To wonder why so many people are hypocrites when it comes to housing?

[WestminsterCrabby]

Got into quite a heated row discussion last night with some relatives. 🍷

They are Fuming (capital F intended) about all the new housing estates popping up in their leafy village. Apparently its ruined the views, ruined their dog walks yaddah yaddah.

These are couples in their late 50s early 60s whose children are long gone but still live in their large 4 bed detached homes. When I pointed out that perhaps so many new homes wouldnt need to be built (or smaller ones that took up less space) if people only took up the amount of space they needed rather than felt entitled to, they thought I was being very very unreasonable. I disagree!

I appreciate that people living in houses bigger than there needs is not the cause of the housing shortage HOWEVER surely you cant complain about other people needing to be housed while you yourself have 2 bedrooms per person?!?

Drives me mad and it's not the first time I've had conversations like this with people in a similar circumstances.

It makes me sad to see the countryside being converted over as well but people have got to live somewhere.

Aibu here?

I do think people have to accept that homes have to be built somewhere. I notice everyone locally seems to object every time anyone proposes building any homes. Currently there's a proposal to change an empty old building on the high street to taller flats and everyone's objecting even though I really can't see it having any negative impact on the area.

I was one of the few people of my street not to object to a new block of flats two doors down. People were mostly worried about the parking (already bad on our street) but the fact was, it was built on the site of two unused garages and a shabby little office behind the shops and created an unwatched corner where people constantly flytipped furniture etc. Honestly, I thought a block of flats would be a nicer start to the road, and reduce the flytipping - which has proved to be the case.

I fully expect that before we leave this house, the shop backs opposite us will also be redeveloped as flats and I'm prepared to accept that - again, the shop backs get a lot of flytipping (as one is a charity shop where people unhelpfully dump stuff out back) and again, flats would actually be nicer for the street as a whole.

We also have lots of hmos being built. Now, I could be wrong, but they mainly seem to be full of single men, or perhaps it's just that women don't tend to roam around as much, or stand drinking outside the 9 room hmo on the high street. I'm wondering where the balance is.

Agreed. I get so fed up with people deciding what others 'need' or don't 'need'. Whether it's spare rooms, benefits, pairs of shoes - all of us have things we don't 'need' unless we live on the streets.

There isn't a choice between more housing and building in the countryside or more housing and people having to live with the minimum number of rooms that you've decreed they can have.
The countryside is under-developed, under-resourced and has less infrastructure. New housing estates should be built where people work, where the infrastructure is available and easy to upscale.
The housing shortage isn't caused by your friends. It's caused by successive governments failing to prioritise housing; an inadequate and inconsistent planning system and in major cities, LAs opting for enticing corporates rather than creating sustainable housing and living environments. But obviously people would rather bitch at their neighbours than vote to change any of that. 🙄

Oh yes of course, isn't it us that ruined the planet with our glass bottles going back to the shop for a deposit. Our glass milk bottles on the doorstep. All those disposal nappies that didn't go to land fill cos they weren't invented.The one car or no car family. The schoolrun that we walked. The clothes that became hand me downs rather than the cheap tat from China made by slaves.
Yes it was us!!
Waiting to have my arse handed to me 🤣🤣🤣

I think you’ve hit the nail on the head with this. Otherwise we are just complaining at each other about the consequences rather than the problem.

yanbu

I have 3 bedrooms and only use 2 of them, the house is bigger than I need - but I like it
On the other hand I am surrounded by suburbia and more housing is going to take place - 2000 new homes just been built in the last 3 years, another 200 down the lane. Its the way of the world though people need to live somewhere.

My objection is lack of infastructor for anything other than motorcars, which will mean the pollution rates will rise and congestion of cars will be unbelievable, making getting anywhere slower even for buses and bikes

@YetAnotherSpartacus

you and me both. I’m in a 3 bed terrace, currently with my son. I’m not going anywhere if I can help it.
I’m ‘entitled’ to live here because its mine, I bought it, I’ve worked for it, mortgage in fact paid off this week.
I’ve lived here for 20 years, this is where my life is, I’m involved in the community and have an allotment. Why on earth should I incur the significant costs of moving to a shoebox where I have no connections and no life.

Yep, and it's disgusting.
If it was any any other group of people it would be called out but if a thread is bashing the elderly it's fair game and gets a pass on here.

Well men are regularly bashed on here so not sure that's true.

The housing market is very different in the UK compared to the rest of Europe. Its just covered in housing estates. Everywhere. Mass built housing estates built by developers stuck onto the end of villages/towns a bit like an abscess. People generally don't want to live in terraced housing or flats so YANBU.

I'm still not liking the cramped houses in urban centres that get built with small gardens. Why are we not building houses like in the 60s with decent sized gardens? As stated personally I would rather have less people in the UK than build more homes. But unfortunately the young vote for pro immigration parties even when we have a housing shortage.

Everywhere where there is a house, there was once not a house.

To clarify it doesn't bother me that they have a big house. It's a free country. It just bothers me that they try and argue that other families shouldn't be able to live in the same nice area with nice facilities etc. Like it should be 'exclusive' to them and their friends or something 🙄

I agree on the need for 2 bedroom bungalows.
I also think there should be a restriction on converting them into larger, 2 storey houses after they are sold, as this further reduces the stock of housing suitable for older and disabled people.

Hmmm, i see what you're saying but I agree there isn't enough provision for the stage after the 4 bed home. My parents are only early 60s but would be willing to move to a bungalow now having seen their parents struggle with mobility in later life. Bungalows here are in very short supply and often need a complete refurb, which they've already done on every house they've had and not interested in doing again. A new build bungalow with a decent garden would really appeal to them, freeing up a three bed semi.

@Fishwishy you are going on about immigration- and young people being pro immigration- presumably then you are a Tory and will not have issues with the large amounts of Indian immigration that's likely to replace mainly European singles and couples who have returned. Immigration is not the cause of people moaning about the over 60s remaining in big houses- but never let fact get in the way of bashing younger people. (And I'm 60)

@Fishwishy three times since 12 you have posted about anti immigration parties.... who are they? And all immigrants? Ukrainians? Or just the ones trying not to drown on the way over in small boats? And benefits are capped now with regard to how many children you can claim for.

We have a housing shortage..... a lack of affordable housing..... I despise unpleasant posts like yours with an undercurrent.

Your relatives are NIMBY's

Any discussion of housing and development on MN always ends with young people, who justifiably feel their options are circumscribed, blaming people who have simply had longer to organise their lives to their liking. And shortly behind them, the Stasi who know how many sq ft per person should be allocated at every stage of life, and wade in to berate those who dare defy their judgement by buying what they want and having the temerity to go on living there until it no longer serves their interests.

The population of the UK is too large. Developers build the properties they profit most from in lieu of what's actually needed, and politicians are in thrall to their benefactors. Planners are not insisting that new builds are constructed for energy efficiency, and too many place an insufferable burden on local facilities, from roads and transport to schools to medical provision and amentities.

All the usual tropes most of them true have been trotted out here. Holiday homes and AirBnB accommodation in scenic areas, overseas investors seeking a safe home to park their capital, and probably some I have missed, but there really isn't an easy answer. If there was, we'd have found it.

Erm... so once my children leave home, I'm no longer entitled to have friends over to my house either?

My parents retired and moved to a detached three bed and then converted the garage.
They complain about the stairs, the cleaning, the endless diy, the garden. They complain about the hassle of relatives visiting for tea.
My mum could have moved to Downton Abbey and still found a reason to be anxious about appearances to others.
We don't stay, they are two boomer dementors rattling around, talking about a couple of difficult years in the 1970s, totally uninterested in the following generations and their lifestyles.

That’s very very different to your op where you were on about people moving to smaller properties and the space they need and how you’ve had countless conversations with people about continuing to live In their homes which are bigger than they need.

but ok, say you jist got all confused and wrote it wrong, and what you really wanted to start a thread about was how people shouldn’t take issue with new builds.

the reason often folks take issue is because there is seldom the infrastructure to deal with the new properties and they are often crammed in and ugly. As someone said if they had wished to buy a house in the middle of a new build estate they’d habe done so. There is nothing left to enjoy if all the green spaces are built on, the roads congested and not enough doctor or dentist spaces etc. it’s hardly enjoying the same thing is it now?

if your argument was logical and they didn’t want others to enjoy what they had then they would be taking issue with anyone selling a house and a new person moving in. What thy are objecting to, as you know full well, is that the area they specially bought in for its appeal is being decimated.

but that’s a long way away from your op about two folks having two bedrooms each,,,

My large live-in, entertaining kitchen is the last thing I shall compromise on wheen we downsiize.

Totally agree with this, although I did oppose a proposal where they wanted to build a huge block of flats in the centre of my congested town which is on a flood plain and they have no plans to build amenities for these people either (getting GP appt takes ages).

It is possible for similar reasons they are annoyed, but you are absolutely right, if they want people to work in the villages and carers to help them they have to accept they need to live there too and it needs to be reasonably priced so they can survive there.

I think what we really need is a drive to build new towns again like we did in the middle of the last century with proper infrastructure, new industries to provide jobs and amenities. One more recent one near me has been quite successful and lots of people want to live there.