To WFH while on holiday abroad so I don’t use up holiday entitlement?

[RaspberryFarfait]

We have already have a big holiday booked this year and DH also wants to spend a month in his home country with his parents during the summer holidays.

He doesn’t WFH, so will use all holiday entitlement, but I do. Colleague is also on leave for some of that time so I wouldn’t normally be able to be off as need to cover.

WIBU to not book holiday, travel over there and work as normal, without telling work. I only work part time and it’s certainly doable.

Only problem is will I be able to log in remotely from abroad? Has anyone done this?

Don’t want to ask work yet as they’ll cotton on!

@Oblomov22

www.oecd.org/ctp/treaties/articles-model-tax-convention-2017.pdf

Model tax treaty which the majority of double tax treaties currently in force are based on, articles 5 and 7 are the relevant ones to
consider for corporation tax in this situation.

Do you have any links backing up
your stance that there are no tax implications to consider?

We are now allowed to work internationally as for tax reasons it can create problems if your organisation is 'working' in a country for which there is no legal standing and could raise risk of them being due tax in that country.

I don’t see any issues, just ask. I have been doing this for a few years. Gone to my home country (one hour difference but worked UK timezones), worked mornings and spent afternoons with DC.
make sure you tell your manager you are willing to work your UK working and that you have stable and safe internet connection. Certainly no tax liabilities unless you are planning to stay for months!!

We've been expressly told we can't work abroad because of tax reasons. We can work from anywhere on the U.K., but not abroad.
Your employer will be able to tell you're not in U.K., if they check because they get suspicious about something. They might not mind though.

Our daughter went to Sri Lanka over Christmas and NY and tagged on 2 weeks wfh whilst over there. She took surfing lessons in the morning and worked afternoons and evenings which worked well with the time difference. But, she got the ok from her boss before she did this. I think if you did it without telling them you would put yourself at risk of disciplinary action.

Nothing I have said is rubbish if you are a uk passport holder you cannot work in the EU without a visa, I agree a lot of the tax issues being spoken about are inconsequential

It IS definitely 'their business', @BrightonBunny.

You're showing an immense lack of employment knowledge there.

Whether they are ok about it is a different matter, but it's absolutely something that needs to be clarified in general.

You could fall foul of regulations in the country. I know it's not France, but in France for it to be legal your employer would have to set up a French subsid and would be liable for French social charges. Thé last few years they've been 70-100% for employers and well over 20% for employees.

Could be a complete minefield.

I'm a chartered tax advisor and this is my job, advising companies on their remote working policies. There are many many issues to consider, and I usually get paid a fortune for my advice but in summary there are 4 main areas to consider.

1. Corporation tax and creating an overseas corporate taxable presence for your employer by virtue of your work. This depends on the cou try you go to and whther they have a double tax treaty with the UK.

1. Personal tax for you the employee. Again depends on the country and 1 month often fine but you need to check the specifics of the country yiu are.going to.

1. Insurance. Your employer has a duty of care to you and their insurance will not cover you if you have an accident while working outside the UK. Your travel insurance is not business insurance so also wouldn't cover things like if you got mugged and your work laptop stolen.

1. Right to work. You cannot work while travelling on a tourist visa. If you get founf out you could be deported or banned from entering the country in future. Obviously it depends which country you're going to and your citizenship but assuming you are a UK citizen then your need a work visa for most European countries now.

Apologies for typos, 1 handed angry typing while DC mess around instead of brush their teeth!

I would definitely not do this without asking the employer. However, they might be fine with it. I know people in my work who've done similar. But you do have to tell the employer and I think describe your setup (e.g. whose internet connection you're using, what country you're in, can anyone physically see your screen while you're working, etc). Some countries you can't work from because their internet systems won't work with my company's security processes - off the top of my head, I think China is one of them, for instance.

So I'd ask, and see what they say. But I definitely wouldn't do it without asking - I'd say that could be grounds for dismissal if you were unlucky.

Specifically with regard to the EU, issues such as 90 days in 180 is not a factor in having the right to work. Sadly unless the individual has a business Visa or is indulging in a permitted business activity (see below) ATM most Brits don't have the right to arrive in the EU and start working, at all, not even for just one day:

www.kingsleynapley.co.uk/services/department/immigration/british-citizens-travelling-to-the-eu-for-business-what-employers-need-to-know

item #6 is possibly relevant to this debate..

Prior to Brexit "British citizens were able to travel on the basis of free movement throughout the EU and so it was not necessary to distinguish between what was business visitor activity and work. Care now needs to be taken to ensure that where a British citizen is entering the EU without a prior visa, they are only carrying out permitted business visitor activity...."

The article then lists typically permitted business activities - as has been mentioned upthread it's generally short term transient activities and exact details vary country by country.

Most countries outside the EU have similar rules...and yes I know how it often works in reality.

@Festivecheer26

"1. This Convention shall apply to persons who are residents of one or both of the Contracting States. "

How is that relevant to OP?

I'm going back to my home country next week. Have some sessions that I cant miss on Friday but there online so I'll just log in remotely from Ireland.
Have done it a few times, no problem

If your worried about logging in you can get a vpn

@Howmuchwood, as an expert has dispelled a lot of the nonsense written by previous posters.

"Your working illegally in Spain without a visa" @hellesbells , no I'm not!! I'm Spanish.

"Your working illegally in Spain without a visa" @hellesbells , no I'm not!! I'm Spanish.

Oh this is the best ever.
"I'm a Canadian". Aka best comment on MN, Ever.

Our employers say we cannot work from abroad due to tax implications. Work for a big housing association.

You would need to let work know as you may not be covered by their insurance or any other issues there may be.

As in your equipment laptop etc. I know in my company there were a few that requested this and it all had to go throughHR to agree.

You really need to tell work. It can be complicated legally if you access any data as part of your role, especially customer data. Let them assess it and let you know

I would ask at work to see how they would feel about one week abroad first. A month seems like a long time. Ask about the policy and see how it goes, but I wouldn’t mention a month in the fist conversation. Good luck.

Good luck - I would definitely broach the subject with work.

I'm also working for an NHS partner and have a member of my team from another European country. Every three months she goes home for a week and will partly work from there and partly take annual leave for her flights and things she has planned with family.

It works really well for us. She does the exact same job to the exact same standards whether she is doing it from 2 miles down the road or from her home country!

I work for a global corporate and we are allowed to work abroad for up to 30 days per year

@Oblomov22 the contracting states are the two jurisdictions the tax treaty is agreed between, so in this case the UK and the jurisdiction OP is travelling to. Assuming the OP works for a company that is UK tax resident, then then the tax treaty between the UK and the country OP is going to applies to her employing company. That company may suffer tax consequences under the relevant tax treaty (and indeed the domestic tax law of the country she’s travelling to). This what @Howmuchwood refers to in point 1 of their post.

To manage the tax risk created by employees working in other jurisdictions (and no doubt for other reasons too) many companies include clauses in employment contracts stating work can only be performed in the UK or have remote working policies stating that there can be no remote working abroad/ up to a maximum of X days worked abroad in a country where the employer already has an office, such as one other poster mentioned. So the relevance for the OP here is that she could find herself in breach of her employment contract or an internal policy if she decides to work whilst abroad without permission.

If you have any materials disproving this then please do share the links.