Declined for a role due to being uncomfortable/awkward, help

[Makingplansfornigel1]

It was through an agency actually. I'm qualified as a teacher (apparently "outstanding") however I sometimes I wonder how.
Anyway I had a trial day as a HLTA/cover teacher in a nice primary school the other day.
I was with a year 2 class who were a bit rowdy, surely it's as I was a new face to them. Naturally I was a bit nervous/stressed but I tried to be friendly yet firm. I praised them but also employed the behaviour policy, using C1s/c2s, moving pupils, speaking to them about behaviour etc.
The 2 TAs also supported and guided, which was appreciated.
The headteacher didn't see me teach at any point, nor did any senior staff, only the 2 TAs.
They seemed friendly TAs telling me, oh you'll be fine here, it's a lovely school etc. And seemed supportive.
Anyway I had a phone call today from my agency telling me that they had decided not to take me on for the role as I had essentially seemed 'uncomfortable and awkward' with the children.
I presume the head decided this, however only the TAs saw me with the kids so I presume they fed back to the head.
I understand if they don't think I'm a good fit, however naturally disappointed as it was a really well-paying role. Luckily I have managed to get other work for at least next week.
I think the head or a member of SLT should have also observed me before making a decision, not just the TAs.

I was certainly a little nervous and the kids will naturally play up but I don't understand the uncomfortable/awkward thing.
I've had it before where I've been told I seemed 'nervous' even if I felt fairly relaxed.
Maybe I've just got a nervous disposition but I'm not sure what I can do about it.
The TAs were obviously trying to be friendly if not very genuine.
Anyway not sure what to make of this feedback and how to avoid it in future?

Was this the only part that took place? Was there no interview?

I think everyone is reading a lot in to the TAs possible assessment and her daughter etc, but I see in your OP that you say you’ve been described as “nervous” previously as well. I think generally from the sound of your OP that that is what you should be focussing on.

Is there more to this @Makingplansfornigel1 ? If this was for a full time post, as a TA/cover teacher, did you not have an interview?

I feel we don't know enough about your precious work experience to make a judgement.

If you were there for a whole day (were you?) did the head not come into the classroom at all?

Do you think the TAs gave feedback to the Head at lunchtime/ after school perhaps?

TBH if you were struggling to control a class of very young pupils, I suspect they had concerns as to how you would cope with Year 6.

I've had a long career in teaching including doing supply across all ages. I know that to fit in, you have to perform on the day from the minute you enter the room. You don't have the luxury of getting to know the class, you have to roll your sleeves up and crack on, and that means good classroom management.

From your posts, it appears you have never taught a class. What have you done? Have you had feedback on why your were turned down for posts over a 10 year period? How did you manage when you were training? Did you do a PGCE or BEd?

Maybe you need to assess if it's really the career for you?

At Primary my DD was friendly with the DD of the school secretary who booked supply cover. Any supply who messed up in their class didn’t get rebooked.

And while that might sound outrageous, the girls feedback tended to be descriptive & factual.

Have re- read the whole thread. This sounds like a situation where the school are looking for a candidate for a cover role and needed supply for that day. They have talked to the agency who said you might suit for the role, so while you were there they considered you as a possibility. In our school we do this sometimes. It doesn't always involve a formal interview. Currently we have someone from an agency covering a maternity leave for a term (another staff member is returning from ML in September, so we don't need her longer term). First she did odd days and was good (many supply teachers do not impress), then she covered two days a week for a term, now she is full time. Since all the situations were temporary, there was no formal process. If something else comes up in future, we are likely to ask her if she would like it. But if it was a permanent or long term situation, we would go through a formal process, even if she was the only candidate we chose to interview.

There is nothing odd or suspicious about the situation you described. As SLT we do walk past classrooms, maybe listen in for a few minutes or walk in to talk to some pupils- if we see poor behaviour management, we won't delve further - what's the point? It's a pre- requisite in this job to be able to control the class. Some people just give off the wrong vibe.

Agencies contact us all the time saying they have the perfect candidate. Even for specific roles they put forward people clearly unsuitable even from the paper work. We tend to work with agencies who understand our school and needs better. Essentially they are in the business of selling, much like estate agents.

Sounds a bit iffy OP.

But are you newly qualified? I work in a front facing role but have been doing the job so long, I can't imagine feeling nervous in a new setting.

Maybe they wanted someone older and more experienced and hardened if it was a rowdy class.

I'd make enquiries with the head. Agencies are a bit devious sometimes

Ask Head for feedback x

God I’m so glad I got out of teaching - it could be a million things you’re not aware of op, things that are nothing to do with you. Schools are very often such intense and toxic places to work.

To be fair handing out C1, C2 to six year olds seems pretty heavy handed, they just thought you weren't the right fit for the school. It happens.

I’m a recruiter / Hr and - if I were you, I would circumnavigate the agency and drop a polite email to the head teacher saying you completely respect their decision, but you’d really benefit from some constructive feedback that will help you in future. Agencies want to please and will often “fluff” feedback. If you go directly to the head, in a very non confrontational way, just honestly asking for feedback, you’re likely to get to the heart of the matter! Xx

Oh, and if they don’t reply…clearly not an empowering/ confident leader you’d want to work with anyway! 😊

Another good idea - interview coaching! I know it sounds daft, but trial days with TAs are effectively long interviews and this sort of coaching could really help! TopCV are one I know of, but I’m sure there are little loads of others if you google. Happy to help if you want to DM/PM (whatever it’s called)! xx

That’s weird. So basically TAs were doing classroom observations and evaluations and deciding who should be hired. And make these observations on day 1 too!!

When using supply staff through an agency then the person is being paid to cover the class- the head wouldn't make a formal observation of that- it's common I would think, and happens all the time, that the head will say how was 'so and so' and if the TA says they weren't great they wouldn't rehire them. That's what happens in my school- I'm the TA with a lot of experience and the head trusts my judgement- in fact I'm as qualified with more experience than she is!

And of course they make these decisions on day 1- that's the most crucial. Even for a formal job application for a permanent position, teachers' get 1 lesson to prove themselves- they don't try out for a few days- they watch each candidate teach one lesson, interview them and then pick the best.

I don't want to add to your miseries, but have you had any supply bookings long enough to contribute to your NQT/ECT years? Isn't there a five year limit to supply, if you haven't started your ECT induction during that time?

I'll try to add the relevant paragraph from the government's 'Statutory Induction Guidance' - if I'm able to upload a picture.

Children won't play up if they see you mean business, unless, of course, they're from homes where parents have no age appropriate rules.
Uncertainty can be felt, just as fear can be felt without any action taking place, it doesn't need to be heard in the voice.
If you're a professional, there should be no need to feel anxious or whatever it was you were feeling. TAs aren't teachers, they're underlings.

LoisLane66, you're obviously not a professional if you think TA's are underlings. I think the word you was looking for is peer. I have a very different job than the teacher in my class. She couldn't do my job and i wouldn't want to do hers. With your attitude towards children and staff have you ever thought you're in the wrong job?

You are being unreasonable to buy a tub of egg mayo.

I didn't know it even existed.

What a complete waste of money. It will be cheap eggs and cheap mayo.

Boil egg, add good mayo, job done.

Oops- wrong thread!

@titbumwillypoo
I stand by my post.
TAs are usually not as qualified as teachers although they may have had some university training or the 12 week fast track course into 'qualifying' as a TA.
Teaching ASSISTANT is not a teacher. They assist teachers by taking on pupils in the class who may have minor learning difficulties, are behind in maths or reading amongst other subjects.
In any company, an assistant to the post holder is not on a par with the post holder does not have the standing of the post holder.
I am retired so no comparison can be made. I have a masters in criminal law.

@titbumwillypoo
.. and I have five children with whose tutors I always had an excellent relationship. They did their job and I did mine and ne'er the twain (shall) did meet.

If it makes you feel any better I got similar feedback from an ‘interview’ at my current school. Less than a year later I got a job on supply, and I’m still there nearly 10 years on!

I think it's a bit unfair to effectively blame the TAs.
Working with a Year 2 class in a nice school, and with two TAs present, should surely be a relatively cushy gig.

A surprisingly large number of TAs are qualified teachers but have decided to take the hit of a lower salary and lower status to have a better work life balance.