To think rent is so bloody unfair

[Tar19891]

My rent is 800 per month. A mortgage on the same value flat would be 450 per month. Not in London obviously. It’s not fair is it?

[quote Villagewaspbyke]@SwanBuster I really hope your university degree wasn’t in economics![/quote]
She’s already told you it was maths. A first.

@LardyDee - in Scotland we have more secure tenancies and no right to buy so not much different between housing associations and private rents anymore. Also even in England, councils and housing associations can and do let on less secure tenancies.

[quote Villagewaspbyke]@SwanBuster I really hope your university degree wasn’t in economics![/quote]
It was maths.

But I did do one unit of economics for fun and it was enough to show me how incredibly stupid economists are.

The lecturer failed to understand my point that their classic illustration of how the equilibrium point is found in supply and demand curves fails completely in regard to software. At that point - I knew I was dealing with a subject that was being taught by people with no real world common sense.

@SwanBuster wow fab. One unit of economics showed you how stupid all economists are! Excellent. Clearly then they must all be stupid. The more likely explanation isn’t that you didn’t understand the subject.

@Blossomtoes even if stuff is tax deductible (and not everything is) it still costs money. Paying the tax costs money. As for the period bw tenants thats not necessarily true either. That's when any redecorating takes place, when things like carpets are replaced, curtains dry cleaned etc. And finding new tenants, doing references etc takes time. I'd say a month is more typical lapse period, esp if the last tenant has been in many years.

[quote Villagewaspbyke]@LardyDee - in Scotland we have more secure tenancies and no right to buy so not much different between housing associations and private rents anymore. Also even in England, councils and housing associations can and do let on less secure tenancies.[/quote]
I very much hope E&W moves in the same direction on tenancy reform.

[quote Villagewaspbyke]@SwanBuster I really hope your university degree wasn’t in economics![/quote]
Rude!

Hate to be the bearer of bad news....

But econ 101 is simple for a reason.

Its an introductory course. Higher level economics (grad degree in US) is very much applied math.

@Tar19891

Plus the landlord is building equity. Come on, we’re all adults as you say. Just admit to profiting off the situation

It’s a catch-22 situation, isn’t it, because I suppose that some people are “willing” to pay that much in rent in your area, or landlords couldn’t charge it. There must be something desirable about the area.

Same with buying a house-where I live, houses sell for a third of what they would in a nearby, more popular city.

@BambinaJAS

Hate to be the bearer of bad news....

But econ 101 is simple for a reason.

Its an introductory course. Higher level economics (grad degree in US) is very much applied math.

My point was when a student questions a lecturer - pointing out a market that breaks the traditional concept - they should have the common sense to pause and think. Even in an introductory unit. Instead they produced some waffle.

Nothing that has ever come out of a conventional economists mouth since that I have heard has proved to me that they are any smarter than that lecturer. Time and time again they rely on theory rather than the real world data.

I think adequate housing is a human right. Of course there is a place for landlords in the picture but the State needs to take a far greater role in the provision of housing. I don't think it should be free because that brings its own problems but it should be affordable - 25% of take home pay.

It benefits everyone when people can live a secure and stable existence.

@ohmydayzz

A monthly mortgage payment would be wholly dependent on the amount of deposit and length of mortgage?

YABU.....

Yes. Your rent is not that high really, even a very small one bed is £1,000 around here, and you don't have to pay for maintenance. Usually white goods are included and if they go wrong, the landlord replaces. You'll probably have your own place in time but unfortunately it takes longer these days and first time buyers are older than they were.

There's freedom in renting when you are still young, you can pick up and go when you want for a start; enjoy it while you can.

@SwanBuster - how have you “proven on this thread to have more knowledge and a sharper brain” than “most of you landlords have cumulatively”? Don’t you think that’s a little narcissistic?

Perhaps you should consider that just pronouncing others as stupid (I counted all economists and people who are sceptical about pensions so far) isn’t enough to prove you are cleverer than them or indeed anyone else.

@swanbuster I think you need to consider the possibility that there is much of the world (and certainly economics and tax) that you don’t understand. Better to try to understand it than just dismiss the whole world as stupid.

@LardyDee - I have been both landlord and tenant but currently am neither. But swan is smarter than allll landlords put together. And all economists.

[quote Villagewaspbyke]@SwanBuster - how have you “proven on this thread to have more knowledge and a sharper brain” than “most of you landlords have cumulatively”? Don’t you think that’s a little narcissistic?

Perhaps you should consider that just pronouncing others as stupid (I counted all economists and people who are sceptical about pensions so far) isn’t enough to prove you are cleverer than them or indeed anyone else.[/quote]
The vast majority of people do not understand insurance or pensions.

I speak as an Actuary.

Can we stop with the ad hominin bollocks?

The system is broken and could be much better but not if the pigs won't take their noses out of the trough. And I don't mean small scale landlords. Mainly the very rich and politicians. They have organised this system to wring every scrap of money out of normal people and keep people desperate, ignorant and scared.

20:51Jobseeker19

I have yet to meet a landlord who pays insurance.
Hi my name is karma and I pay insurance 🙂

[quote Villagewaspbyke]@swanbuster I think you need to consider the possibility that there is much of the world (and certainly economics and tax) that you don’t understand. Better to try to understand it than just dismiss the whole world as stupid.[/quote]
Don’t worry - I don’t think I’m smarter than most people. But I’m satisfied I’m substantially smarter than you, and that will do.

I am a landlord but I do get what you mean. The landlord does have to pay for maintenance and building insurance, but it's more than compensated by the investment in property over time.

@MrsTerryPratchett Singapore built government-owned, functional housing which people buy for an affordable price, based partly on income. Fair, affordable, safe and decent housing which is essential for a happy life and a productive economy.

If you're a gazillionaire you can still buy something bonkers. But low- and middle- income people aren't scrabbling to afford to pay a LL's equity. To make them wealthy.

Singapore is a relatively competent socialist democracy. Not perfect (there's always a cost to secure living) however citizens expect their politicians to act on their behalf and invest in their futures. In return both parties show self-restraint and the general direction is that utilities, pensions, public services, state investment funds are all meant for building a future worth having. Singapore as is was established in the 60s from a collection of swampy villages with no natural resources (not even drinking water) apart from what they had between their ears (and demanding their politicians care for their nation).

By comparison, we've had plenty of chances to choose our leaders and temper our own actions. Yet our resource allocation issues just keep getting worse, whether that be housing or education or public services or private enterprise. We keep battling to feed our egos and aren't even especially effective in exploiting each other! Really we have ourselves to blame that we choose to be ignorant of how things work, that we choose leaders that care only for their personal gain and stay in power by feeding us the lies we demand of them. We choose to lie to ourselves that our living off debt will be funded by some present-day version of slave labour. Fact is that our productivity has been rubbish for a long time now, and we've had two economic cycles where we've wilfully chosen to stay on life support instead of undergoing rehab. So how is it a surprise that everything is broken? Fixing it will need us to take responsibility for restraint, for demanding politicians invest in our futures. So much easier to live in the moment and pretend our systems, structures and politicians were not a result of our choices.

What do you want to happen OP? If there were no landlords, where would you live? There have always been people who rent, it's a fact of life. Of course we all want buying a house to be more affordable than it is at present, but there isn't anything we can do about it.

I'm heading for 63 and have to face the fact that, unless house prices drop dramatically, I will never own another house. There is no point in whining about it.

@SquirrelG

What do you want to happen OP? If there were no landlords, where would you live? There have always been people who rent, it's a fact of life. Of course we all want buying a house to be more affordable than it is at present, but there isn't anything we can do about it.

I'm heading for 63 and have to face the fact that, unless house prices drop dramatically, I will never own another house. There is no point in whining about it.

And yet just above you @maryso explained why actually whining about it and demanding change might cause change.

But only if everyone doesn't shrug and accept the shit arseholes we've elected.