To not want a cleaner

[123cupcake4]

Ok so maybe I am being unreasonable and I think my childhood has effected my thinking.

I grew up with a mum who has M.e. She didn't do anything unless it suited her. She wouldnt get her medication sorted as she liked being up all nigth alone and sleeping all day. I was a child carer. She had 2 children 8 years and 14 years younger than me and married 3 times in total. We had her friend do the cleaning and I would do most child care and suffered a lot of emotional and mental abuse from her latest husband. She wouldn't even take us to school. Someone else was always roped into it. I would understand if she tried and had good days but it got to the point that she felt very entitled that she didn't have to do anything.

Anyway, its got to the point where I literally can't accept help from anyone. I am constantly doing things for other people. I help my SIL with most life admin as she is not an English speaker and is divorced with 4 kids. Her ex dh just disappeared. I work from home for my dhs business. And he works on site and works very long hours. We also have 4 kids aged 9 to 3

Dh has decided we need a cleaner. My house isn't spotless. I am sometimes behind on house work but it's OK. The washing is done, clothes are washed. I cook. I jave already agreed to outsourcing ironing abd that was a lot for me!

He has found a very nice lady to come and 'help me with organising the house and keeping on top of it and ironing. But I feel like a failure and I know he is trying to help because we are both so busy abd he's trying to take the pressure off. But my home is my sanctuary. I work here, live here, relax here. I don't want someone going through our things.

He doesn't get it. He's a boss so used to deligating but I feel like I have failed and am lazy and I really can't ask someone for help.

I know aibu. I can't do it all. And he has high standards but doesn't have time to keep on top of it and this is a reasonable solution.

But then with 4 kids it never stays tidy for long anyway! So Wednesday and Thursday she will come. Which means I have to panic tidy before she comes and I just don't want to.

Not sure what to do really!

You don't have to have a cleaner.

If you don't want one, just don't do it

It's not for everyone to have someone do this sort of work for you.

It’s ok to not want a cleaner but you should try reframing it in your head: she’s not helping you - you’re paying her to do a job. She’d be helping if it was unpaid like you help your in-laws; she’s paid so she’s employed.

Thank you both. The silly thing is I know this. And if it was someone else I would say that it was a good thing. But I have many issues I think! It makes me feel very anxious and physically sick when I do need to ask someone for help. I have always been the help and I feel guilty when I do need help if that makes sense. Which I know is silly. And if someone else was saying this I would say accept the help. I know all this but it doesn't change how u feel if you see what I mean

Op could you give it a trial run to see how you feel? It will probably feel a little strange at first having someone in the house cleaning your things, I suspect that you’d get used to it pretty quickly though and may end up being grateful for it. I wouldn’t do a massive clean beforehand, I’d just make sure there’s nothing particularly gross for them to see (would check toilets for skid marks etc). If you really can’t bare someone in your house then at least you can tell your oh you tried

Have you had any therapy for your childhood issues? It sounds awful and no wonder you have carried some of it through to present day.

As for the cleaning, you could try to reframe it that housework is the responsibility of both of you - not just you - and that your husband is offering to pay someone to do his share.

I'm a bit like this. I don't always keep on top of the housework, but it's still my home and my sanctuary from the world. I hate having people 'help' me and when I had a cleaner it felt like I had to clean for them anyway and couldn't relax in my own home. It also feels like a failure to me to not be able to do it myself. I'm working class and have cleaned as a job myself, So I really struggle with being in the employer/employee type role. When I had a cleaner I ended up asking her to come in and sit down and have a cuppa before she got started, then apologised for her mess, then tried to help her. Yes I'm a nightmare I know! The worst kind of client. So I would never have a cleaner again for that reason and also that it feels like an invasion of privacy. For me there is a lot of Shame tied up in not being able to keep a better home. I have chronic health issues which I try my best to hide, and often I can seem chatty, upbeat and energetic in my work and socially, but when I come home I need to be able to just veg out. I need to know when I leave the house in the morning in a rush with neurodiverse kids that nobodies going to see the dishes in the sink or the dirty kecks on the floor or that I didn't let the bath water out. That enables me to prioritise getting to school on time and all the other things I achieve with my life. All the wonderful things I am as well as a sub par housewife.

A cleaner should be a choice, not something that becomes mandatory just because you struggle to keep a certain standard. If your house is habitable and hygienic but just a bit cluttered and dusty, so what? Some of us really need to protect having a place where we can feel ourselves without having to mask or self correct or people please.

Thanks all. @Evilista I really connected to this. Minus the health issues. Well done to you though! It really isn't easy and like you said it's my sanctuary. Apart from the school run I am here. And quite content with the clutter. I did a big huge clean the other day so it isn't as bad as it has been. The thing is the kids are chaotic and make a lot of mess! Not dirt just crap everywhere. So I will need to scurry around and put it all away so she can do her job. But my job means I don't always have time to do that. There isn't a schedule for my work.

But I will give it a go. I'm secretly hoping she's not very good so I have a reason not to have her come. She's really nice too which makes it harder!

@FetchezLaVache I had some as a child because my mum decided her second husband leaving her was traumatising for me.... it wasn't. The traumatising part was making me baby sit her because she couldn't be left alone. So at 11 years old she made me sleep in her bed with her and would watch rated 18 horror movies. I was upset that I had lost a second dad. But certainly didn't need counselling for it. I needed it for other issues. But that's what we where instructed to tall about whilst playing with some sand. I hated it so much and it put me off doing it again as an adult. I have considered it but I'm waiting until my youngest is in school so i have time. Really next year September she will be in school and life will hopefully be a little less chaotic!

I was very nervous about getting a cleaner - a bit like you feeling of not being able to cope. The thought of people seeing my clutter I dreaded.

i agreed and so glad I did - I found the right person who does exactly what I need - bathrooms, hoover /mop floors and make up the beds. (I strip then) I now couldn’t be without her! It’s made such a difference but I had the find the right person!!

Do you have decorators in or DIY?
Do you pay an electrician if you need electrical work?
What about bread - do you bake your own or pay someone else to?
It's not about failure it's about using the money you have to make life better.

Give it a try.
Be very clear what you want doing. If you don't want her to do a room you are in say so. It's true it's worth having a tidy before they come as otherwise they are tidying and not cleaning.
Once you have a sparkling clean house that you haven't lifted a finger for you will never regret it.

& all this, Cupcake, is why it's high time you accept help - not just this example of practical help - but maybe some help for the difficult feelings you have to manage around accepting it!

Given your early background, any reasonable person would say it's YOUR turn to get some much-needed help. I completely understand the reasons behind your resistance. Have you ever had therapy to process these complicated feelings & come to terms with them?

Finally - it's DH's home too. You both work, so why do you describe yourself as "helping" with his business? You WORK in the business.
On the same tack - why do you & DH feel he is "helping" YOU with the house by suggesting a cleaner - as if responsibility for housework belongs solely to you?
You are both busy with the business, you both live in the house, DH's suggestion is logical & practical.
And a cleaner needn't 'go through your things'. You can be as directive as you wish: sure, you will have a frenzy of clearing & tidying, but that will simply galvanise you work out a schedule. If you then direct the cleaner to perform specific tasks, you can focus her on dealing with the fabric of the house such as floors & windows, & cleaning all surfaces - nobody needs to be handling your things.

Of course you can decide not to employ a cleaner if that's your ultimate choice.
But - & I mean this very gently & kindly - NOT getting one is kinda cutting off your nose to spite your face. It would be so nice if you were able to STOP paying the price for the ... unusual childhood you went through, now you are an adult.
Why should you keep punishing yourself for the failing of the adults around you at that time? I genuinely feel for you - therapy for a self-referred adult can take any form she chooses, & I promise nobody will make you play with sand! - as an adult, you can shop around until you find a therapist with a form of practice that works for you. Somebody experienced with childhood trauma, & how that has informed where you are at now - which is a place where you are yet again over-burdened with responsibilities ... but unable to accept the help that you very definitely deserve.

Thank you all. Yes I know you are all right. She starts Thursday. I got my days muddled up. So I have today and tomorrow to organise a bit. Thanks all

YANBU & it’s not silly.It’s the hangover from having to shoulder massive responsibilities in caring for your mum & step siblings at such a young age. If you didn’t do it then what would have happened to your mum or your step siblings?? The consequences for you not caring & being the help would have been huge & very anxiety provoking - so it’s no wonder you feel the way do when you’re required to drop that role & be the one being helped. I bet this is really common in adults who’ve had caring responsibilities as children.

Maybe any literature on this from any support organisations (I only really know of Young Carers) could help? To see how others have coped with the fallout that I would think would only be too common from being placed in such a difficult role as a child & young person.

A lot of people don’t like people coming into their homes in that way however regardless & find it really stressful. Not to mention the panic cleaning beforehand!
You never know though - over time you might start to actually feel the benefit of having less on your plate & that walking into a sparkling clean house is really very nice. Fingers crossed 🤞

Yes you are all right. I'm going to give it ago. Unfortunately I've had my fair share of bad luck since childhood and what I have described is just a small part. I always insisted that my child hood hasn't effected me. And I pretend to hasn't. But the thing is I think about it a lot. And it's doing my kids a disservice as I do everything for them , they are becoming lazy. They will do as they are told and will tidy up when asked but they won't do anything themselves. More the 9 year old. Dh is also of a culture where men don't do housework and I can see my 9 year old is following suit. So I am trying to give him chores etc but it hasn't sunk in. But I'm working on it. My 7 year old son is quite helpful when asked. The younger 2 are girls and I'm quite aware that I don't want them being expected to help because they are girls. So I'm really thinking about how to get them all doing doing appropriate chores! I'm a bit of a mess I think. Although I wouldn't admit it! They all do well at school and they get on well and are nice and good kids I have been very lucky on that front! Just very messy!

Book some counselling. I'm sure it will help.

I always insisted that my child hood hasn't effected me. And I pretend to hasn't. But the thing is I think about it a lot.

Of course you were, & of course you do.
You had to be a coper, at a young age, & that has bled through into your adult life.
Old proverb - When a typhoon hits, & you need to grab something to hold on to to stop being blown away, what do you choose - oak or bamboo?
Most people instinctively choose oak - it looks bigger, stronger, more rooted.
But in a storm - oak will break.
Bamboo bends, lies flat, & when the storm has passed, rights itself again.
Your strength was forged in the typhoon of your childhood. You had to be an oak for your mother, & you are still using oak strength now. You will break - or at least some branches will snap! - if you carry on demanding this of yourself.
It's your time to be the bamboo. Bend to getting help from the cleaner, so your strength can be directed elsewhere. As a priority, that includes yourself - & some therapy.

Take this hiring of a cleaner as a watershed moment for you.
As to the gendered role stuff playing out within your family unit - I'd be very tempted to hire a male cleaner
Not actually joking, but it seems that you have one in place now as she's coming soon?
Also, there'll be plenty of jobs left to allocate to your DC as you see fit. You are right, it is toxic for them to witness you doing everything & assuming all the drudgery is WomansWork ...
Make sure the new cleaner suits you & you feel you can set up a positive & easy relationship with her. If not - you can chop & change. This is within your remit, you are the boss. The same goes for when you explore getting a therapist. You shop around, & you stick with the one you feel you can open up to, who is not afraid to challenge you, & who has a LOT of experience of helping people with childhood wounds that need healing.

As others have said, I think reframing your thinking will help enormously. It's not 'help', it's a professional providing a paid service. The same as paying Hovis to make bread for you, or Tesco to make that bread available to buy. They aren't 'helping' you any more than the cleaner will be.
You may find it'll help with the clichéd gender roles you don't want the kids to fall in to too. This way they'll see that dad AND mum work but crucially mum doesn't have an entire other job on top, of cleaning the house. And the routine of a cleaner coming once a week might help get them into more of a routine with tidying too. 'Right kids, Jane's here tomorrow so floors and surfaces in your rooms need to be tidied for her to do her job.'
And I say this all with love as someone who also hates asking for help! This is not doing that though.

Thank you. Yes Pinkart that's a good way to frame it! And I will definitley do that! I will get them to tidy their rooms the night before and their play room. As it's just toys and colouring things everywhere. I'm sick of tidying it! It's my fault for not instilling the tidy away before you play but it's done now! Better late than never!

Why not ask the cleaner to change all the beds , put the bed linen in the wash. Clean out the fridge, put the rubbish out, wash the bins out and reline them.
Clean the bathrooms .
Start with some extra jobs to help and then you will Have more time to generally clean and organise the hose yourself.
It depends how big your house is but I doubt a cleaner will have time to do the whole house straight away.

So cleaner came today. She is nice. I asked her to clean 2 bathrooms and hoover my bedroom and she gave the kitchen a quick clean. Our place wasn't filthy but it tool her 5.5 hours. Is that a normal amount of time?

It wasn't as good as I was hoping. She missed a few cupboard doors. I am very happy with our shower as I couldn't get some lime scale off and she did. But honestly doesn't look a lot different to when I do it I half the Time. I'm going to let her come for a few weeks and see if it actually makes a difference or not. She used a lot of bleech too! House stinks of it and it's made me feel quite sick.

I managed to get 2 full days in nursery for my youngest in September so I will have time then. So I will see i might keep it up until then and then I can do it myself.

Or maybe I'm looking for excuses to not have one...?

Ask her to not use bleach next time, as it makes you feel sick.

It is hard to have some stranger in your home, I agree. But it's a good opportunity to feel through the uncomfortability in asking for, or getting help - and this is paid help, she's no doing you a favour from others, and also a good opportunity to ask for what you want and speak up about what you don't want, which is also rather hard to do if your own needs were secondary/ignored as a child.

Good for you. Well that gives you plenty time to see how it goes & if doesn’t help you in any tangible way, there’s no point continuing just for the sake of it. It might sound frivolous but you could always spend the money/time on your own self care instead! Like treating yourself to a decent massage once a week or reflexology or exercise or whatever makes you feel good. Because if talking therapy isn’t right for you atm then maybe looking after your own self & wellbeing maybe just as beneficial to help you recharge & rebalance. Depends how easy you find giving yourself time to kind of nurture yourself & give yourself a break/boost that way? Just a thought.

Thank you. Yes we will see how it goes. I don't think it's worth it after the summer hidays though! But I'm glad I did it for now. Thanks all

😂😂😂 Love how you are able to poke fun at yourself cupcake.

maybe you are! ... so give yourself time to let this 'bed in' & also to get into a routine that suits you & is genuinely helpful to you.
No need to look ahead to taking it back again in the summer hols. Maybe you could spend that time on YOU, or on family time instead. No need to decide now, either way.

I'm so glad she's nice - that's half your battle. Remember - this isn't just about the housework, it's about you rewiring your lovely plastic brain to stop giving you such a hard time.
reset.me/story/neuroplasticity-the-10-fundamentals-of-rewiring-your-brain/