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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

Is this harmless banter or sexist micro-aggression?

55 replies

thepeopleversuswork · 27/03/2022 19:13

Male colleague. He's not my direct line manager but he is more senior than me. Doesn't have children and has always been a bit scathing of situations where people having children interferes with work (ie very intolerant of people having to leave early due to childcare failures etc). He's an outlier in a female-led office which is relatively chilled about this. It's a hard, long-hours job but people are fine for senior people to set their own hours as long as the work gets done. I'm relatively senior and have been with the company over seven years.

I've been drafted onto a project which he is leading and which has just kicked off. Only started up last week. I had to miss the first meeting because I had to take my DD to A&E for an asthma attack. I will also be missing the next meeting because I'll be on annual leave (booked long before this project was even thought of). So effectively I will have missed the first two sessions with this project, through no fault of my own. There are others on the team and its not an especially critical project, so it isn't as if he or the firm were massively inconvenienced by my not being on the call.

He marched up to me last week and, in front of all our colleagues, said: "why have you agreed to join X project if you aren't able to attend any of the sessions?" It was said with a bit of a wry smile and I think in his mind its acceptable banter. But actually I was pretty pissed with this. Am I supposed to apologise for having taken my daughter to hospital in a potentially life-threatening situation? I'm a single mother so there's no-one else who can step in in a situation like this. And for then -- quite by accident - been on pre-arranged holiday the following week? Am I supposed to cancel the leave?

I've been stewing on this for a bit. This guy has form for this sort of remark and in the past I just thought I had to suck it up but now I feel I shouldn't have to put up with this sort of thing.

I'm not going to make formal complaint now as it wouldn't help me but would I be U to start noting this sort of thing down and maybe complaining if it happens again? Or am I being precious and do I need to just chalk it up to experience and let it go? Aside from this guy I have no problems with anyone I work with and have never had issues like this from anyone other than him.

OP posts:

PAFMO · 27/03/2022 19:16

It doesn't sound like he said anything aggressive?
You aren't able to attend things to do with the project and he was asking why you put yourself forward for it if you knew you couldn't commit. Sounds fair enough to be honest. And your comments about him sound more sexist than anything he said.

Cheetocat · 27/03/2022 19:18

I think he's just daft. It doesn't come across as sexism at all.

DdraigGoch · 27/03/2022 19:19

@PAFMO

It doesn't sound like he said anything aggressive? You aren't able to attend things to do with the project and he was asking why you put yourself forward for it if you knew you couldn't commit. Sounds fair enough to be honest. And your comments about him sound more sexist than anything he said.

If he had concerns about her performance, he should have had a quiet word. He undermined her in front of colleagues.

DdraigGoch · 27/03/2022 19:20

Am I supposed to apologise for having taken my daughter to hospital in a potentially life-threatening situation?

Did you say this in response so that all could hear?

You should have done.

Notimeforaname · 27/03/2022 19:22

I would tell him that your job is not your entire life. He's a dope.

Dimenw · 27/03/2022 19:22

Well it's a bit late now, but did you push back on his comment at the time? Something like, "sorry I'll be sure to pre-book my next emergency dash to a&e".
Or just "You what now?"
Anything really that lets him know you won't just take it.

ImBurtMacklin · 27/03/2022 19:22

Any reason your husband couldn’t take time off for the A&E visit?

user1477249785 · 27/03/2022 19:25

@ImBurtMacklin

Any reason your husband couldn’t take time off for the A&E visit?

You mean other than the fact that the OP says she's a single mum?

Original poster

thepeopleversuswork · 27/03/2022 19:30

@PAFMO

It doesn't sound like he said anything aggressive? You aren't able to attend things to do with the project and he was asking why you put yourself forward for it if you knew you couldn't commit. Sounds fair enough to be honest. And your comments about him sound more sexist than anything he said.

I didn’t put myself forward for it. He drafted me onto it.

Also how am I supposed to predict an asthma attack?

OP posts:

Original poster

thepeopleversuswork · 27/03/2022 19:32

@Dimenw

Well it's a bit late now, but did you push back on his comment at the time? Something like, "sorry I'll be sure to pre-book my next emergency dash to a&e". Or just "You what now?" Anything really that lets him know you won't just take it.

I said “As far as I know I am still legally entitled to annual leave”. I didn’t say anything on the A&E situation as I didn’t trust myself to respond calmly.

OP posts:

Original poster

thepeopleversuswork · 27/03/2022 19:33

@ImBurtMacklin

Any reason your husband couldn’t take time off for the A&E visit?

I don’t have a husband.

OP posts:

ImBurtMacklin · 27/03/2022 19:37

@user1477249785 - I checked twice and missed that!

Ok, so that means he can’t use that argument against him.

Take a look at your firms policies for emergency leave etc. useful to have in your back pocket in case he makes further comments

Jackjack0962 · 27/03/2022 19:38

It’s not harmless banter, it’s very unprofessional and and I absolutely would be recording it OP.

Underfrighter · 27/03/2022 19:38

He is being a shit.

He said this infront of a load of people
You have missed one session

I can never think of stuff like this in the moment but would have been good to say something along the lines of 'why do you think its appropriate to raise this in the middle of the office', 'why did you arrange the meetings for times I couldn't make', or just giving him the stare and say you didn't realise that signing up for this project meant you had to agree for forgo leave for personal emergencies and forgo holidays and giving him is own 'wry smile' back to show you were 'joking'.

People like this are sexist and usually a lot of other 'ist' and get away with it by being 'all about the effect on work's, which is you're contentions and make sure you catch up (which I'm sure you do if you're senior) is negligible

Underfrighter · 27/03/2022 19:40

I think your response was fine. I'd be giving him a taste of his own medicine if he is ever off sick though

Ballcactus · 27/03/2022 19:42

I think it can be indirect discrimination if he has form and it’s always in reference to your caring responsibilities. I would make a note of each time in case it escalates

EmpressCixi · 27/03/2022 19:43

I think he was joking as it was said with a “wry smile” and you called it “banter” so his tone of voice was not aggressive. I would have responded with the joke suggested above about booking your next dash to A&E in advance.

The only sexism I see is from you describing him, as well as some blatant ageism.

If you’re that sensitive about being questioned regarding absences twice in a row by your team lead, perhaps you are in the wrong career.

WTF99 · 27/03/2022 19:51

You're NBU as bith are entirely valid reasons for being absent.
If it was me I'd probably log in for the meeting on my annual leave but more because I wouldn't want to be 2 weeks behind than because of anything to do with passive aggressive team lead

Original poster

thepeopleversuswork · 27/03/2022 19:51

@EmpressCixi

The only sexism I see is from you describing him, as well as some blatant ageism.

If you’re that sensitive about being questioned regarding absences twice in a row by your team lead, perhaps you are in the wrong career.

Not seeing the ageism or sexism on my part, could you elaborate?

He’s not my line manager. Both of my two direct line managers were absolutely fine about it.

As for being in the wrong job, what kind of job would you recommend I take?

OP posts:

Aprilx · 27/03/2022 19:55

It sounds like banter to me and I don’t see how it was sexist.

Williamshatnershorses · 27/03/2022 19:57

I think you need to come up with some strategies/one liners for when (because it’s when, not if!) this happens again.

I usually go for ‘sorry what?’ and then follow up with ‘nope, not sure what you’re getting at?’ or ‘what a curious thing to say!’ as a way of getting them to repeat it, simply to see if they will.

Makeitsoso · 27/03/2022 20:03

Did he know the circumstances? I would have emailed him letting him know the situation between the asthma attack and holiday (which you probably did). I think if he genuinely has a problem he should discuss it with you privately. He isn’t being very fair and if he is feeling under pressure he should have said something privately like “I realise you can’t help being off for the first two meetings but please could you prioritise the project after you’d holiday as we’ll miss your contributions”.

EmpressCixi · 27/03/2022 20:05

Sexism and ageism- fact he is male and older/more senior than you is irrelevant to the situation.

Secondly, how could he know why you were absent? You never once mentioned letting him know...you simply say you did not show up. You talk about being expected to apologise for taking your DD to A&E, but how would he even know that was why you missed that session? Why are you assuming because he is male that he expecting an apology? Maybe he just is asking to be informed and not left in the dark....if you’ve told him about the absences and why before he did this then I’ll do 180degree but you did not mention it in your OP or updates thus far that you ever informed him why you missed a session for the A&E or that you’d miss session #2 due to prebooked annual leave. And besides if he knew...then why he be asking you why you missed the sessions when he saw you at work?

Thirdly, more sexism and ageism as you are insisting on devaluing his role as your team lead- would you treat a young woman team lead the same way? He may not be your line manager but he’s your team lead on this project and as your team lead he deserves to be told when you will be absent or why you were absent in a timely fashion. A team lead cannot manage a team project if people just go absent whenever for whatever and never let him know in a time appropriate fashion.

You might enjoy a job that doesn’t have teams on projects as you seem to lack any kind of accountability towards team leads especially if male and older than you.

Bintymcbintface · 27/03/2022 20:06

I don't think it's at all sexist. He asked why you signed up to a project you're so far not participating in, OK not your fault but I can see why he'd be a bit annoyed having someone on his team that isn't contributing

Original poster

thepeopleversuswork · 27/03/2022 20:06

@Makeitsoso

I don't know if he knew I was at A&E but he knew my daughter was unwell as I told him and other senior people (all of whom except him emailed me back to say its fine, do what you have to do).

He's not under pressure on this. It's a small account, there are other people on it and its a fairly light workload.

OP posts:

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