Will my little boy go to a mainstream school

[GrowingUpBesideYou]

My DS is 3y2m old, speech and language delayed and possibly has ASD. He can follow some basic one step commands and in the past few months has gone from completely non verbal, to being able to say about 50 words (mostly labelling) and has recently started to string a couple of words together, for ex, "drive car", "climb tree". He has no behavioural issues apart from some frustration when he is unable to communicate his needs. Can feed himself and put his own wellies on. Not yet toilet trained. Very happy in his mainstream nursery but ignores all the other children and likes to do his own thing and play with the toys alone. Doesn't join in with story time and group activities yet but will sit at the lunch table. He can count to 10 and recite some of the alphabet. Sleeps well and is a happy and great boy. I know he is still so young at 3y2m, but I'm already wondering about school and if he will go to mainstream or need a special school. Any experience or advice appreciated.

I would try mainstream first. You could always switch to a special school if it does not work out. Very hard to go from special school to mainstream as at special school they do so little academically they fall further and further behind peers without additional needs. It is the hardest choice if your child is most academic in special school but least academic in mainstream school. My foster son goes to special school and they give him work that is too easy for him because others in his class struggle to do it so they won't let more able ones move on much. I have had to fight so hard for them to allow DFS to sit 2 GCSE, and 2 BTEC. School wanted all children to just sit Entry Levels. There is no drive to push children onwards and no competition either in sports, just in case someone does not win. They are setting kids up to fail in life. I will be very glad when DFS leaves this summer and goes to a college. He has had 5 hours tuition every week because his special school don't teach Chemistry, Physics, and any foreign languages. They do Art, Art, Music and more Art.

As long as he keeps progressing between now and sept 2023 when he will be 4, I would have thought a decent mainstream school would be fine for him, at least for the first few years. Schools are used to dealing with children at various levels of ability and development. It’s only when a child’s needs are vastly at odds with the needs of the majority that it may be harder to keep them in mainstream

@GrowingUpBesideYou We noticed a big leap forward when he was about 4 and a half.

Op my son couldn’t speak at all at 3 and couldn’t string words together until he was nearly 5. He also couldn’t eat sleep or poo without relentless management and strategising.

I assumed he’s have to go to a SEN school but instead sent him to a highly disciplined prep and he is absolutely amazing - confident articulate never shuts up. Everything can change, I would not shy away from SEN schooling and had basically accepted that he would end up having to go to one but going to school really helped straighten him out and, in addition, the environment was right for him, he’s extremely bright and likes order and calm so it’s worked for him hugely.

So:
Keep exposing your child to speech
Telly radio play dates just get the words flowing. I had my son in the front seat from age four and talked at him constantly... I realised henwojks tune me out in the back

You should start your application for an EHCP now, it sounds as if your child will easily qualify. That in turn will give you slightly more choice when it comes to choosing a school. Contrary to what a PP said, it isn't automatic that your child has to go to a mainstream school first; however, the strong likelihood is that your local authority will want to push for that at least initially and, if you want a special school place, you will have to appeal for it.

Sounds much like my ds. We delayed his start to school by a year (summer born) and that helped tremendously. He has done so well in mainstream and is keeping up academically with his classmates (who are obviously a year younger) with support where needed, carefully structured input and an EHCP. Socially is a whole different kettle of fish though. Noone is mean to him at all, but he doesn't get how to interact with his peers and thinks they are all playing together when actually he just happens to be in the vicinity of them. No friends as such despite play dates but these are either not accepted or accepted but not reciprocated. That's upsetting for me but he seems quite happy in ignorant bliss. Education wise, he's much better in mainstream with peers who "set a good example" for want of a better turn of phrase (Covid brain fog, please understand what I am trying to say, really not meaning to offend anyone.)

My ds is 6 he was diagnosed with asd and gdd at 3. He had around 50 words but mostly echolia. No social interest just played alone. Meltdowns due to communication issues, lots of fixed interests/repetitive/sensory seeking behaviours. Now he's 6 he's thrived in mainstream he has full language (although communication does not mean the same to him as it does to us) above average for reading and maths. He has just this year started playing with children although he's still figuring it out and he has a best friend. He toilet trained in reception in day and last year through night. He has had a ehcp since year 1 and has a full time one to one supporting him. He's doing great and rarely melts down now which I think is a combination of better communication and us understanding him better. But tbh there's no way of knowing what future will hold, as school gets more challenging it may start to become harder for him and we may need to consider a Sen school. Or he may continue to thrive in mainstream. You can't second guess it all I would say is choose your school carefully as a good school makes all the difference and read up/speak to asd adults for advice to give dc best support. Good luck

My daughter sounds the same. In our case we spoke to the nursery staff and found most of what she was saying and doing was echolalia (repeating without truly understanding. She went to an autism resource base attached to a mainstream. She is now secondary level again specialist provision. As she got older the gap got wider.
Speak with teachers/speech therapist etc and decide from there what setting is best it may be that a mainstream with a resource base that offers best of both is a good option?

Teach him sign language.
As you say that he gets frustrated as he can't say certain things
It is a very helpful skill. My kids are older now but still sign to me (water. Pain. Thank you etc haha)
Some kids are better in comprehending sign language before spoken language. But they definitely co exist as well. So yeah
I would try and see if hed respond to it

Get the ehcp needs assessment application in as soon as you can.

I would suggest not seeing it as mainstream v specialist too much rather look at the local options and see which you feel is best suited to his needs. Go and visit, ask questions and take it from there.

Good luck!

Please dont rely on" you can also switch to specialist if mainstream doesn't work out". In my authority it is almost impossible to move across to specialist during primary phase if you don't get in on entry. There are simply not enough places available and barriers are put in the way at every step. The move from one stream to the other is much easier at primary/secondary change level as there are more secondary places available but you may spend years trying to fight your way out of mainstream primary if it doesn't work out.

If you want him to go to a main stream school he can go to one but worth considering pushing for an Sen school if at all possible. Im a 1:1 TA in a main stream school and we have several dc who's needs would be far better met in a different setting. We have too many to have any hope of even moving on the ones who's parents want it. No way the limited local services wound take that many dc from one school. I'd take the opportunity if it arises.

He isn't young , I started looking at schools when ds was 2.7. He was 4 in thr June before he started school and I had a school chosen and ehcp set up ready . You need to start looking for schools NoW!
It's your choice where he goes to school but I looked at about 20 in the local area and some flat out refused ( in code as obvs not allowed) and some were ok. I found a wonderful caring school who bent over backwards for my non verbal child .
He spent 3 happy years there before he moved to Sen school .
I had a discussion with his paediatrician when he was around one regarding schools and she said he should go to Sen and I reminded her it's my choice and I will do what I think is best . I wanted him to start out in a ms environment when everyone is so young and education isn't the most important part .
Your sons life is your choice and you take the path you choose and think is best for him!

Both my children are autistic in year 2 and reception. Both started with EHCPs in mainstream.

DD has been agreed for specialist since year 1, just nowhere for her to go.

DS my reception-er is doing OK. He has significant speech and language issues. Isn't toilet trained etc but he's very happy and accepted.

I am very glad with both we did mainstream first.

If you would like mainstream then the system is very much in your favour, however, if you get an EHCP I would make sure it is correctly written so the support is good.

The ehcp process took us 18 months also after being refused one and appealing / applying again so you also need to get on with this asap . Everything takes forever .
As I said above start visiting / contacting schools now and have meetings to see if they can meet his needs .

@TeddyBeans

You'll have to apply to a mainstream school anyway to get referred and moved onto a SEN school. I've worked with four ASD children over 2 years and only one of them has made the move to a SEN school.

The child that closest matches your description of your DS has excelled in mainstream education. Once he starts school you'll soon know if mainstream is a good match for your DS

This is not true ,my son is 12:in a few weeks and has never been in a mainstream school and has been in a special school since day one of reception Op look around both mainstream and special school,s and get a feel for them ,some children manage very well in mainstream,with the rifht support ,every child is an individual and what works for one Child won't work for another In my child ,s case a special school has absolutely the right environment for him ,he would never had managed in mainstream.

You've got almost 18 months til he starts school. Has the ECHNA process begun? My main tip for that is to get as much actual evidence as possible, including evidence that the setting have tried different interventions but actually need one to one funding to continue these.

A lot will change in your child in 18 months and he will make lots of progress, especially if you can get him one to one support through an EHCP. Starting in mainstream sounds like a wise move. Is he in nursery 5 days?

@spanieleyes

Please dont rely on" you can also switch to specialist if mainstream doesn't work out". In my authority it is almost impossible to move across to specialist during primary phase if you don't get in on entry. There are simply not enough places available and barriers are put in the way at every step. The move from one stream to the other is much easier at primary/secondary change level as there are more secondary places available but you may spend years trying to fight your way out of mainstream primary if it doesn't work out.

I was also coming to say exactly this.

The LA usually encourage parents to start their child in mainstream. This is cheaper for the LA and it does work for some children. However, for some, it doesn't. When the parents of those children try to transfer, they often find that all the places have been filled by children who started in specialist provision.

In my LA, for example, we have been openly told that there are no more places in specialist schools and that even places at mainstream schools with additional provision units are completely full. So when we have a child who needs specialist provision (which we currently do), they will not be able to transfer to anything more than a standard mainstream school. We are told that there's nothing the LA can do, no support they can give and we just get on with it and support the child as best we can, knowing it's not what he/she needs.

I think it will very much depend on the mainstream school as they do vary massively on how they treat/ support kids with Sen despite what may be in an ehcp. As a first thing I’d visit the potential schools and be completely honest with them about your sons needs, if they try and put you off then you can take that to mean that they are never going to do the best for your child and it’s probably not the best place for them, your child deserves to be somewhere where they are wanted. You will also find you get a gut feel/vibe from visiting a school, speaking to the head/ senco etc.

Regarding behavioural problems, your son might not have them now but these can develop after years of being in an unsuitable placement and not being supported properly. That’s what happened with my son.

Once you are in mainstream it is really hard to get out so it’s not just a chance of trying, not quite likely it and then switching, you will have a massive fight on your hand,need to have loads of evidence and probably go to tribunal. Even then it may not be guaranteed unless you have lots of evidence. Another person mentioned above it’s harder to switch from specialist to mainstream as the child may be more behind, it may be true that the child would be more behind but the actual switch would be easier in that you wouldn’t have to fight the la for the move so it’s likely to be agreed a lot quicker without tribunal.

My son started in mainstream without any obvious needs, he was meeting all his milestones with speech, reading, toilet trained etc etc. So we didn’t have the choice initially but things went wrong from year one and he was diagnosed with asd age 6. We had 3 and a half years of absolute hell and he eventually got an ehcp but things had gone to far to still didn’t work and then he eventually moved to specialist but it was a massive fight even though we had lots of evidence that the school couldn’t meet needs.

The specialist school he’s at now is for kids with asd that are at mainstream levels academically however unfortunately this type of school doesn’t exist thst I know of for reception and is made up of kids who have tried and failed mainstream in some way.

I think mainstream is definitely better academically in general if your child can manage it, but if they end up not managing then the academic side being better becomes irrelevant. I also found as my child got older the difference between him and others opened up, so not so noticeable in nursery/reception but by year 6 very different and doesn’t really fit in.

As I said above my best piece of advice is to visit and speak to the school and trust your gut feel, it will almost certainly be right. If available in your area then I’d look at units attached to mainstreams as with those you would get some chance of trying mainstream, but again you’d need to speak to the school as the units can vary.

Above all don’t fall into the trap of thinking that the la/ school want the best for you child and trusting what they say. There are some good people about but I was very naive when I started out on my journey and I found out over a period of about a year or more that not everyone wants what’s best for your child or will do right by them, so you need to be there to advocate for them.

Lots of children do go to mainstream and it works out well, so I don’t want to put you off, but pls go into with your eyes wide open about what might happen and trust your gut feel

I guess it's simply about being open to what best suits your DC. Your "ideally" isn't key; it's about where you child will thrive.
My DC who sounds similar to your child at a similar age has come on so fantastically; she now (at 4; still at her Pre-school, which is attached to a Primary school) speaks about playing/friendships with other children, whereas before she solo-played.
She is starting mainstream school with her sister (twin girls) and the LA has been fantastic about communication/training with the school about my daughter's individual needs.

@TeddyBeans

You'll have to apply to a mainstream school anyway to get referred and moved onto a SEN school. I've worked with four ASD children over 2 years and only one of them has made the move to a SEN school.

The child that closest matches your description of your DS has excelled in mainstream education. Once he starts school you'll soon know if mainstream is a good match for your DS

I didn't apply for mainstream for my daughter when she was 4 I was doing ehcp and named a special school and she got into to one , wasn't easy had to wait to find out if they had space and the ehcp process is nightmare but it's possible

My DD10 has GGD and is being assessed for ASD, she’s at a mainstream primary school and in all honesty it’s been a struggle for her. She struggles socially and is now very aware that she is behind her peers academically. The school are excellent, she has a lot of academic and social support which has helped her remain in school but it’s very hard going for her.

She will move to specialist secondary provision and I think it’ll make all the difference to her. While they may not push her academically, I can support her at home to progress and she has a specialist tutor that she works really well with. The specialist provision has links to mainstream so she can access subjects there with the support of her specialist school. I don’t think for a second she’d cope in mainstream secondary and she’d also be very vulnerable to bullying and exploitation.

You’ll have an idea of what you want for your son, all I’d say is do your homework, we carefully chose my DDs primary school. I knew the HT and knew her value base and the school staff all have excellent training in working with children with ASN. The staff adapt their way of working to suit the children in their care and my DD is accepted for the person she is. I know she’d be utterly lost in other primary schools in the area so it was a purposeful choice to send her to a less local but excellent school for her needs. Some schools are much better than others at supporting ASN kids, and they can thrive, the wrong school will be a nightmare for your child and for you.

Apply for the EHCP as it takes time I would look for a mainstream school with a specialist centre if you have one near you if that's a possibility...lot less places at Special schools .look on your council website under local offer.
Also see if there is a parent carer gorum/network in your area and a SENDIASS they should be able to help with local advice

My youngest had hardly any speech at all until 5 years 3 months. Went into mainstream and obviously struggled with friends and learning to read etc. BUT then just decided to start trying to talk and within 6 months was flying.

Now an incredible talker, has loads of friends, doing well at school. Seems pretty clever and only very mildly ASD.

It's so hard to know what the future brings for your child. I had so many sleepless nights of heartache over scenarios that never came to pass.

Since he is coping in a mainstream nursery it's likely that the local authority will want him to try in mainstream first and see if it meets his needs.
Look around your local schools, ask questions about their approach with SEND children, talk to the SENCO and don't automatically be won over by the best results or the best OFSTED rating.
Also, you might want to look around and see if your local area offers any enhanced provision, resourced provision, discrete ASC bases within mainstream schools.
This might be a good "middle ground" option as it should allow as much mainstream integration as is right for him, with a small group setting as a base when he needs it.