Page 2 | Would you be annoyed at this comment?

AlisonDonut · 08/04/2022 12:08

I earn more, though I'm not sure if that's relevant

Yes of course it is relevant, so you earn more and as such, your family would lose out more if you were to lose your job.

Sit him down this weekend and tell him that after his comments you have revisited the situation and he needs to equally share the school run and he needs to sort this with his employer. Surely it's the sort of conversation you would have anyway? How to share the work that having kids generates?

moirarosebabay · 08/04/2022 12:10

YANBU. Why is he not sharing the drop offs and pick ups?? I well remember the stress of trying to get my hours in. One badly timed dirty nappy on the way out the door or a reluctant toddler could make my day completely impossible.

AChocolateOrangeaday · 08/04/2022 12:10

It wouldn't bother me in the slightest as if DH was late it would probably strand about 300 people!

Original poster

Sofiegiraffe · 08/04/2022 12:12

He works shifts and has set start and finish times, sometimes evenings, nights, early starts (6.30am) and weekend work. His finish times don't fit in with the childminder's times, mine do. That's why it's all on me to drop off and pick up.

OP posts:

toddlingabout · 08/04/2022 12:12

In normal 'male' logic (that I have experienced) "I earn more, though I'm not sure if that's relevant" means your job is more important. I get it, if you lost your job your household financial situation would be way worse than if he lost his. Personally though I don't think that's the case, I think they are both equally important, but for a successful marriage so is equality in household chores and childcare. It is a partnership, you are not his nanny/home help/chef/maid. He should be sharing the pick ups/drop offs, that doesn't seem fair. Do you end up with the brunt of the housework too?

moirarosebabay · 08/04/2022 12:13

@AlisonDonut

Is it more important though? Whose hours bring in the most £ to the household?

I don't think this should be an excuse either. My ex got free run at his career cos he didn't have to worry about the pick ups and drop offs and being off with them when they are sick. Therefore I didn't get a chance to be the main earner and was always on the back foot with my employer so it impacted my confidence. The parents should be sharing childcare costs and responsibilities. Otherwise it's a breeding ground for resentment which kills relationships.

toddlingabout · 08/04/2022 12:14

@Sofiegiraffe

He works shifts and has set start and finish times, sometimes evenings, nights, early starts (6.30am) and weekend work. His finish times don't fit in with the childminder's times, mine do. That's why it's all on me to drop off and pick up.

He could surely still pick up on the days/times he is not working that fit?

Theunamedcat · 08/04/2022 12:14

They are being flexible they don't want you to take the piss obviously you can't just "be late"

billy1966 · 08/04/2022 12:17

Dropping and collecting is hugely stressful for the person who does it because of everything else that goes before.

How much of the load is he actually doing OP?

Because it reads as if both the financial and childcare load is conveniently on your shoulders.

Nip this in the bud NOW because his attitude stinks and you are on the road to a LOT more resentment if it contines.

Legoisaws8om · 08/04/2022 12:22

What about the days he is off? He should be doing pick up an drop off then so you can have some stressfree journeys to and from work.

JesusMaryAndJosephAndTheWeeDon · 08/04/2022 12:25

Well it depends on his job. I mean some jobs are literally life and death if you are late, or potentially leave someone in discomfort or distress. Some jobs being late means that the previous shift can't leave until you arrive. Some jobs have very strict monitoring of time and very strict sanctions.

If he's in that type of job and you are in a standard office job then he's right, albeit annoying.

If he is just in a normal job where being late is frowned upon but you can make your time up he's being a dick.

Your set up sounds unsustainable though as there is no wiggle room at all. Can he make a flexible working request so he can do some pick ups or drop offs? Given you earn more could he drop a shift to get a guaranteed day off so you have one day when you can bank some extra hours to allow flexibility the rest of the week?

latetothefisting · 08/04/2022 12:29

It doesn't necessarily correlate that rigid start time=more inportant job though. When I worked minimum wage in a shop I had to be there on time or the shop couldn't open. Now I work in an "office" job with much better pay and a lot of responsibility, however as it is flexi time (unless I have an early meeting scheduled) it honestly doesn't matter what time I arrive.

In your situation (haha you expect people to actually read all your updates? I take it you haven't been on MN long!) he's right in that it doesn't matter what the time is when you arrive but you're right in that you need enough time to do your full hours. Can't he even do 1 afternoon pick up a week,if you're doing the other 9? Or the kids do one long day at nursery? That way you can make up all the little 5/10 mins you miss by working late one day a week. I'm saying this as I assume there is a reason he can't do more drop offs/pick ups rather than him just been a lazy dick but most jobs should allow one early finish a week!

twinsetandpearl · 08/04/2022 12:36

It doesn't sound like your hours do work with the childminders times though if despite using the flexibility of the start time you are right up to the wire for drop off and collection and causing unnecessary stress.....what are the childminder times?

NoSquirrels · 08/04/2022 12:47

I hope on the days his shifts mean he can do drop-off or pick-up that he’s pulling his weight.

I’d also tell him if you lose your higher-paying job due to being too “flexible” with time-keeping that you’ll all be screwed.

What are you going to do in case of illness (child’s or your childminder)? Who will take the day off work then. (Hint: it shouldn’t be expected it’s 100% your responsibility)

I’d be raging with him, actually. And telling him perhaps he needs to consider getting a more flexible, family-friendly job.

diddl · 08/04/2022 12:49

@Sofiegiraffe

He works shifts and has set start and finish times, sometimes evenings, nights, early starts (6.30am) and weekend work. His finish times don't fit in with the childminder's times, mine do. That's why it's all on me to drop off and pick up.

But you also have set times if you need to work X hrs per day, & your child must be collected at a certain time!

NoSquirrels · 08/04/2022 12:51

Dropping and collecting is hugely stressful for the person who does it because of everything else that goes before.

It’s also the case that in ‘flexible’ office jobs other colleagues and managers are quite ‘flexible’ with the idea of a finish time and don’t necessarily get that you need to leave at 5pm latest on the dot or you’ll miss your connecting train and be late for collection. If meetings overrun you’re in the unenviable position of having to step out ‘early’ and so on. It IS hugely stressful and I’d be really unhappy being the one who had to do it full-time.

AlisonDonut · 08/04/2022 12:52

I don't think this should be an excuse either. My ex got free run at his career cos he didn't have to worry about the pick ups and drop offs and being off with them when they are sick. Therefore I didn't get a chance to be the main earner and was always on the back foot with my employer so it impacted my confidence. The parents should be sharing childcare costs and responsibilities. Otherwise it's a breeding ground for resentment which kills relationships.

You chose to have kids with a man that focused on his career and didn't discuss how to manage childcare before actually having kids? I mean come on - if you wanted to prioritise your career shouldn't you have thought it through before deciding to have children with him?

Eeksteek · 08/04/2022 12:53

Yes, it would annoy me. Even if your arrival at work isn’t time critical, then as you have said the number of hours you are there are. It shows, that consciously or not, he doesn’t believe your time or work is as valuable as his. Probably because he believes time is measured in money.

Toomanyradishes · 08/04/2022 12:57

@AlisonDonut

I don't think this should be an excuse either. My ex got free run at his career cos he didn't have to worry about the pick ups and drop offs and being off with them when they are sick. Therefore I didn't get a chance to be the main earner and was always on the back foot with my employer so it impacted my confidence. The parents should be sharing childcare costs and responsibilities. Otherwise it's a breeding ground for resentment which kills relationships.

You chose to have kids with a man that focused on his career and didn't discuss how to manage childcare before actually having kids? I mean come on - if you wanted to prioritise your career shouldn't you have thought it through before deciding to have children with him?

You chose to have kids with a woman that focused on her career and didn't discuss how to manage childcare before actually having kids? I mean come on - if you wanted to prioritise your career shouldn't you have thought it through before deciding to have children with her?

Said no one to a man ever...

Why exactly is the default a mans career and the onus on the woman to think it through

NoSquirrels · 08/04/2022 13:06

For context I've just gone back FT from mat leave and I am finding it incredibly stressful (which he's aware of). He's making me feel like I'm overreacting though. I don't know if I am. Am I??

The return to work from FT maternity leave is a massive, massive adjustment for everyone.

For men, it’s often the first time that having a baby actually impacts their life significantly, in my experience.

For women our lives change the moment we get pregnant, but for men until it actually affects their day-to-day and they have to make choices and sacrifices and have tricky conversations and do some sole childcare they’re oblivious.

So when both parents are working it’s a rude awakening. Added to which women often feel guilty and insecure about leaving their babies to work, and they can’t face the fight with their partners at the same time to get equal status. So they let this stuff go for an easy life, or decide to give up work or cut down significantly. And the men sail on, unaffected…

OP, you are not overreacting. He’s under reacting in order to not have to face his own difficult transition- he’d rather it all carried on like when you were on maternity leave.

Keep speaking up for what’s fair. It’s the only way. If he’s a good bloke he’ll get it eventually- no one likes change but we must all adapt.

moirarosebabay · 08/04/2022 15:06

@AlisonDonut

I don't think this should be an excuse either. My ex got free run at his career cos he didn't have to worry about the pick ups and drop offs and being off with them when they are sick. Therefore I didn't get a chance to be the main earner and was always on the back foot with my employer so it impacted my confidence. The parents should be sharing childcare costs and responsibilities. Otherwise it's a breeding ground for resentment which kills relationships.

You chose to have kids with a man that focused on his career and didn't discuss how to manage childcare before actually having kids? I mean come on - if you wanted to prioritise your career shouldn't you have thought it through before deciding to have children with him?

I didn't say I wanted to prioritise my career. I had an unplanned pregnancy and chose not to have an abortion. My situation was different from the OP. I fully expected to do it all on my own. He said he wanted to be a father but he didn't do anything like half the work of raising our child and we split up. This was a big part of what killed my love for him. I went on to do exams and do well in my job, it was actually easier on my own. I am the main breadwinner now on my own and earn more than him anyway as I have worked really hard while raising a family. OP has had a child with a man and he should be pulling his weight. Even if he is the main breadwinner (which he is not) he should be doing something, at the very least doing drop offs and pickups when he can and helping get the child ready on the mornings he is there. My experience is that women are expected to parent like they don't have a job and work like they don't have kids and it's taken me to breaking point so many times. Also in my experience at work men leaving early to get their kids are more favourably looked upon than women leaving early to get their kids. It's not right. It's really hard to be a working mother when you are doing all the drop offs and pick ups.

Original poster

Sofiegiraffe · 08/04/2022 15:08

My experience is that women are expected to parent like they don't have a job and work like they don't have kids and it's taken me to breaking point so many times.

This is spot on. It's absolutely disgusting and it shouldn't be this way for women. Yet it is.

OP posts:

Original poster

Sofiegiraffe · 08/04/2022 15:11

He also often agrees to shift extensions last minute (eg I might be expecting him home at 6pm and suddenly find out he can't be home til 8pm). I said to him just stop agreeing to these things - say "I can't, I have to be home on time for childcare reasons." I said that's what I'd be saying to my boss if he expected me to stay past my hours - I'd be saying I can't because I have to collect my baby from childcare. His response was: "but I'm not the one collecting her. If I was, I'd say that".

🤦🏼‍♀️

Missing the point by a country mile. The fact he doesn't do the physical pick up from the childminder means, in his mind, that he doesn't have to be home on time from his shift either because I'm sorting that out, too.

I'm beyond fucked off if I'm honest.

OP posts:

JenniferBarkley · 08/04/2022 15:52

Is it actually possible for him to do either pick up or drop off OP? Because I'd be putting my foot down and insisting he do one or the other. His attitude is very disrespectful.

billy1966 · 08/04/2022 16:11

@NoSquirrels

Dropping and collecting is hugely stressful for the person who does it because of everything else that goes before.

It’s also the case that in ‘flexible’ office jobs other colleagues and managers are quite ‘flexible’ with the idea of a finish time and don’t necessarily get that you need to leave at 5pm latest on the dot or you’ll miss your connecting train and be late for collection. If meetings overrun you’re in the unenviable position of having to step out ‘early’ and so on. It IS hugely stressful and I’d be really unhappy being the one who had to do it full-time.

I completely agree.

I have an old friend who was doing all of them 25 years ago because she was starting just that bit later than her husband.
She said it was a very stressful part of her day and he did nothing to help.
He couldn't see what the big deal was.

She was offered a promotion and she accepted on condition she could start work at 8am, an hour before the office officially opened, whenever she liked!.

She never told her husband that she asked for it, but as his teaching job started at 9am it suddenly became HIS job to get her two very small children out the door.

The smile was on the other side of his face I can tell you.

She never packed a bag for him either.
He had never packed a bag for her.

He was the one being told by the CM when he forgot things.

She said that it put manners on him and she had a calm breakfast and coffee before her busy day started.
Getting yourself and small children out the door early in the morning is not fun.