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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

Triggered by my own DC

36 replies

NameChanged2022 · 27/03/2022 14:13

I don't quite know what to do.

Married XH 2007, DC12 b.2010, DC10 b. 2011, separated 2017, divorced 2019.

New partner, new baby, all good / balanced / happy in the main.

XH shows tendencies towards narcissistic personality disorder, sociopathic behaviour - I'm no expert but I've listened to HG Tudor, read Lundy Bancroft, and noted XFIL shared similar characteristics. XH enjoys being cruel, to people and animals (to make himself feel better / superior), puts people down in front of others / mocks, bullies, never admits he's wrong, has an attitude / arrogance about him which reeks of superiority, smirks when others fail / when you are upset by something he's done, even his walk is haughty and dismissive. It was hateful living with him and being mocked, denigrated, made to feel inferior, derided, lied to, just generally made to feel like I had no business being on this planet. He took all of my self worth away from me and made me totally numb, unfeeling. Hollow.

So on to my AIBU. I don't know what to do. Down to the way he speaks, looks, walks, behaves, smirks, even the way he bloody EATS, his manner, the way he - if I'm spelling out how a game is played, or how to load the dishwasher or cook an egg for for example - just does not listen, so when it's his turn he doesn't know what he's doing, the way he behaves towards me if I'm telling him off, the terrible way he speaks to his younger brother. My DC12 is the absolute spit of his dad.

I am so triggered and I don't know what to do with myself. All the traits and characteristics which I absolutely hated and resented and which made me totally mad, are in my DC12.

I know he has other more positive aspects to him - he has (some) empathy, compassion, he is loving and he cares. He's learnt all this by rote, and I think he probably has inherited some of these rather more emotionally intelligent parts of his character from me / other family members / my partner, but I just don't know what to do about how he makes me feel, all too often.

Please help.

OP posts:

Bintymcbintface · 27/03/2022 19:37

The best you can do is remember that your dc isn't the same person. Tbh I'm kind of gutted for him, it isn't his fault he inherited traits from the man you chose to have children with

MichelleScarn · 27/03/2022 19:41

Sorry but that's quite sad, when saying the small good stuff about him He's learnt all this by rote, and I think he probably has inherited some of these rather more emotionally intelligent parts of his character from me / other family members / my partner, but I just don't know what to do about how he makes me feel, all too often. he's 12! Who has majority custody? You've not lived with the ex for 5 years so since ds was 8? I'm pretty sure he'll have picked up on your feelings for him.

Holly60 · 27/03/2022 19:46

He is a child, he still has lots of time to learn and grow. Try not to associate the traits you find challenging with an adult you have negative feelings towards. Instead try to see him as his own person, and help him develop as any parent would- challenging the behaviour you don’t like, praising the positive behaviour.

His book has not yet been written and you can influence the storyline. Don’t give up on him.

Easterbunnyiswindowshopping · 27/03/2022 19:51

My ds went nc with me at 16. After years of hearing him turn into his df there was a sense of relief among the grief. His df was hideously abusive. I doubt the dc realised it but exh spent years turning them against me so to them I was the baddie. Luckily the 2 younger ones saw the truth. Oldest was too brainwashed sadly.
I get it op I really do. Sorry I have no answers though..

Bintymcbintface · 27/03/2022 19:51

@MichelleScarn

Yeah and if the negative feelings for the ex are known and the poor kid is reminded of how much he's like his dad, how's he going to feel?!

MatildaTheCat · 27/03/2022 19:52

12 year olds can become pretty arrogant and rude as they begin adolescence and are negotiating the teen years ahead so while his actions mat resemble your ex they also resemble a lot of kids of his age. I’m assuming you have the majority of his care so you can definitely influence how this develops.

See a counsellor to unpick this and consider CBT to be analytical about your response. If it’s still a trigger consider EMDR which can be transformative.

legoouch · 27/03/2022 19:53

I think this kind of pattern can happen when you don’t set boundaries/consequences for your kids. It might be a little bit of genetic characteristics coming through in your DS, but also it’s probably mainly a lot of learned behaviour from copying his dad and also from him reacting to how you are with him. See this therapy session, might have some themes you recognise and ideas to help -

Your work is to become aware of your triggers and what’s being triggered within you. Don’t pin it all on your son - it’s your own unprocessed feelings being triggered, and once you recognise and can cope with those feelings you might find your relationship with your DS goes much more smoothly.

GertrudePerkinsPaperyThing · 27/03/2022 19:56

I think you desperately need some counselling to deal with you feelings about exh. Your kids are going to inherit some personality traits from him inevitably.

Then you can hopefully separate what is just you being triggered by a similarity and what is actually bad behaviour (not listening, being unkind to siblings etc) so as to give appropriate consequences for his age.

Original poster

NameChanged2022 · 27/03/2022 19:58

Thank you for commenting. I feel utterly horrendous for having these issues jump out at me, and yes, he probably does pick up on my frustration at times.

When he was younger (8) I took him to the GP as he was exhibiting some quite questionable behaviour. GP suggested (more) counselling, and (more) structured emotional literacy support. We even spoke to CAMHS.

SENCO who was also YrR teacher held a meeting with me after GP appointment, and said "your son has no empathy." I was devastated. Over time, he has learnt how to express his feelings in a more appropriate way, but for example in year 4, one of his teachers sadly passed, and when the class was told, he laughed. It just wasn't appropriate, and so yes, he has had to learn emotions by rote (think emojis on the wall of the classroom to teach him to pick up on facial expressions and understand what they actually mean).

It's really helpful to be able to write about this as I've not been able to say anything in real life - it's far far far too awful to actually speak about it.

OP posts:

Ponoka7 · 27/03/2022 20:00

Let him try that in high school to the older boys. How are his friendships? You need to clamp down on this towards his brother. Do you think that he looks up to his Dad so copies, or is his self esteem low and he's acting out?

OutlookStalking · 27/03/2022 20:02

It's really not uncommon that people can laugh when they are faced wiht a siutation that is overwhelming and they don't know how to react. It doesn't mean they find it funny.

DontLookBackInAnger1 · 27/03/2022 20:09

I would be sitting down with him and laying it out.

I've noticed you doing XYZ. I'm sorry son but you shouldn't be doing that, people will feel hurt and many will think you are silly for doing it. A strong person doesn't do that. Instead you could try this or that. But if you continue acting the way you are with this, you may find friends move away from you and if you do this to me, I will be taking XYZ.
dont treat your brother like that, he doesn't deserve it. It's poor behaviour and we won't be putting up with it. If you do it again then XYZ consequences.
emphasise good behaviour in others and him. Son, I noticed how kind you were to your friend today, it looked like you were having fun. Its nice to see you and your brother getting on well, that's what the world is about, having good relationships.

Etc etc.

I wouldn't ignore it, hoping it will change. I would address it head on. He needs to know it's NOT ok and that it's a weak trait (that can be changed)

Original poster

NameChanged2022 · 27/03/2022 20:12

@Easterbunnyiswindowshopping

My ds went nc with me at 16. After years of hearing him turn into his df there was a sense of relief among the grief. His df was hideously abusive. I doubt the dc realised it but exh spent years turning them against me so to them I was the baddie. Luckily the 2 younger ones saw the truth. Oldest was too brainwashed sadly. I get it op I really do. Sorry I have no answers though..

I am so sorry this happened to you. How old is your DS now? Do you think there will ever be a time for reconciliation?

OP posts:

DontLookBackInAnger1 · 27/03/2022 20:12

What do your children think of their dad? Does he seem to respect him? Does he get affected by his dad's attitude?

How much contact does dad have with the children?

oliviastwisted · 27/03/2022 20:13

Narcissism is an adaptive response to trauma. Minimise and mitigate any trauma your son has experienced and then you can offset the characteristics you have experienced from your husband. Recover from your husband do you can fully appreciate that your son is not your husband.

MichelleScarn · 27/03/2022 20:13

So you've had senco and cahms involved previously, what now?

Easterbunnyiswindowshopping · 27/03/2022 20:19

He is nearly 22. He sent my dc abusive messages. Told them they were all not right and I was the common factor. There really is no come back for him.

Original poster

NameChanged2022 · 27/03/2022 20:20

@DontLookBackInAnger1

I would be sitting down with him and laying it out.

I've noticed you doing XYZ. I'm sorry son but you shouldn't be doing that, people will feel hurt and many will think you are silly for doing it. A strong person doesn't do that. Instead you could try this or that. But if you continue acting the way you are with this, you may find friends move away from you and if you do this to me, I will be taking XYZ.
dont treat your brother like that, he doesn't deserve it. It's poor behaviour and we won't be putting up with it. If you do it again then XYZ consequences.
emphasise good behaviour in others and him. Son, I noticed how kind you were to your friend today, it looked like you were having fun. Its nice to see you and your brother getting on well, that's what the world is about, having good relationships.

Etc etc.

I wouldn't ignore it, hoping it will change. I would address it head on. He needs to know it's NOT ok and that it's a weak trait (that can be changed)

Thank you this is really helpful advice. We have recently set some really strict boundaries at home - "privacy, space, boundaries" - when we learnt that there was a bit of an issue going on at dad's house. I will sit down with him again and set out the rule book you've suggested, as I just don't think he even listened to me before. It's hard when their dad constantly puts me down when they're with him as I cannot help but think - particularly eldest - it's rubbed off, and there's a distinct lack of respect almost (for me as mum, let alone women).

OP posts:

Bagadverts · 27/03/2022 20:23

Your son is a different person to his father regardless of looks.
Part of his behaviour may be picking up how you feel about him.
However he has a role model who is there in your partner and had interventions to help with empathy (if there actually a mental health issue).

Original poster

NameChanged2022 · 27/03/2022 20:24

@DontLookBackInAnger1

What do your children think of their dad? Does he seem to respect him? Does he get affected by his dad's attitude?

How much contact does dad have with the children?

He sees them EOW and half holidays, though no more than 2 weeks over summer - he has never had them for more than a week. This year will be the first time he has them for a fortnight.

Does he respect his dad? No; but then again,
Does he respect me? It doesn't seem like it at the moment.
Does his dad influence the way he behaves? Yes. When they return from dad the behaviour is appalling for a good two days, toward me, eachother, my partner. It takes a good couple of days for them to remember the boundaries and rules in this house - when there, there are no set bedtimes, they sit in a dark room gaming for however long they want to, they get brought food to that room, and they don't lift a finger (chores, cooking, making beds, personal hygiene eg brushing teeth etc). It's very different here.

OP posts:

Original poster

NameChanged2022 · 27/03/2022 20:29

@MichelleScarn

So you've had senco and cahms involved previously, what now?

Fortunately the counsellor he has seen since he was 8 also works at the secondary school he now attends so they see one another fairly regularly. It was the counsellor who validated my concerns recently regarding the clear resentment between the DC, the way DC12 spoke about his brother, that it was unpalatable, and needed nipping in the bud. It also spurred me on to email XH as there were a couple of things which needed to be said (for example the DC were sharing a bedroom in a 4/5 bed house...) to XH which came up in a recent counselling session.

OP posts:

MichelleScarn · 27/03/2022 20:33

my concerns recently regarding the clear resentment between the DC, the way DC12 spoke about his brother, that it was unpalatable, and needed nipping in the bud.
Are you seeing exH In ds2? I'm wondering if not if Ds1 is picking up on this and feeling like the black sheep therefore taking his anger at this out on his sibling?

Original poster

NameChanged2022 · 27/03/2022 20:35

@oliviastwisted

Thank you - I was made aware of the ACEs (adverse childhood experiences) scale, and he is really very high up on it. Childhood trauma from his own birth (both of us were in danger) coupled with a lot of hospital intervention due to an inherited (paternal) disorder, and major abdominal surgery when he was 5. Parents separated when he was 7.

A lot of trauma.

OP posts:

DontLookBackInAnger1 · 27/03/2022 20:36

It must be very hard knowing he's talking about you poorly to them.

How much contact does he have?

What do you say about their dad? I know people tend to say, don't say anything bad etc, but in this case, I absolutely would be letting them know that dad can be selfish and what he says isn't true.

An ex-colleague had a similar situation. Her ex was a nasty, nasty person who sadly successfully convinced his daughter that the mother was the baddy. He was a compulsive liar and very controlling but completely different with his child so she didn't see that side or believe he could be like that. So she thought her mum must be lying.

Anyway, once the daughter reached early-mid 20s she started to see that side of him. He started to treat her like he did his ex wife and it all came crumbling down. She realised she'd been hoodwinked and now, they have a wonderful relationship. Both sides are sad that it took so long, but his true colours shone.

Obviously your situation is different in the sense that your son is showing signs of being similar. In this situation you absolutely need to come down on him like a ton of bricks, show him women are strong and deserve respect. That there's nothing to gain from acting like that and that it's good to be vulnerable (and not the alpha) sometimes. Maybe your partner can have gentle words too - as a positive male influence. And you definitely need to be letting your younger son know that he shouldn't put up with anyone's bad behaviour and to let you know if he needs any help.

I hope you're ok, it must be a very difficult situation. No one wants their child to be showing signs of being unkind etc.

Original poster

NameChanged2022 · 27/03/2022 20:39

@MichelleScarn

my concerns recently regarding the clear resentment between the DC, the way DC12 spoke about his brother, that it was unpalatable, and needed nipping in the bud. Are you seeing exH In ds2? I'm wondering if not if Ds1 is picking up on this and feeling like the black sheep therefore taking his anger at this out on his sibling?

DS2 is a wind up merchant and has a knack of causing DS1 to - quite literally - go for his jugular. I caught DS1 hunched on the floor over a pillow (full force) wrapped around DS2s head recently. DS2 in XHs eyes is the golden child, the triangulation became so apparent I got rid of XH.

Ironically I think I probably over compensated for that - so DS2 feels hard done by in this household.

OP posts:

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