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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think rent is so bloody unfair

999 replies

Tar19891 · 02/04/2022 20:43

My rent is 800 per month. A mortgage on the same value flat would be 450 per month. Not in London obviously. It’s not fair is it?

OP posts:
BambinaJAS · 02/04/2022 21:05

Thats actually another HUGE UK problem

Tenants can basically be booted for no reason (section 21).

I have always found this to be completely lopsided. Just another driver of negative societal outcomes.

MrsTerryPratchett · 02/04/2022 21:06

But you don’t live in a communist society and when people can’t afford a home the the council will house them.

Do you think Singapore is Communist you dingbat?

And have you applied for Council housing recently?

Let them eat cake, right?

SwanBuster · 02/04/2022 21:06

@LardyDee

This is a bit like saying it costs nowhere near £48 for the railway company to let me get on a train that's already running to Manchester Piccadilly. Or I could grow my own potatoes for tuppence ha'penny, so why is Tesco charging me £1.29 for a tiny bag of them. Or a whole load of other complaints! If there's open competition in the market and if it could be done more cheaply then someone else would do it.
The market is anything but free and open. For years we had landlords not paying tax - and no checks, and able to outbid potential owner occupiers because BTL mortgages were interest only whilst owner occupiers were sensibly repayment ones.
Malalaa · 02/04/2022 21:06

@Comedycook

If you think it's so unfair, buy instead
Oh here it is. Yes because it's so easy to save up £30k + when you are paying £800 a month on rent plus bills and the cost of living. Why didn't the OP think of that first!
Twitterwhooooo · 02/04/2022 21:06

Chestofdrawers no, we certainly don't live in a communist society, nor do we live in one where councils will house people who can't afford a home.

Do you have any idea of how many people are street homeless, or how many families live in temporary B&Bs?

AStar98 · 02/04/2022 21:07

Get a grip.

If renting was fair we'd all be renting.

Life isn't fair!!

BambinaJAS · 02/04/2022 21:07

@LardyDee

When I hear landlords complain about maintenance costs and insurance cost I laugh at their absurdity.

But they're not complaining! I mean they could take a leaf out of @Tar19891's book and do so ...

Why do I have to pay £37.50 a month for insurance? I've been paying it for years and never got anything back. Why does the plumber charge me £1200 to fit a boiler? It doesn't cost him anything like that Grin

Well, this year let me see:

Your house likely appreciated in value by £30,000 which is enough to pay for that boiler 25 times over.

Embracelife · 02/04/2022 21:08

@Tar19891

Okay! Further info needed. Flats are worth about 120k (one bed) and with a 15k deposit mortgage payments are about 450 per month.
Do you have the 15k deposit? And allow 200 a month for repair and maintenance which may be more e g boiler repairs
Chestofdraws · 02/04/2022 21:08

Why does the plumber charge me £1200 to fit a boiler?

Exactly. Why does Aldi sell bread for probably triple what it costs rhem? Becayse it’s all a business. Housing, food. Clothes. Even electricity.

ThinWomansBrain · 02/04/2022 21:08

and who pays the service charge? I no longer have a mortgage, but in a not particularly luxurious block of 24 apartments, service charge is approximately £4-5k pa, and there's usually a capital payment for works most years- anything between £2k & £7k, plus of course any repairs and maintenance on my own flat.
Are you expecting the mortgage fairy to pay for that?

Malalaa · 02/04/2022 21:08

You pay £800 a month rent. Plus home insurance, bills, council tax etc etc. The unfairness is that paying your rent won't make a blind bit of difference when you apply for a mortgage. You can afford to pay £800 a month on rent, you can prove that you've paid on time every month for how eve many years, but this is completely ignored by lenders and may not be able to get a mortgage anyway. And that's even if you are able to save for a deposit in the first place!

Comedycook · 02/04/2022 21:08

The thing is though, it wouldn't just cost you the £450 mortgage...it would cost you whatever the deposit was on top

MrsTerryPratchett · 02/04/2022 21:08

By the way I'm a homeowner and I've been both a private landlord and a social landlord.

I've made money from this system and will likely make more (my house has doubled in value). But it's a completely unfair system which causes horrible misery and I'd rather it wasn't this way.

Twitterwhooooo · 02/04/2022 21:09

I can't bear the 'oooh, think about how much I pay' stuff from landlords.

In the vast majority of cases, people choose to be landlords. Conversely, there are many, many tenants who would love to be able to buy but just can't in the current market.

LardyDee · 02/04/2022 21:09

@MrsTerryPratchett

If there's open competition in the market and if it could be done more cheaply then someone else would do it.

Not with a limited, essential resource.

That's true of the owner-occupier market too. Land is limited. And housing is limited too, by our absurdly restrictive planning laws.

But if a landlord charges a rent above what the market will bear then his competitors will get the business instead. That's how the market price is set.

Twitterwhooooo · 02/04/2022 21:10

@Comedycook

The thing is though, it wouldn't just cost you the £450 mortgage...it would cost you whatever the deposit was on top
OP knows that.

The point is she can't afford to save a deposit, as she's paying someone else's mortgage for them to keep a roof over her head.

SwanBuster · 02/04/2022 21:10

Remember - people with low incomes are not even allowed to build a decent deposit by the universal credit system.

The second they save 6k - bang, we will start tapering the pitiful welfare payment you get to top up your salary.

A dalary that is shit because we'd rather ensure shareholders of multinationals take the profits rather than those companies pay genuine living wages.

BambinaJAS · 02/04/2022 21:10

@Malalaa

You pay £800 a month rent. Plus home insurance, bills, council tax etc etc. The unfairness is that paying your rent won't make a blind bit of difference when you apply for a mortgage. You can afford to pay £800 a month on rent, you can prove that you've paid on time every month for how eve many years, but this is completely ignored by lenders and may not be able to get a mortgage anyway. And that's even if you are able to save for a deposit in the first place!
I have always found that bizarre as well.

Ignoring a person paying rent consistently in a credit check is just bizarre.

Embracelife · 02/04/2022 21:10

Your house likely appreciated in value by £30,000 which is enough to pay for that boiler 25 times over.

Equity is meaningless though until you sell or secure a a l loan on it, which will cost you interest ....

SwanBuster · 02/04/2022 21:11

Complete rubbish. As I mentioned and you failed to acknowledge, the floor on rent prices are set by the housing element of benefit payments - not the free market of what individuals can afford to pay out of earned income.

Blossomtoes · 02/04/2022 21:12

when people can’t afford a home the the council will house them

Which planet have you been living on for the last 40 years? There’s no council housing stock left.

The landlords on this thread really aren’t doing themselves any favours.

Nothappyatwork · 02/04/2022 21:12

@Twitterwhooooo

I can't bear the 'oooh, think about how much I pay' stuff from landlords.

In the vast majority of cases, people choose to be landlords. Conversely, there are many, many tenants who would love to be able to buy but just can't in the current market.

So I arrived in this country in 2018 with nothing more than four suitcases and four children one in a buggy. I was a student and on benefits, I manage to save £6000 in a lifetime isa so I think the government contributed £1500 to that to help me to wards the costs. Whilst on a break from uni which started on 25 May I got a job I got three months wage slips and I bought a house for £120,000 on 1st September. None of this stuff is rocket science.
Twitterwhooooo · 02/04/2022 21:12

Equity isn't so 'meaningless' that homeowners don't want to accrue it, is it?

It's not 'meaningless', as you well know. It can be converted into cash any time you like and undoubtedly will at some point, even if it's after the owner's death.

thecatneuterer · 02/04/2022 21:13

[quote Tar19891]@Chestofdraws I pay tenants insurance already. I appreciate that I don’t have to pay for cost of repairs but TBH they’re not 4.2k per year are they?[/quote]
I'm a landlord. Have been for 30 odd years with a number of houses. I obviously keep very detailed records of expenses for tax purposes. My average cost per house, per year for maintenance is £3500. Of course that has risen roughly in line with inflation over all those years - and some years one house will account for a large chunk of that, other years another will, and some years it works out roughly equal between them. But I have enough statistics to work this out pretty accurately - and that is what it comes to.

On top of that there is buildings insurance, landlord licence (if you're in a licensing area, gas and electricity servicing and certificates, maybe agents' fees, accountancy fees etc).

I would guess that the maintenance cost will be lower for flats - as you won't have to replace windows, roofs, sort out gardens, rendering or any of that stuff, but flats normally charge pretty substantial service charges to cover that sort of thing, so it probably works out about the same.

Plus of course any mortgage on top of that, and tax.

Of course if you were an owner occupier you wouldn't be paying for safety checks (although you probably should), or licences, or accountancy services, or tax, but you would still have the service charge and maintenance.

Itsbackagain · 02/04/2022 21:13

@Jobseeker19

I have yet to meet a landlord who pays insurance.
Let me introduce myself then. I pay insurance and I pay even more in case of loss of rent and court fees. I do all the legal things I'm meant to do - gas, electric, legionella etc..I pay to be registered as a landlord. I pay an accountant to do my tax. I pay contractors for proper inspections - roof, drains, fencing etc.
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