SEN for years but no idea what to do really, school are supposed to be doing a form for a referral but no movement there in over a year because she is absolutely no problem for them.

At home life is just... awful. There are nice moments, but mostly a lot of screaming, hitting, meltdowns, rude and nasty personal attacks. Nothing we do is right. I've seen the patterns clearly for ages and I think most of it is due to anxiety, but that's where the problem lies. I can't let her anxiety rule all our lives and everyone else in the family suffer or walk always on eggshells, so I get harsh about it (being nice, patient, explaining things has never worked, just wasted loads of time with no effect). For example - I move some furniture to clear space. She goes crazy. I end up putting her outside/employing a horrible threat like taking away a toy just to get her to stop screaming about it. If I ignore, she will keep on at me until I snap, so I am getting quicker to be harsh, which is obviously a horrible feeling.

Or if she has a party/playdate she will begin day by attacking younger siblings, telling them how rubbish they are etc. Will panic about clothes. Meltdown or begin campaign of rudeness until an adult loses their temper. Only when we have snapped and shouted back or punished her will she stop. The nice way never works. Whatever is going on in her head can't stop to see reason.

So AIBU to just keep being that shit parent who bullies, threatens or shouts? I obviously don't feel good about it, she's so young, but is this just what people do? Or is there another way? I'm out of ideas and we're all so miserable.

You need help. I know everyone is fast to talk ASD on MN but I’d say it’s clear cut in this case. Can you speak to anyone privately? She’s clearly masking at school. The aggression on play date day is likely anticipatory anxiety about what’s about going happen.

Push the school as much as you can for that referral. Go to the GP see if they can do anything about an assessment.

It sounds stressful she has got used to the shouting to stop or get desired behaviour so someone shouts and on it goes and everyone is miserable, I think you should push the school for a referral or some support if there is suspected sen also try and get a gp appointmen. I dont think you should continue to shout at her and be the "shit parent".

Do a self referral op. Contact cahms yourself. School just do part of the form. Maybe agree with dd that her room can stay exactly the same and you promise not to move anything.. Shouting at her if she is autistic is completely inappropriate.. And pointless as you know.

Can you do anything in the run up to these meltdowns?

Like if you're going to move furniture tell her about it a few days before. Draw picture of how it's going to be so she gets used to the idea? It could be that the change of environmental is what triggers the meltdown but if she has time to mentally prepare for it she may be OK with it.

Could the panic around clothes be the same? Show her the day before what she's going to wear? Or is it a sensory thing? Does she need comfortable clothes with no labels etc? If it's sensory it really needs to be accommodated for otherwise being in clothes that hurt all day is going to cause more meltdowns.

I dont know, lots of kids this age do this at home and are good at school and are NT and they're not masking, kids love to have tantrums and go mad about something seemingly small and push boundaries. If she's responding to punishment/being told off/threatened to take toys away then this suggests to me she is in control and therefore may not be ND. You need to get onto school if you feel differently- why have you let them sit on it for a year? Record your daughter at home. Show the GP or the school. Explain about masking etc. Be her advocate if you truly believe its more than just tantrums.

Lots of signs of ASD.
My dd is 14, has ASD and I clearly remember going through exactly this when there was a party/playdate.
It is not exactly anxiety, it is the fear of the unknown, and the fear of transion and change. Everything new is a challenge, every change is a challenge (hence the trouble with moved furniture).
She really wants to go to the party, but at the same time the fear of the unknown is overwhelming.
For her, I started to do this:
get dressed in the morning in something that will pass for OK at the party.
have present etc ready, don't expect her to write her name.
suggest that you go together to the party, go in together and drop off the present, and then if she wants to leave, you can leave, if she wants you to stay you can stay.
dd then managed to get to the party to drop off the present, and as soon as she was there, saw people she knew, could assess the room and see it was OK, she was fine, and she stayed.

we still use it as shorthand - she is stressing and getting anxious - dd this is a birthday party feeling, it is the unknown.

You can get round quite a lot of these by giving her preparation. If you want to move furniture, talk about it, show her where it is going, talk about the benefits (you'll have more space to play) and do it in stages.
Going somewhere new, give her as much information as possible. Pictures, timeline, what is going to happen etc.

and self refer for assessment.

See this is the thing @ChickensandCows - I'm so confused in my head now. School don't think there's a problem (though they've cautiously mentioned anxiety). My mum says were making up problems and there's nothing wrong except us wanting a referral because that will somehow create issues where there aren't any. DD is bright, clearly has too much going on in her head, can be kind and sweet but so much of the time just seems to want to hurt everyone as much as she can. Her younger sisters are getting to the age when it really affects them. I can't seem to not let it affect me. But nobody around me thinks she genuinely has any real issues, so I don't know what to do. Thanks for all the comments though, I guess I do know shouting isn't the way forward

No playdates

No big deal at that age

too much stimulation

find the little solutions you can.

@steppemum that is really helpful, thanks

I'm sure you're not a shit parent.

Read How to talk so kids will listen... if you haven't already. Also with our autistic son there is so much about preparing him, no surprises, having routines in place, reducing demand before he gets overloaded. It's hard when they are little because they can't always tell you what the problem is, but with hindsight maybe a warning that you were going to move the furniture tomorrow, and explaining how long for and why, and what it would look like afterwards, might have helped.

Routines absolutely rule out lives but they buy us our child back. We have gone from an unpredictable child on a hair trigger (because he was constantly at the end of his tether) to one who we can understand much better. He is calmer and more predictable, though we still have awful days and weeks.

It reminds me of a magic trick sometimes - there's an implausible amount of prep that goes in behind the scenes, but that prep is what makes the whole thing work. If you're struggling, look further back on the timeline -what could I have done differently yesterday, or last week? How can I change from managing this reactively to proactively? But mostly keep ploughing on, it will get easier as her communication skills improve.

So flip the switch - work on the basis that she is NT rather than hunting for the signs and referrals that she is ND. Try structured boundaries, reward good behaviour, use a reward board, start taking toys,use a naughty step etc. Do the things people sometimes say is wrong but just to test it out- if she responds even slightly then keep going. If she gets more uncontrollable then pursue the ND referrals etc. Meet with her teacher and talk to her in front of DD "so she behaves like XYZ at home but doesn't do this at school so can you give some tips on how you manage behaviour at school so I can replicate it at home" see if she responds to you making it an open issue with school working with you - this might make her realise what she is doing IF she is NT.

And to add - the fact you are worrying so much about this and seeking advice shows your are 100% NOT a shit parent.

I think I agree with the no playdates or do them outsiden this is clearly overwhelming for her and definitely not fun . Also do things in blocks and slowly so say we are going to get dressed soon what are you wearing today so she has a little bit of control of the situation. Children even without SEN can be overwhelmed and anxious

Whether it's SEN or not, you need some help. There may be a behaviour support service available in your area. You may be able to get a referral to CAMHS from your GP. Get a referral as soon as you can because there can be long waiting lists.

This is true. My daughter is nearly 5 and can get very overwhelmed. She is NT 100% no question there but does need some days off and can't be on the go all weekend for example. She also has to stick to bedtimes or she gets over tired and then overwhelmed. Pull back what you can and stick to routine and see how she goes.

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@ChickensandCows I think this is what I am doing - treating her as NT which has a short term good effect (she can be scared into quietness/meek behaviour, reward charts don't work well as she loses interest very quickly and I can obviously see that she can't master herself enough in a hot moment just for the sake of a star/prize). But I am really worried about the long term effects of us all living like this. And her behaviour hasn't changed much over the past 3 years. I get the feeling that she knows what the 'rules' are but can't stick to them, and what I'm doing now is managing the situation for the rest of us but not for her. What you say is food for thought though, thanks

I know it’s so hard but she’s internalising shame for every meltdown if you’re shouting at her. Don’t see your job so much as to stop the meltdown but to help her process what’s going on. She’s already so overwhelmed at that moment. Basically aim for how you want her to talk herself down in 5 years because everything you say and do will eventually be the way she deals with it herself.

Sorry the link is so long but I would recommend this parenting course.

Thanks also to others for their helpful suggestions. Good to hear that play dates etc aren't seen as vital, I'd happily not do them for her. I will definitely try more routine and preparation

My ds got to 13 before anyone at school agreed he is probably autistic. Start the fight now op. It will take a long time.

She is 6
the play dates aren’t working for you, her or your family

so just say no thanks (and drop the mum a message to explain)

@BluecheeseandBaskerville thanks, that thought about what I say being how she will talk to herself is something I try to hold onto, I agree it's really important

dd presents well at school, is intelligent and academically successful. articulate etc etc. She has never really been great at friendships, which was put down to a 'nasty' group of girls in her class (they weren't really).
I began to suspect it in year 4, and looking back began to see loads of tiny signs. We didn't pursue a diagnosis as she was fine at school. She was emotionally hard work at home. I realised later that I scaffolded her massively which allowed her to be fine at school.

It started to fall apart at secondary. That was much harder, combined with puberty. Then we pursued a diagnosis.

Think of the temper as more like a panic attack. Not deliberate, and the solution is to calm the panic.

and a comment on your shouting working and being nice doesn't. I would say that what is working is very simple clear boundary lines. Nice often is less clear about the actual rules. We often found that we needed to give 2 clear options and then walk away, and let her decide. That was a game changer.
eg - you need to put those toys in that box. Put the toys in the box and then you can watch TV. If you don't put the toys away, then you cannot watch TV today.
She might kick off, but 20 minutes later the toys were away.

And at some points, the solution was to sit down and wrap her in my arms and give her a long firm cuddle.