Driver wanting me to give way

[Bootwall]

If cars are parked on your left and an oncoming car is, well, coming, it's up to you to give way/move out of the way, right?

A driver bombed it around a corner, vehicles parked on his left (my right) we came to be about 10 meters apart, he's now on my side of the road, so we both stopped. He gestured for me to reverse back, but there was only a very small space I would have needed to parallel park on my right, further around the corner, into an awkward space - he had lots more room to reverse into.

I refused and indicated for him to reverse. He then inched forward and forward and forward, looking furious, until we were bumper to bumper. I turned my ignition off.

Luckily a neighbour (I was on my street) came out and came over to my car, asking if I was okay - at this point the other car then decided to reverse (badly) and I still had to mount the pavement to get by.

The cars were on his side- his problem to get out of the way, or WIBU?

Often I do give way if it's obviously easier for me to do so, been driving 20 years and never had an issue like this before! Second guessing myself because he was seemed so adamant I needed to move!

There are some bloody awful drivers on he road . The way you describe it is you have right of way, unless the other car is already proceeding.
Sometimes I just flash someone through out of courtesy, and others do the same. However, some drivers will proceed when you are already passing the obstruction, and give a filthy look when you refuse to reverse back to let the entitled piece of shite go through!!

I think despite the fact I drive a bright red car it fades into invisibility on the road. I can’t count the number of times I’ve had to give way to entitled twats driving on the wrong side of the road when I have right of way.

The bigger crime is when they don’t acknowledge me for waiting - bloody wave!

Ou were right. I had this once and did exactly the same turned my engine off and sat and drank from a water bottle, cars waiting behind both of us. I was angry as she had seen me coming, could easily have waited and carried on, I was over two thirds of the way up.

She eventually moved

I encountered a bullying bloke last week in a supermarket car park. I was pulling through into a space as he decided to turn into it, without indicating of course. I was more than halfway into the space. His reaction was to immediately switch off his engine and fold his arms. I reversed because frankly he already shown what he was and I thought he could be really nasty. I did want to give him a piece of mind, but decided it wouldn't make a difference. He had his daughter with him, who was around 11 or 12. What a great example. Had I been in his position, I would have reversed a very short distance and pulled into the next space.

@Nennypops

"I wasn't emerging from the junction at the point when the van turned."

No, I said "TO EMERGE" which means you were at the junction waiting to get out.

"I was at the junction ready to turn when there was a gap in the traffic. Van driver approached..."

Yes, you were waiting at the junction. But as van driver was approaching, you did NOT have a safe gap to emerge.

If you did, said van driver wouldn't have been able to, you said, "obstruct(ed)" you. If YOU had a safe gap big enough to allow you to emerge from the junction, you'd have been able to get out BEFORE the van approached to turn.

It's quite clear you did not have such a gap at all.

"It's essentially the same situation as people have pointed out upthread where people who technically don't have a right of way past parked cars have committed to it as another driver approaches."

Wrong!

The major difference between the two situations is YOU were behind the broken white lines at the junction. Therefore, YOU had an order in law to stay behind and ONLY emerge if there's a gap big enough to make it safe. A van was approaching close enough to stop you emerging which meant you did not have a safe enough gap and, therefore, you had to give way. Simple as that.

At all junctions where a give way order is in place, you MUST approach with caution. If a long vehicle is approaching to turn in, you must stop short of the give way markings to allow them to complete their turn as well.

The cars parked on side of a road with people trying to safely pass is a very different situation that does NOT contain an order for one driver to give way to another in very concrete terms.

You cannot compare your junction situation with that whatsoever. You were in the wrong, but OP was not.

I suppose if OP were to clarify whether the other driver was committed at the point she appeared would help in making the decision. If she was already there and he just drive towards her then yes he is a prick. However if he had started and committed to that manoeuvre when his oath was clear and OP then came along and kept going because 'the obstruction is on his side' then actually OP would be in the wrong.

At all junctions where a give way order is in place, you MUST approach with caution. If a long vehicle is approaching to turn in, you must stop short of the give way markings to allow them to complete their turn as well.

While this is correct, there are many junctions where it's impossible to see out safely until you're right on the white line. You can't just hover back until it's safe or you'll be there forever.

This is one of those laws/rules which only really works hypothetically

There are junctions here where if you sat behind the white line and waited until it was clear, you'd never be able to turn right as the road layout means you can't see far enough to your left unless you drive partially out of the junction.

Is it technically illegal to go beyond the white line? Yes, but you have to do it in order to pull out safely - even the police do it.

I knew before l even opened this thread that he was male! You did have right of way, he needs to know his highway code better

Give and take definitely the way to go. I've had a stand off with a guy driving a minibus who clearly had no idea how to reverse it. So we were stuck. I ended up waiting until a postie van moved out of the row of parked cars and had to duck in there to let the idiot pass.

Also fucked if I'm mounting the kerb and risking fucking up my wheels! Maybe ok if you've a 4x4 or an old car, but so many cars now have alloys which don't take kindly to bouncing up and down on kerbs.

Our main Street where everyone parks badly outside the local shop is horrendous for this.

@fairylightsandwaxmelts

At all junctions where a give way order is in place, you MUST approach with caution. If a long vehicle is approaching to turn in, you must stop short of the give way markings to allow them to complete their turn as well.

While this is correct, there are many junctions where it's impossible to see out safely until you're right on the white line. You can't just hover back until it's safe or you'll be there forever.

This is one of those laws/rules which only really works hypothetically

There are junctions here where if you sat behind the white line and waited until it was clear, you'd never be able to turn right as the road layout means you can't see far enough to your left unless you drive partially out of the junction.

Is it technically illegal to go beyond the white line? Yes, but you have to do it in order to pull out safely - even the police do it.

That's precisely why "you MUST approach with caution" to ANY junction. Especially in the event a long vehicle has committed to turning IN to any junction.

Too often I see drivers speeding up to junctions which is definitely bad driving. Drivers should decrease speed as they approach junctions in order to make the correct, safe decisions.

@DownNative but PP didn't say they hadn't approached with caution.

My point is - she was probably had no choice but to go right up to the white line in order to see whether it was safe to emerge or not.

There are many junctions like that here - you can't see whether it's safe to emerge until you're right at the white line, no matter how safely or slowly you're going.

Yes I had this before and a kind man made the other person reverse back as he had wizzed by parked cars deliberately.it is quite intimidating

Well done OP

If the obstruction is on your side, you give way. Unless you are already partway through the narrowed bit of road - clearly you can't disappear at that point, so the person coming the other way will have to stop.

I've stopped and switched my engine off too in this sort of scenario. In one case the man reversed back, in the other he managed to squeeze through, much to my disappointment

If they’ve already started the manoeuvre and have overtaken multiple cars you need to hang back and let them finish it.
If the cars were parked right up to the junction which meant that they would have to reverse into a main road then you need to reverse

What I don’t understand is that you say there was a gap on your right which you could pull into? Surely you reverse a car length and let them pull into that gap to let you past?

I am prepared for this situation. I have a tube of mints under the dashboard, and when someone does this to me I ostentatiously lift the tube, take out a mint, put it in my mouth, smile and keep my hands off the wheel.

You are correct that in a neutral situation where he has committed to the manoeuvre but you have right of way, it is the driver with the easier manoeuvre who should reverse.
I drive on a lot of single track country roads that I know well, so know where the passing areas are, however if I come across a particularly belligerent male driver who refuses or can’t reverse 5m I happily reverse 20m. But in doing so I demonstrate just how difficult women drivers find it to reverse😉. So I go 2 mph and frequently have to drive forward to realign. 20m can take me up to 10mins.
What the male driver is unaware of is that I’m actually pretty good at reversing and my car is fitted with a sophisticated reversing camera. I just choose not to demonstrate this ability. So by refusing to reverse back the whole length of their car they have committed themselves to a 10min comedy routine. If my son is with me he thinks it’s hilarious.

@Nennypops

If the van driver was turning from a major road into a minor road, and you were coming out of a minor road, the van driver may well have the right of way

If the person in the minor road is approaching the junction, yes. But if they are already at the junction, no. If it comes to a simple choice between one driver waiting for 5 seconds, or another driver having to reverse back up the road, you go for the safer option, which is obviously the first one.

The person turning into the road should be checking the road before turning in. Pedestrians could be crossing and they do have right of way - even more so now with the changes to the Highway Code as you are meant to give way even when pedestrians are waiting to cross. In @Nennypops situation, the van should have let them out, although there shouldn't be vehicles parked that close to a junction forcing her onto the wrong side of the road in the first place!

[quote fairylightsandwaxmelts]**@DownNative* but PP didn't say they hadn't* approached with caution.

My point is - she was probably had no choice but to go right up to the white line in order to see whether it was safe to emerge or not.

There are many junctions like that here - you can't see whether it's safe to emerge until you're right at the white line, no matter how safely or slowly you're going.[/quote]
Another thing to bear in mind is rule 201:

"Do not reverse from a side road into a main road."

Since Nennypops stated the van was IN the junction entrance itself, the van should NOT reverse from there onto the main road. It's not safe to do.

Reversing vehicles also do NOT have right of way on main roads.

The vehicle waiting to get onto the main road from the junction is the one who has to give way and so should reverse.

It's quite clear that Nennypops COULD reverse, but their attitude about it is an awful reflection:

"I made a big show of reversing incredibly slowly and hesitantly, occasionally going forward a bit as if I needed to adjust the steering. I reached a space I could have reversed into but decided that that was obviously going to be too difficult for poor little me, and carried on. White van man could see I was talking to DS and laughing and he was going ever redder in the face."

Not only did Nennypops NOT have priority due to the junction, but they also knew they had space to reverse into yet pretended they were awful at reversing into a space.

"When I eventually relented...."

Awful attitude, really. They made an assumption about the van driver's thinking too which isn't based on that driver's own behaviour.

The situation is quite clear - Nennypops was at a give way junction, did not have a safe space, van cannot reverse out of junction onto main road, reversing vehicle does not have priority on main roads, Nennypops decided to take the mick AND had a space behind they could SAFELY reverse into.

End of story. Given they've already stated what the situation was previously, anything else would be shifting the goalposts to make themselves look better.

I think you're taking it a bit too seriously @DownNative

@Solmum1964

"The person turning into the road should be checking the road before turning in. Pedestrians could be crossing and they do have right of way - even more so now with the changes to the Highway Code as you are meant to give way even when pedestrians are waiting to cross."

Yes, ALL drivers should be looking at ALL times in ANY direction of travel.

We cannot really ascertain anything based on Nennypops claiming that, but they've described the situation with the position of each vehicle well enough to have been in the wrong.

Including the immature and unsafe behaviour of pretending not to be able to reverse into a space.

What did they achieve with that?

Nothing.

Driving IS a serious business.

There are so many jerk drivers out there and I swear it has been worse since the pandemic. I drop in on my step dad each morning to make sure he is ok. I cant usually reverse into his drive as there is usually someone behind me. Getting out of the drive is so much harder than it used to be. What makes it worse is that there is a traffic light not far. So when it is red, it would cost people nothing to let me out of the drive while they hung back behind me. It would add less than a second to their waiting time when the light changes. But the number who wont...... It is much worse than it used to be.

Didn't matter what side the parked cars are on. Whoever gets to the obstruction first has right of way.

I drive for a living and it's infuriating how many people don't actually know the highway code.

Coming home with DD in her car the other week and we get to a crossroads with lights. Its one of those thats quite tight and if a bus or lorry is turning left into it whilst you're sat waiting for the lights it's incredibly close and very tricky for the bigger vehicle.

DD, knowing this well, stops about 8ft back of the white line waiting for her lights to change. Man in BMW behind is absolutely furious. He's on the horn, pointing angrily at the fact she's not fully up to the line, waving his arms. He can go absolutely nowhere until the lights change, but for some reason where DD has stopped infuriates him.

Her point is proven moments later when a bus turns the corner and gives her a thumbs up for leaving him the room.

Some drivers are just little balls of anger in metal boxes.

@ASaucerfulOfSecrets

Coming home with DD in her car the other week and we get to a crossroads with lights. Its one of those thats quite tight and if a bus or lorry is turning left into it whilst you're sat waiting for the lights it's incredibly close and very tricky for the bigger vehicle.

DD, knowing this well, stops about 8ft back of the white line waiting for her lights to change. Man in BMW behind is absolutely furious. He's on the horn, pointing angrily at the fact she's not fully up to the line, waving his arms. He can go absolutely nowhere until the lights change, but for some reason where DD has stopped infuriates him.

Her point is proven moments later when a bus turns the corner and gives her a thumbs up for leaving him the room.

Some drivers are just little balls of anger in metal boxes.

Raise it with the roads department, if there is genuine need for vehicles to cross lanes when turning the corner the line your DD was sitting back from should be moved back. They usually are.