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AIBU?

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Original poster

Can I be FORCED to work a notice?

299 replies

jobproblems672 · 01/04/2022 11:33

Hi,

I posted recently about handing in my notice in a job I hate. I was recently signed off for burnout and back pain which is ongoing and all due to my job. I also have a really long commute and long story short I am struggling to continue at this job.

I handed in my notice in mid March thinking it was 2 months. I misread it and it said 2 months effective from either 30th December or 30th april. So that means I have to stay until 30th June.
I already told my new employer I can start in mid May. It took my boss a week after I handed in my notice to tell me that I actually need to stay until July. Since then I’ve been in limbo about a start date as nothing was confirmed.

So I literally just sent a huge email stating that I’m really sorry, that I’m happy to serve a 2 months notice but I physically cannot work until July due to my mental and physical well-being.
She’s disregarded it and sent a short email saying sorry, your end date is 1st July and I can’t make this any earlier.

I can’t even sign off sick for the duration as I’d start my new job in May and that’d be illegal.

Am I wrong in thinking you don’t have to work a notice period? I literally explained that I can’t and won’t, and she didn’t take it for an answer.

Thanks

OP posts:
stuckdownahole · 01/04/2022 13:15

As per many replies above, your employer could theoretically sue you for breach of contract. They would have to prove to the court that they had sustained a financial loss.

In your situation I would inform your employer in writing that your last day will be X. Don't say sorry, or try to explain or argue your case, just tell them.

That will suffice as notification that they should stop paying your salary after X date.

If they then have to use agency cover in the period between X and 1st July, and the cost of that cover is greater than the cost of employing you for the same period, then they will be able to prove that they have suffered a financial loss. But the loss is likely to be relatively small - a few thousand pounds. It's unlikely that an employer would pursue you for a few thousand pounds when the terms of their contract are so unusual because a court may find that their particular requirements for the notice period are unreasonably favourable to the employer / unfavourable to the employee and thus would not order you to compensate them.

You won't get a reference from them, of course.

DameHelena · 01/04/2022 13:15

Shouldn't you be signed off sick now, and until the end of your notice period, if you're struggling (you can't fix burnout in a week!)

I'd go back to the GP.

donquixotedelamancha · 01/04/2022 13:18

OP, I read your last thread. A lot of the replies on here don't understand how unwell the current job is making you or how inconsistently your line manager is treating you.

  1. Sign of sick now. From what you describe I think any GP would accept you are suffering from work related stress.
  1. Ask your employer for an occupational health referral. Explain to OH how and why the job is making you ill.
  1. With the outcomes of that, ask your employer again to release you- not your line manager, HR if you have them or their manager if not.
  1. If they say no, just leave. You can get your GP to end your sick note because you are able to work at the new job, even if it still had time to run. You don't need a reference from this dump. They won't come after you.
  1. Join a union so that next time you have someone to advocate for you who knows the law well. I'm not convinced a longer than 3 month notice period in this industry would be legally enforceable at all.
yellowsuninthesky · 01/04/2022 13:18

@Yellownightmare

So it's really the case that employers can sack you for any reason within the first two years, but you have to work your notice period? This seems totally unfair and way too weighted in favour of employers.
That's UK employment law for you! Employers bleat about it being employee-friendly, but it really isn't.
Foxglovers · 01/04/2022 13:19

You could definitely just give the notice period you wish and then they may threaten you will legal action- which it’s very unlikely they would take as it would cost them a lot of money not to mention hassle! I would just stick to what you want to do,M.

Onlyforcake · 01/04/2022 13:20

Restate your position to the head (nope her nope). Thanks for your email, having queried this clause with ACAS i am reiterating my notice to leave is effective from (date of original) notice. Due to my ongoing health situation I am unable to commit to doubling my notice period as you request. I am aware of previous staff members having worked a two month notice and I intend to do so.

Onlyforcake · 01/04/2022 13:21

And yes. Go to your Dr now. You need to be reducing the stress on yourself, the head is being ridiculous given your reason for leaving

SafelySoftly · 01/04/2022 13:22

@Yellownightmare perfectly fair. Employers need to honour the notice period too! This employee has only be there 7 months and is leaving.

yellowsuninthesky · 01/04/2022 13:22

A lot of the replies on here don't understand how unwell the current job is making you or how inconsistently your line manager is treating you

Yes I also saw the previous thread. People think the OP is a teacher (she isn't) and that she simply has a better offer (she does but the current one is making her ill and they are not making reasonable adjustments for her back problems - hence why I think they'd be on a hiding to nothing if she just walked).

yellowsuninthesky · 01/04/2022 13:23

[quote SafelySoftly]@Yellownightmare perfectly fair. Employers need to honour the notice period too! This employee has only be there 7 months and is leaving.[/quote]
for very good reasons

DogInATent · 01/04/2022 13:28

Yes you can.

And YABU for starting another thread, when this has already been pointed out to you on the first thread.

Trainbear · 01/04/2022 13:29

@LittleOwl153

Go back to your doctor. See if they will sign you off until the end of June. Explain the situation in that you have resigned your job but that they are insisting you work your notice which you don't feel medically able to do. If you can get your GP sign off they might be prepared to negotiate based on the fact that they won't have your time anyway but will still be paying you I assume.
See if the doctor can sign you off as unfit to work at Binx Inkx Stinx or in the position where you currently work, if the new job title is different. If the doctor oohs and ahhs say about the adverse effect on your mental health that no doing as you ask would have. I work in a gp surgery and this is not uncommon.
TheKeatingFive · 01/04/2022 13:30

Yes you can.

Don't be silly Hmm

Original poster
jobproblems672 · 01/04/2022 13:30

I made a new thread because there’s been an update? As in the email I sent and received this morning?

OP posts:
TheSnootiestFox · 01/04/2022 13:30

I had similar although not in a school environment and I was made so ill that I resigned with immediate effect. The only thing that happened was I had to write off my reference and I cannot tell you how hard that made life. 3 years on in a much lower grade job and I've just about repaired the damage. Just work your notice, it's not their fault you screwed up. Having been a teacher in a former life it's a well known fact that most school related posts leave at the end of a term, despite being paid monthly. It would never have entered my head to argue the point!

Original poster
jobproblems672 · 01/04/2022 13:30

I can’t afford to be signed off sick as I’m only eligible for statutory sick pay which is awful

OP posts:
HopefulProcrastinator · 01/04/2022 13:31

They can't force you to work your notice, you can simply take a sick note to cover the duration of your contract if it's making you ill. However you can't start the new job whilst still employed so you do need to speak to them if you can't get current employer to relent.

I'd speak to your employer again and make it clear that you are not fit to work your notice period so will be seeking a fit note to sign you off for the duration. Ask them if they'll reconsider releasing you early on that basis, earlier than your notice period if convenient for them.

Worth pushing one last time with a clear "I will not be working as not well enough to do so" message. They gain nothing but spite by not releasing you in decent time.

TheKeatingFive · 01/04/2022 13:31

I mean, there are potentially consequences to not working a notice period, which have been outlined, but of course she can't be forced to.

Xenia · 01/04/2022 13:31

You have to work the notice period and our new employer might want proof you have finished the previous contract before starting the new one. There are minimum employment notice periods by law but it is lawful to agree much longer ones if both sides agree as you chose to do when you started the first job.

You can either start in mid May as planned and see if your ex employer sues you (very unlikely they will unless you are their main member of staff or have lots of valuable skills) or ask your new firm to start you on 1 July instead.Also read the contract for any post termination restrictions eg that you will not work for a competitor. Some of these clauses ARE legally valid.

Also if your new employer is a big rival of the old one that tends to be when the old employer will cause trouble for you and your new employer if you breach the contract.

SucculentChalice · 01/04/2022 13:32

@jobproblems672

Sorry 7 months*
So if you gave notice on 1 January, that would effectively be requiring a 6 month notice period.

There is no way an employment tribunal is going to enforce a 6 month notice period on an employee in a non-essential role (e.g. not an actual teacher or healthcare professional) who has only been there for 7 months.

In the highly unlikely event your employer sued you (for what? They need to prove loss), the tribunal would apply what is reasonable in the circumstances. Given that you, as an employee, are only entitled to a legal minimum notice period of 1 year if your own contract is silent on the issue, I would doubt that they would only match what notice period you are entitled to, and possibly even 50% or 33% of that.

The idea is not to prevent employees from earning a living. You have already found another job. A 2 month notice period seems more than reasonable, and you would be effectively prevented from earning a living by anything longer.

Your employers could also take out an injunction against you to prevent you starting your new job. Again, thats highly unlikely. What they will probably do is not give you a reference, or give you a poor one (although it must be factual). And since you have a new job to go to anyway, who cares?

I think your employers are absolutely bloody ridiculous. No wonder you are leaving.

DomingoinLittleOakley · 01/04/2022 13:32

What a weird notice period - are they seriously saying that it doesn't matter when you hand your notice in, the notice period is 2 months from either end April or end December? So if you resigned in say, June, you wouldn't be able to leave until end February?

ChrisS36 · 01/04/2022 13:33

Slavery was banned 200 years ago you can’t be forced to work.
But they could in theory give you a poor reference or refuse you one, if you gave broken a contract. But if your case if you get signed off for medical reasons that would be unreasonable.

Genevieva · 01/04/2022 13:33

For unusual contract terms to be valid there must evidence that the other party made an effort to make sure you were aware of it before you signed the contract. There is loads of case law on this. Ask on the legal page here.

TheKeatingFive · 01/04/2022 13:34

The only thing that happened was I had to write off my reference and I cannot tell you how hard that made life.

I wasn't in the position at all, I just used an older reference. I've never seen anything specified that the ref has to be your last job. Especially given the op has been there such a short time.

Original poster
jobproblems672 · 01/04/2022 13:34

It’s just a horrible job. I’m a healthcare worker in different schools so I’m so isolated. I don’t get treated like staff (I don’t get given wifi and often have to use my hotspot which costs money, no printing, no fob to get in). I don’t get to know anyone as I’m only at each one once a week. I never get to see my team apart from the odd zoom meeting. I have to sit on kids chairs which has ruined my back to the point I’ve torn a rib in my upper back. I have to commute over an hour. I’m just so miserable and it’s really affecting me.

New job is the same role but it’s in a clinic, very close to my home, has a team, has all the resources etc needed. Proper office chairs too….

OP posts: