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AIBU?

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Original poster

Is this harmless banter or sexist micro-aggression?

55 replies

thepeopleversuswork · 27/03/2022 19:13

Male colleague. He's not my direct line manager but he is more senior than me. Doesn't have children and has always been a bit scathing of situations where people having children interferes with work (ie very intolerant of people having to leave early due to childcare failures etc). He's an outlier in a female-led office which is relatively chilled about this. It's a hard, long-hours job but people are fine for senior people to set their own hours as long as the work gets done. I'm relatively senior and have been with the company over seven years.

I've been drafted onto a project which he is leading and which has just kicked off. Only started up last week. I had to miss the first meeting because I had to take my DD to A&E for an asthma attack. I will also be missing the next meeting because I'll be on annual leave (booked long before this project was even thought of). So effectively I will have missed the first two sessions with this project, through no fault of my own. There are others on the team and its not an especially critical project, so it isn't as if he or the firm were massively inconvenienced by my not being on the call.

He marched up to me last week and, in front of all our colleagues, said: "why have you agreed to join X project if you aren't able to attend any of the sessions?" It was said with a bit of a wry smile and I think in his mind its acceptable banter. But actually I was pretty pissed with this. Am I supposed to apologise for having taken my daughter to hospital in a potentially life-threatening situation? I'm a single mother so there's no-one else who can step in in a situation like this. And for then -- quite by accident - been on pre-arranged holiday the following week? Am I supposed to cancel the leave?

I've been stewing on this for a bit. This guy has form for this sort of remark and in the past I just thought I had to suck it up but now I feel I shouldn't have to put up with this sort of thing.

I'm not going to make formal complaint now as it wouldn't help me but would I be U to start noting this sort of thing down and maybe complaining if it happens again? Or am I being precious and do I need to just chalk it up to experience and let it go? Aside from this guy I have no problems with anyone I work with and have never had issues like this from anyone other than him.

OP posts:
BOOTS52 · 27/03/2022 20:07

I would call him aside and would say to him calmly if you have anything to say to me in future can we do it in private and not in front of everyone thanks and how this was all sorted with your manager. He is trying to undermine you in front of others. Hope your daughter is ok now and enjoy your time off.

rookiemere · 27/03/2022 20:09

I wouldn't let him get away with anything, but its hard when you're not expecting it. Ideally you would have replied dead pan with " I had to take my DD to hospital for the first session, and I have annual leave that was booked in January which means I will not be at the second session.
I have no further annual leave booked until July ( or whenever it is)."

He's being an arse, people have lives and acknowledging that gives you a project team full of people who are willing to give extra when they need to because they're treated as grownups rather than robots.

sophienelisse · 27/03/2022 20:18

Sorry but I'd of countered with "why do you think this is an appropriate conversation to be had on The office Floor"

Cunt. I'm dealing with a similar twat at the min. Clearly thinks as I'm a women in an all male team I might be an easier target. He is missing his own targets and trying to deflect by attempting to assume he's on a level above me. He's fucking not. He's been fucking told in such a way he looks like the Dick he is.

sophienelisse · 27/03/2022 20:21

The man in my work makes these comments all the time to me front of people. I gave him a chance incase I was being over sensitive but I'm not.

No I go all out and address it head on. Fuck him.

Cbes · 27/03/2022 20:24

@EmpressCixi go back and read the OP. She makes no reference at all to his age. You are being deliberately inflammatory.

Chasingaftermidnight · 27/03/2022 20:28

@EmpressCixi

Sexism and ageism- fact he is male and older/more senior than you is irrelevant to the situation.

Secondly, how could he know why you were absent? You never once mentioned letting him know...you simply say you did not show up. You talk about being expected to apologise for taking your DD to A&E, but how would he even know that was why you missed that session? Why are you assuming because he is male that he expecting an apology? Maybe he just is asking to be informed and not left in the dark....if you’ve told him about the absences and why before he did this then I’ll do 180degree but you did not mention it in your OP or updates thus far that you ever informed him why you missed a session for the A&E or that you’d miss session #2 due to prebooked annual leave. And besides if he knew...then why he be asking you why you missed the sessions when he saw you at work?

Thirdly, more sexism and ageism as you are insisting on devaluing his role as your team lead- would you treat a young woman team lead the same way? He may not be your line manager but he’s your team lead on this project and as your team lead he deserves to be told when you will be absent or why you were absent in a timely fashion. A team lead cannot manage a team project if people just go absent whenever for whatever and never let him know in a time appropriate fashion.

You might enjoy a job that doesn’t have teams on projects as you seem to lack any kind of accountability towards team leads especially if male and older than you.

Where has OP mentioned age? I can see that she’s said that this man is professionally senior to her (which is relevant to the story for obvious reasons) but I can’t see where she’s mentioned his age. Professional seniority and age aren’t the same thing.
Chasingaftermidnight · 27/03/2022 20:33

Yes, he’s an arse.

He has no right to have an issue with the absences - and if he does have an issue with them then it was extremely unprofessional to raise it in that manner and in front of colleagues. He did it to humiliate and undermine you.

And I’d be prepared to bet he wouldn’t have done it to a man.

Mellowyellow222 · 27/03/2022 20:42

If he was project lead why didn’t he know why you were absent from the meeting? Surely you sent your apologies and explained you had a family emergency?

I noted the first thing you said about him was he doesn’t have children. Everyone has a personal life - whether you have children shouldn’t be a big factor in work. You had a personal emergency which called you away. He should have been told.

Whether or not he has children is irrelevant.

Employers should be flexible over to caring responsibilities - but there needs to be open communication and Professionalism. By everyone.

I get reminded In work that I don’t have children regularly. It’s not relevant to my job. I am sensitive and flexible - but we are all paid the same to do a job.

aylis · 27/03/2022 20:48

YANBU. He is.

Polyanthus2 · 27/03/2022 20:49

"ARe you trying to belittle me in front of colleagues?"
"Are you bullying me?' ... wait for answer.

Thewindwhispers · 27/03/2022 20:51

Asking you in front of colleagues was aggressive/ unprofessional / undermining. Do you have a HR department? I’d be tempted to write him an email, and cc in HR, saying that you were upset to be confronted about missing two meetings in front of colleagues rather than having any concerns raised privately, but for the record you missed the first meeting because you had to take your daughter to A&E and the second was annual leave as he is aware. Ask if he has any future concerns about your work for them to be raised with you in writing and not in front of colleagues. Hopefully HR will have a quiet word with him.

HailAdrian · 27/03/2022 20:54

If he wouldn't 'banter' like this with a male colleague, yeah I think there is an element of sexism. Next time, I'd assert yourself, just as loudly and make him look like a dick.

Abaababa · 27/03/2022 20:55

Classic sexist microaggrrssions and a man trying to act as your boss when they are not. Don’t put up with it. He only will understand the rules of the jungle so be very firm in the boundaries you draw with him. Do not give me a further inch!

KaptainKaveman · 27/03/2022 20:58

YABU.

SarahDippity · 27/03/2022 21:01

@Mellowyellow222

If he was project lead why didn’t he know why you were absent from the meeting? Surely you sent your apologies and explained you had a family emergency?

I noted the first thing you said about him was he doesn’t have children. Everyone has a personal life - whether you have children shouldn’t be a big factor in work. You had a personal emergency which called you away. He should have been told.

Whether or not he has children is irrelevant.

Employers should be flexible over to caring responsibilities - but there needs to be open communication and Professionalism. By everyone.

I get reminded In work that I don’t have children regularly. It’s not relevant to my job. I am sensitive and flexible - but we are all paid the same to do a job.

OP did let him know her daughter was unwell; see post of 20.06
Mellowyellow222 · 27/03/2022 21:08

Sorry I had missed that.

He knew you had an unwell child - and I assume had been told you wouldn’t be able to attend the meeting. He shouldn’t have called you out like that - but again I so t see why the fact that he doesn’t have children is relevant? Or the fact that he is male?

I don’t honk it’s necessarily sexist - it’s just unprofessional.

If apologies were recorded for the meeting and if you had ensured you were able to catch up with other action points and were still contributing as agreed then you would be within your rights to call him out.

EinsteinaGogo · 27/03/2022 21:10

He sounds like an arrogant bully, OP.

Practice your drilling down.

'In what way?'
'How do you mean?'
'why do you say that?'

Next time you're on the receiving end of an unwanted, unwarranted comment, don't respond in the way you know they want / expect you to.

Use one of them to put them on the spot, not you.

cantbecoping · 27/03/2022 21:11

YABU

EinsteinaGogo · 27/03/2022 21:13

@EmpressCixi

I think he was joking as it was said with a “wry smile” and you called it “banter” so his tone of voice was not aggressive. I would have responded with the joke suggested above about booking your next dash to A&E in advance.

The only sexism I see is from you describing him, as well as some blatant ageism.

If you’re that sensitive about being questioned regarding absences twice in a row by your team lead, perhaps you are in the wrong career.

???
BrimFullOfAsher · 27/03/2022 21:14

I'm struggling to see where the sexism here is? Also as PPs have said, why him having no children is relevant? Or even him being male really (outside of the supposed sexism?)

ThatsNotItAtAll · 27/03/2022 21:16

There are some really strange responses on this short thread - some posters trying very hard to awkwardly show horn their own agendas in where they don't fit (how on earth can stating that the colleague is senior - very obviously meaning higher up the pay scale) - be ageism 🤣 and of course mentioning that he's a child free man is relevant when discussing whether his comments in front of the entire floor of colleagues to a mother shaming her for taking time off to take an ill child to hospital are "banter"!

He's an arse and a poor manager of people for doing this in front of multiple colleagues, no matter what anyone thinks about whether he's justified in his feelings about you missing meetings due to an ill child and pre booked annual leave (he isn't remotely justified as you didn't put yourself forward for a project clashing with your annual leave - that might have been an error of judgement - but rather he selected you without checking you didn't have leave booked).

I'd say it's something that needs addressing at the time, if it's the first time, but note it down and if it becomes a pattern then talk to him, or your line manager, or HR as you feel is appropriate.

ThatsNotItAtAll · 27/03/2022 21:17
  • shoehorn not show horn
Original poster
thepeopleversuswork · 27/03/2022 21:21

@BrimFullOfAsher

I'm struggling to see where the sexism here is? Also as PPs have said, why him having no children is relevant? Or even him being male really (outside of the supposed sexism?)
The reason not having children is relevant is that he seems not to be able to grasp that childcare or child illness are justifications for absences. This isn’t the only instance of this.

The sexism is wrapped up in this. He expects childcare not to impinge on work under any circumstances. This is not a realistic scenario for most parents and it is mothers who have most of the responsibilities here.

I also am fairly certain - although I can’t prove this - that had I been a man he would not have called me out in public like this.

OP posts:
MsGrumpytrousers · 27/03/2022 21:27

He's a sexist prick and I am amazed that anyone would think otherwise.

It might be worth copying this post on the feminism chat board to get some advice from people that know more about HR and the law around these things.

sophienelisse · 27/03/2022 21:31

This guy is the same!

No kids. Makes comments like "sophieneliise"
Couldn't joint as she's dealing with a child care issue" it's just us men"

Or "sophienelisse" is on the school run she should I hope be back soon" etc etc. all little barbed comments you couldn't really complain about as it could be taken either way. But too often really.

I give no fucks.

I'm better than him.

If that's the level he wants to play at, let's fucking go I love a fight. I will win. He's an arsehole.

What he forgets is that mostly the people
We deal with are women the same as
Me. Juggling it all.

They have the same issues as me. We all get it that you have to adapt.

Not like this cunt who sees it as a weakness.