To think my husband is gravely ill at the wrong time?

[MyOtherCarIsAPorsche]

Masses of confusion.

Husband spoke to GP yesterday morning and described his chest pain. He was advised to call an ambulance. My husband refused because he didn't think he needed one - thought he had chest infection or torn muscle.

He went to A&E - was sat in a corridor from 10.30am - he had ecg, x ray and blood test. He continued to sit on a chair in the corridor all day.

He was told he was waiting for blood test results. These came back at 6pm. Then he had to wait for a CT scan - then rushed to resus.

Dissected aorta from heart level to naval level.

I was called to be allowed to sit with him because I wasn't allowed to be in A&E. Was then told he was being blue lighted to another hospital an hour away for immediate surgery. I asked is this time critical? The answer was - yes life saving.

Paramedics arrived and told me to set off to this other hospital. There were three paramedics. One said 'I'm not taking him because I can't use that bit of kit, I'll lose my job if something goes wrong'. No advanced paramedics available and no doctor available to go in the transfer.

I was 15 min into the journey and then called back to the hospital.

No surgery.

Trying all day today to get him transferred. Nothing available.

He's critically ill.

I'm out of my mind with worry.

There's a saying about not being ill on the weekend. The standard of care is not the same. The 24hr cover appears to not exist.

I feel like we're being fobbed off with poor excuses big style.

@StrawberryPot

You're advocating shaming a paramedic who was acting entirely professionally in refusing to act outside their competence? The paramedic is the one person in this story who has acted 100% correctly.

No. I'm advocating that the op compiles a record of all the points at which the NHS has failed her dh. The shame is on the system that means he hadn't been trained properly. It was an example.

No paramedics are trained to use Alaris pumps. As nurses, we have to escort patients on Alaris pumps as it’s outside a paramedic’s remit. So it’s not that the paramedic is refusing, or being a jobsworth, or hasn’t been trained ‘properly’; they simply do not have the legal cover to use it. If a patient dies en route, that paramedic isn’t covered.

Also, I hope none of you bemoaning the situation here voted Tory.

If your son currently has a good memory of the situation get him to write down a timeline and what was said when and by whom.

Your DH needs strong advocates now. This is why the nhs need to sort out the whole issue round separating families because of covid restrictions at these times. Patients like your DH should be able to have two people with him at all times if only to protect the patient from the incompetencies of the nhs.

Write down anything anyone says to you and note names and times.

Get your son on the case calling/emailing and using social media.

Demand a second opinion about your DHs need for surgery.

Demand an explanation as to the change in medical recommendation regarding procedure and what has changed regarding your DHs condition.

Without doing the above the nhs would have killed my Dad, DH, me and my DS at various points over the years.

@TyrannosaurusFlex

Also, I hope none of you bemoaning the situation here voted Tory.

Totally irrelevant the NHS has been shit under Tory and Labour. Most of it falls down to the God like attitude that runs through it.

Thinking of you OP

@Soontobe60 it doesn't have to be a senior staff member a band 5 nurse can work a syringe driver. My example was an extreme one. They could call in an extra staff member or use a bank worker to cover on ITU while a nurse goes on the transfer. There really is always a way.

Ahhh OP that sounds very worrying for you. I hope you have more news when you go in today.

@TyrannosaurusFlex

Also, I hope none of you bemoaning the situation here voted Tory.

Helpful

If he was literally at death's door he would be treated. He isn't. He will be treated on Mon, Tues or Weds. Other people are more ill than him.

@TodayWeShark

They need a critical care ambulance for the transfer if the receiving hospital have said yes, then that seems to be the hold up. And get onto SATS as well.

Get onto your ambulance service and ask them for documentation as to why they have refused the transfer.

Not all ambulance trusts have critical care ambulances. In London we only have them for neonates for example. They tend to be in places like Devon and Cornwall where there may be a very long distance between hospitals. They're also usually staffed by Critical Care nurses as well as paramedics so again, someone licenced to use the drugs and trained in the equipment.

Critically ill patients and all their accompanying equipment, including ventilators if necessary can be transferred using an ordinary front like ambulance. Its an escort that they need, not a specialist ambulance.

@StrawberryPot

Can you get someone to bring you a pen and notebook? Then whenever anyone talks to you about your husband's condition, write down what they say, their name and time. When they've finished say, 'just to be clear for the record, you're saying x, y, z'. Ask each person how critical your dh is and how urgently he needs treatment - write it down and let the member of staff see you're writing it down.

With the paramedics for example you could have made a written note and then said, 'so just to be clear, you're refusing to take my dh to another hospital for life-saving treatment because you've not been trained in the necessary kit he might need en route? So he can't get urgent treatment? Is that right?'

Might get more results if people think what they're saying/not doing now might come back to bite them. Also makes it harder for people to deny later what they said and you also have a handy transcript to use as the basis for your official complaint once your dh is better.

Of course though the paramedic was absolutely right to refuse to take dh if he wasn't qualified to use the equipment.

Its shocking. All I can say is I am thinking of you and wish you all gets sorted.

Oh no. This sounds terribly stressful. I've got no advice but wanted to send best wishes!! Hope it all goes well.

@TheUnexpectedPickle you’re right they could just call someone in but it’s not that easy. I am not a nurse but work in A&E and our staffing is 9/10 horrific. 6 nurses short and often a few doctors. Why?? Because they are leaving or burnt out. We have upped our rates to get people in but they don’t want the coal start pressure of these sorts of situations.

Sorry auto correct! They don’t want to work in these sorts of pressures situations because there is something every day now and It shouldn’t be this hard.

@Briony123

If he was literally at death's door he would be treated. He isn't. He will be treated on Mon, Tues or Weds. Other people are more ill than him.

Very comforting for the OP I'm sure

@Soontobe60

Yes - definitely dissected aorta. Apparently there are several layers inside the aorta - the doctor drew three layers on a diagram. I wanted to keep it but he wouldn't let me. He ripped it up and threw it in the bin. Don't know which type - told that it's significant and goes from a level at the top of the heart to the naval. The first doctor I spoke to yesterday indicated this with his hand over his own chest and abdomen to illustrate the length.

Most of his pain is in his back but has gone lower into his abdomen over the course of the day. His blood pressure has increased over the course of the day.

The scan that they said he would have today (they told me last night) has not happened thus far.

Neither has the transfer. Again, I'm convinced they are stalling for time.

I'm sat outside the hospital wondering what is happening - I'm afraid to go in.

I'm waiting for my time slot.

[quote itsjustnotok]@TheUnexpectedPickle you’re right they could just call someone in but it’s not that easy. I am not a nurse but work in A&E and our staffing is 9/10 horrific. 6 nurses short and often a few doctors. Why?? Because they are leaving or burnt out. We have upped our rates to get people in but they don’t want the coal start pressure of these sorts of situations.[/quote]
Yeah that's fair. My mum is an A&E band 7 and its the same in her department.

Its the same for us actually, my trust is paying huge overtime incentives at the moment and we're still undermanned. People just don't want to work extra, even of an extre 200 quid a shift.

God help us.

How are you doing OP?

Bloody hell OP, this is hideous. I’m glad you’ve had some useful advice here.

Have you got a pen and paper to write everything down? Keep hydrated to help you think clearly.

@FluffyLion

I work for the ambulance service. For an intensive care transfer we always have hospital staff travel with us. Intensive care patients are transferred on the hospital trolley with all of the hospital equipment attached. We aren't trained to use the equipment, it is different to ours, we always have a doctor come with us and usually a nurse too incase anything happens on the journey. I can't understand why they don't have staff available to go on the transfer, it is critical that they make staff available. It just doesn't seem acceptable at all.

Yes, the hospital need to find someone to go on the transfer. When I worked for an acute trust I’ve been phoned before on my day off and asked to come in to do a transfer. And if I was available I went in and did the transfer. Are they trying to find someone?

How awful for you. Hope you're with him now. Thinking of you both.

Hoping your visit goes well and your husband gets the care he needs.

Just a thought, on the way in, tell a member of staff that you need to speak to the consultant in charge before you leave. I found it useful to do it this way round when I have had to advocate for family members.

Thinking of you both.

It's such a frightening time for you all. I really hope your husband makes a good recovery. 💐

@Briony123

If he was literally at death's door he would be treated. He isn't. He will be treated on Mon, Tues or Weds. Other people are more ill than him.

Experience tells me this is not necessarily true unfortunately

I'd be making a fuck ton of noise. I hope he's okay and operated on soon.