Please or to access all these features

Add post

Watch this thread

Save thread

Start a new thread

Flip thread

Hide thread

My feed

Active Unanswered threads

Getting started FAQ's

Unanswered threads Acronyms Talk guidelines

Hide shortcut buttons

Talk

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Flip

1 2 3 4 5

Original poster

Bus lane fine! With pics.

125 replies

SunnyPineapple · 08/05/2022 14:35

I just received a fine for going in this bus lane but think I should try to appeal it retrospectively ( DH says I can’t, as the leasing company have already paid it).

I was indicating left to get in lane to take the left turn, when a car undertook me meaning I had nowhere to go. My choices were:
A Stop dead well before the traffic lights and wait for him to pass
B carry on changing lane, across his path and hope he stopped
C Hold my path for a split second longer and move in behind him.

I chose C and clearly entered the bus lane for a second.

AIBU to think that this bus lane set is grossly unfair and maybe even unlawful because:
1 The lane for left turns only exists from the bus stop bay onwards ( there is no lane before the bus stop, it’s just a bay - you can see the bus stop markings in one of the pics). So drivers have a very short distance of a few meters to get in lane.
2 Surely bus lanes aren’t allowed to suddenly appear forcing motorists to change lane just before a set of lights.
3 The blue sign on the roadside seems to contradict the road markings ( the sign implies you can’t be in the left turn lane yet the road markings suggest the opposite!)

So AIBU? WWYD?

OP posts:

Flyonthewall01 · 08/05/2022 20:18

What I don’t understand is why you think stopping in that lane would be dangerous as it’s a fast road. It leads to a bus lane so everyone behind you would be moving into the left or right lanes. No one would be going fast behind you

lancsgirl85 · 08/05/2022 20:23

Flyonthewall01 · 08/05/2022 20:18

Good point. Unless there was a bus behind you, you'd know people were going to have to move lanes too.

PinkPanther50 · 08/05/2022 20:49

Are you saying that there were no earlier signs that your lane was going to turn into a bus lane other than the blue sign in your photo? If so then I can see your confusion but if there were earlier signs then you should have been ready to move left. You are allowed to drive over a bus stop painted on the road so you were being hesitant by not moving left earlier, hence the other driver undertook you. In fact if you knew you were turning left you should have been ready anyway. Maybe just accept and move on

Soontobe60 · 08/05/2022 21:16

SunnyPineapple · 08/05/2022 18:01

@lancsgirl85 I’ve checked a scale map. ..the bus stop bay is 85m from the traffic lights (less to the start of bus lane). At a speed of 30 miles an hour I’d have had less than 5 seconds to change lane. Because he nipped around me, he was parallel with me during the time I was trying to move across. I think that (A) no one believes me about the other driver being cheeky and (B ) people think the distance/ time for the lane change was greater than it is.

85 metres is quite a distance. Also, if you were turning left, I very much doubt you’d have been doing 30 mph.
The driver who was in the correct lane for turning left wasn’t in the wrong nor were they being cheeky. They were driving correctly.

Soontobe60 · 08/05/2022 21:21

Pawtriarchal · 08/05/2022 18:43

I disagree. Before moving over you need to check it’s safe to do so. In that moment, if a car is coming up behind and alongside you quickly, your judgement may be that it’s safer not to move over. This is more likely in an unfamiliar layout that doesn’t allow you time to make the decision. Shits and giggles aside, there are plenty of mistakes made with suboptimal road layouts.

Show quote history

Did you look at the OPs diagram? There are 2 lanes in the approach to the junction. To turn left, drivers need to stay in the LH lane on the approach. OP says she indicated left, but didn’t actually stay in the LH lane. If one approaches the junction to turn left correctly, then there would be no room for another car to come up alongside you on the inside, because that’s where your car would be.

StupidUsernameUnavailable · 08/05/2022 21:26

@SunnyPineapple

That looks very much like Lewes Road, just before Coldean Lane?? You can appeal but you won't get it I'm afraid. Take it from someone with pretty much the same circumstances who didn't win 😒

Brighton and Hove Council are arseholes!

StupidUsernameUnavailable · 08/05/2022 21:28

....and the road lay out is shit!!

Pawtriarchal · 08/05/2022 21:34

If it’s Lewes Road in Brighton then there’s been quite a bit of press about the camera situation.

Original poster

SunnyPineapple · 08/05/2022 22:29

Ha yes, it is Lewes Road in Brighton. I lived in Brighton for decades but moved out of town a while ago so was caught out by the creative ‘new’ layout.

OP posts:

jcyclops · 09/05/2022 00:46

This picture is taken a little earlier on the road. Note that here the bus lane is the left hand lane of two. Other traffic should all be in the outside lane. I have ringed the bus lane camera which points towards the viewer and would catch vehicles driving in the left hand lane near the two diamonds painted on the road. I wonder if OP was caught in the left hand lane too early at this point, rather than near the lights where the bus lane resumes (which does not appear to be covered by a camera).

StupidUsernameUnavailable · 09/05/2022 05:59

@SunnyPineapple

You want to go down by the Pavilion/down towards the King & Queen. Absolutely ridiculous. You can't drive down there anymore and apart from a "Road layout changed ahead" sign, you don't know that you can't go down there until you actually are down there.

There were so many appeals which were all turned down with the "There has been lots of publicity in the local press" not everyone buys the Evening Argus!!!! 😡 They have completely ballsed it up!

Soontobe60 · 09/05/2022 06:13

Having had a look at the street view images of that junction, a bus lane doesn’t suddenly appear. There’s a bus and cycle lane all along that stretch of road, well before the junction. It’s a single lane for all cars that becomes 2 then 3 lanes before the bus stop. A sign clearly shows to turn left or go straight ahead, again well before the bus stop. My only concern is that any cyclists using that stretch of road and wanting to go straight on seem to be in danger of being hit by cars wanting to turn left at the junction!

balalake · 09/05/2022 07:20

I think you should have done A and reported the car driver to the police. The leasing company should not be paying fines at all.

Appeal and see what happens. The undertaking car driver may be visible on the camera, so perhaps can receive justice.

Original poster

SunnyPineapple · 09/05/2022 07:24

@jcyclops but that would mean that I invented the story about the other driver undertaking!! I also think your photo highlights the confusing layout. See my point below, to @Soontobe60.

@Soontobe60 your photo just makes it even easier to see how motorists can get caught you. You evidently have to cross the bus lane in order to change lane , but only
between two arbitrary points, regardless of whether it’s safe / clear to do so.

@StupidUsernameUnavailable i know, it’s actually dangerous, especially the other side of the level which used to be one way but now is two way!! (By Salis Beney theatre, I think)

OP posts:

Original poster

SunnyPineapple · 09/05/2022 07:30

@balalake thank you, i think the other drive was incredibly rude and caused me difficulties but I’m not sure they committed an offence (a bit like someone refusing to let you in from a slip road) Maybe that is illegal, I’d have to check!

OP posts:

LittleScottieDog · 09/05/2022 07:53

Thank you to those who identified the road. Much easier to see what's going on.

OP, the lane you were in is a bus lane. However, cars are allowed to cross it to access to left-hand lane for turning. The broken white lines show that the bus line hasn't finished. Presumably you were in the right-hand lane approaching, as the left is a bus lane, and when signalling to move left you only moved over into the bus lane, you didn't cut right across the bus lane into the left-hand car lane. Therefore the camera has not seen you crossing the bus lane, but travelling within it for an extended period of time.

So YABU and should have moved directly over, not dithered in the bus lane.

I'd be interested to see what the photo shows.

Original poster

SunnyPineapple · 09/05/2022 07:58

@LittleScottieDog the first bit of your post may indeed be true but how was I ‘dithering’ if the other driver who undertook and wouldn’t let me in was parallel with me the whole time I planned to move across?!? That’s not dithering, it’s avoiding an accident!

OP posts:

LittleScottieDog · 09/05/2022 08:04

There should have never been a moment when someone had the space and time to pull out from the lane to your right, go behind you, and pull parallel with you on the left, while you were in the bus lane.

Previous posters are correct that had you moved left straightaway, there would have been no room for anyone to move any further left of you.

Original poster

SunnyPineapple · 09/05/2022 08:11

@LittleScottieDog how utterly ridiculous. Imagine being on a motorway and unless you change lane in the very first second after a sign for a left turn appears, and another motorist changed lane fractionally more quickly than you, then you end up getting a fine. My driving was perfectly safe. Changing lanes shouldn’t be a race!

The road layout is designed in a way that catches people out unfairly.

OP posts:

LittleScottieDog · 09/05/2022 08:20

The point is that you're allowed to cross the bus lane, not drive within it. You should have treated it as though the bus lane wasn't even there and moved from the right to left as you would normally. If you were in one lane and another appeared for the left-hand turn, with no bus lane between, if you didn't move over straightaway then other people would and then you'd be left in the right-hand lane.

Except you weren't in the right-hand lane, you were in a bus lane which allows you to cross but not travel along it. Which you did do.

It gives you decent space to cross because if there's a bus at the bus stop then you'd cross over into the left-hand lane a little further ahead. But that doesn't mean you can drive along the bus lane. It's still a bus lane.

Pashazade · 09/05/2022 12:13

Honestly OP I feel for you, that section of road is awful to navigate and if you've been out of area for a while then it's even worse. As a pp said I don't think you'll win an appeal, there are many very unhappy people getting stung for bus lane infractions in B&H these days. I too made the error of having to do the one way system and then discovering that you can't go across in front of the King and Queen anymore, nightmare!

bridgetreilly · 09/05/2022 12:21

I’m afraid, whatever you think of the layout, you were in the bus lane and it won’t have any impact on the fine. If you think it’s a poor layout you can write to the relevant council to ask that it be changed.

TruffleShuffles · 09/05/2022 12:41

I really can’t see what the other driver did wrong, he presumably just moved into the bus lane as soon as the broken line started and continued straight into the left turn lane and as you didn’t he presumed you were carrying straight on. There is as no need for you to be driving straight in the bus lane at all, you should have just cut across when the solid line ended.

Original poster

SunnyPineapple · 09/05/2022 15:42

@Pashazade it's bonkers in Brighton these days, isn’t it!

OP posts:

Concestor · 10/05/2022 22:18

SunnyPineapple · 09/05/2022 15:42

@Pashazade it's bonkers in Brighton these days, isn’t it!

I was in Brighton today and driving round it was a total nightmare! I'm happy to drive in central London but Brighton was terrible, signage and lanes was atrocious

Flip

1 2 3 4 5