DD on cause for concern PGCE

[feelikeraindrops]

My DD is on her PGCE, she has been on a cause for concern which has been reviewed and she’s been told she’s made good progress in some of her targets but there are some areas that need fine tuning and working on still. Because of this she has been put on the next stage of a cause for concern.

DD is feeling worried about passing but I’ve told to try her best and just listen to and respond to feedback, which she is determined to do.

OK, yes - interacting with the kids while on playground duty is pretty key!
Does she find places like the playground/lunch hall difficult to cope with or is it more that she feels awkward around the kids in a more informal environment than the classroom?

Being shy is one thing - I know several shy teachers. But being unable to establish rapport with pupils is not so good. It's fundamental really. I was a shy child and hated being so. I became a lot more confident as an adult but the shyness is there underneath still. But I could always talk to pupils as that is part of my role. Feeling shy was reserved, in my case, for times when I felt out of my comfort zone.

Teaching is tough and I wouldn't recommend it to anyone who is not suited to it. Maybe it's just not your dd's "thing'? I've also met many ex teachers - there's no shame in recognising something isn't working for you.

It’s a hassle for providers to put students on cause for concern. It isn’t usually done lightly.

As others have said, cause for concern isn't given lightly. If she is struggling to build relationships with the students then she will find it very difficult to teach. It is your job as a teacher to get to know each child. If this doesn't come naturally then she will struggle to get a job once she has completed the PGCE. One of the first things the interviewers will look for is if the candidate is warm and interacts with the children. Can they build a rapport during a lesson observation. Good luck to her but I'd she really is struggling then she should consider if it right for her. It is a tough job- you need to be passionate to do it.

Teaching is tough, really tough. Building relationships with the children is the easy part. I’d probably have my head in my hands if she was my student.

She needs some life experiences to help with her shyness because shyness and teaching are not compatible.

Having good relationships with the children is the most important part of teaching. If she is struggling with this and it’s not improving then I don’t think teaching is for her. As a previous poster said, if she really does want to be a teacher she would be better taking a break to work with children in other settings for a couple of years until she feels comfortable and natural with them.

Why does she want to be a teacher?
Not goady, but most people's answers are based on forming relationships to enable children to learn and grow etc. If that doesn't come naturally to get maybe this isn't the right career for her .
Would she be better suited teaching adults? Rapport is still important but the students will have more developed social skills of their own

If I was her I’d take that as my get out and run for the hills 🙈 It’s sad but so true! I did the same course and just kind of stumbled my way through it somehow. I kept passing all the crits I was expecting to fail. Each time I thought ‘well when I fail this time I’ll drop out then’.. it just never happened. I got some pretty harsh feedback, as did 99% of the course. The feedback from observations can be so brutal, especially when it’s basically criticizing you, your personality etc. I forced myself further and further down this road, purely because ‘I’d’ passed’ so I must be good enough. I’m 6 years in and so wish I’d done something else. The constant criticism, the never quite being good enough, the expectation to be an expert on literally every subject under the sun, the parents complaining if you so much as breathe near their child in the wrong way.. I just can’t take it anymore. I’m on a Facebook group called exit the classroom and thrive. It’s full of people like me who are now anxious, constantly on edge and feel like they have no self worth due to the demands of this job. To me, all the holidays on earth wouldn’t be worth it anymore. I’ve started up my own business and I can’t believe how much less stressful that is! Im making so much more money, I’m not being assaulted or sworn at by children and I don’t have someone following me around telling me I could have done every single thing better 😊 it’s amazing!

Good luck to your daughter, I hope she makes the right decision for her

Just to offer another perspective - it might not be the worst thing. She's been given tangible feedback to improve on and now she knows what to do. A friend of mine was a cause for concern, another friend failed a placement and had to extend their PGCE to do an additional placement. Both teachers well established in their careers now.

I’ve always thought teaching is somewhat akin to acting. Not in a bad way, but you’re on show, and you’ve got to perform with confidence, otherwise your audience will start to feel uncomfortable. If your dd doesn’t feel that she can happily do that every day of her working life, then she’s going to have a rather miserable time of it as a teacher, and I would encourage her to re-think.

Teacher training is pretty brutal, for good reason. Chatting to the kids is absolutely a requirement. Of course it takes a bit of practice to get the balance right & find your groove of how you interact with the kids but you really do just have to get on with it. You can't avoid it due to your personality.

Unfortunately this is a fundamental element of teaching that can't be taught via the PGCE, you can just either do it or you can't. Being able to build relationships with the kids is absolutely crucial, though. You can't do the job effectively without it.

I agree with the previous poster who said teaching is like a performance. It absolutely is, often whilst under extreme pressure and/or whilst juggling behavioural issues. It takes balls.

I'm trying to say this kindly, but in reality would you want your 8 year old child being taught by someone who will only interact with them about maths or geography? Primary kids in particular need to feel a warmth/bond/support etc from their teachers.

How does she react when children approach her when she is on playground duty? In my experience there are always children who want to chat to the teacher on duty.

If she's shy and cannot communicate with the pupils other than in a formal classroom setting then I'd say she's probably not best suited to the profession.

Hahha yep! So true. So glad to be out!

Yes she ought to try to interact more ....i did my pgce years ago....honestly found most of it useless....led by hippy drippy lecturers who spent hours in the pub and left us alone for hours.....i found the city and guilds 7307 much more useful as did that before...!!

If she does not naturally and easily make good relationships with children she should leave now.

If she's not prepared to interact with the kids, how on earth does she/do you think she's going to manage to teach them? Teaching is pretty much all about relationships - recognising each student's ability, personality, earning their trust and confidence, with a bit of learning thrown in.

Is she on her first placement? It's a real ball-ache to put a trainee on a cfc plan but she really does need to up her game.

Interacting with kids and being 'on duty' at all times is part of the professional capability criteria.

And yeah, whilst duty might not be officially part of her roll, any teaching student should be falling over themselves to go that extra mile. Is she sure she's up for the rigours of being a teacher?

The school should absolutely not have to tell your DD to talk to the children while
on duty. That is basic, basic stuff.

It probably doesn’t feel like it but it is good that she has a university and placement school who have the guts to put her on CFC. Many of them fudge their way through and pass frankly inept students, which is a disservice to literally everyone involved. CFC and the associated support plans are a huge amount of extra work for both the university tutor and the school-based
mentor (who is not paid any extra for their time supporting the trainee) and as pp have said they are not entered lightly.

I assume she doesn’t have an ECT job lined up yet. It’s time for some very honest reflection on her part.

It doesn’t sound as if teaching is for her. I’m naturally shy, as are a lot of my colleagues, but I love interacting with the children. That’s the nice part, seeing them having fun and relax. It’s the easy part and if she doesn’t enjoy it, she’s going to struggle. I would encourage her to take the advice and spend some breaks with them and then think long and hard about if this really is what she wants.

Building positive relationships with children is absolutely essential as a teacher, is this really the career for her? Does she have much prior experience in the school setting. Teacher and introvert don’t really go together.

If she’s shy, can she look at it as “acting” as a more confident person? As a PP said, teaching is like performing: most of us put on our teaching face at 8.30 and have it firmly in place until 4pm! It’s one of the reasons that we are all exhausted by hometime.
that said, yes she really does need to build relationships with the children. It’s the basis of safeguarding, maintaining control of 30 children at once and getting them to tell you if they just don’t understand what you said. If that relationship isn’t there, everything else is a lot harder- and in the case of safeguarding (absolutely at the core of what we do), impossible.

Honestly the pgce is absolutely awful. Sometimes it means your daughter isn't cut out for teaching. Is she taking their advice on board andskkng changes? She needs to speak to her uni mentor and ask for a placement change as a matter of urgency

Has she tried secondary? Or a different school for the placement?

This happened to someone I know and it was more that the school had form for 'breaking' trainees in the belief it made them better feeling like they were at the bottom and toughing it out. Year after year people on their placements struggled and failed to thrive at that school.

She should approach a group of girls, smile and say any of you doing anything nice at the weekend girls? They will respond. She needs to look interested, agree oh that sounds fun, anyone else....I am going to a BBQ etc, who likes bbq's. Approach boys anyone enjoy the football at weekend? Which teams do you support? Let them respond and chat to her. Ask who do they think will win the league. If they say City laugh and say, not Liverpool or vice versa. Ask about things they like. The more she tries the easier it gets. If she wonders around playground not speaking to children that is not good.