Help me to stop being a shouty Mum

[ShoutyAnge]

I am a shouty parent and I hate it. It's not even effective, I literally am just throwing my toys out the pram while my kids continue to ignore me. They shout and scream, then I shout and scream over the top. I really want another way. I'm a single parent and a shouty mum with lots of kids, so was my Mum. So it's all I've ever known, but not what I want to continue doing. Every time I shout (basically every single morning, they don't even try to get ready until I raise my voice and so either I Shout, we are late, or both) I feel emotionally drained afterwards. It makes me not want to get out of bed in the morning, the chaos, tears (mostly mine), fighting and yelling is just unbearable. I left an abusive relationship, and yelling just feels like bullying to me. It feels like smacking their bums for slapping each other. Illogical completely. Has anyone else managed to change this pattern? I want to be the circuit breaker for my family, and show my Dc another way to communicate as a family.

I haven't read it yet, but Sarah Ockwell Smith has a new book out called "How to be a calm parent". It's on my Amazon wish list and I really rate some of her other work.

Sorry, just read your last post and now mine looks very insensitive

No worries @Theregoesmyhomebirth

I have been listening to some Sarah Ockwell-Smith recently and really do rate her and have also been working my way through 'how to talk so little kids will listen...' which is a follow on from 'how to talk so kid 'how to talk so kids will listen' which I actually bought by mistake as I thought it was the former) as well as watching some old reruns of super nanny, but I've just ended up more confused and conflicted. It doesn't help I am always just reading snippets in between reffing rounds of WWF or when I'm too tired to formulate opinion.

I would love to be a calm parent. I just don't seem to be able to do it because the moment something bothers me, like being somewhere on time, I don't seem to be able to be calm. I just get so stressed out. And my only way not to get stressed out, is to convince myself it doesn't matter (even though with being on school on time I know it really does)

Can you sit down with your eldest one night and have a quiet chat with him about he needs to step up and help you. He should certainly be able to get himself dressed in the morning especially if the clothes are laid out. Are they hungry when they wake up? On school mornings mine aren’t allowed downstairs for snacks/breakfast until they’re dressed. Hard rule. Do they not mind being late to school at all?

Well the one person you can control is yourself. So you need to lead the way in talking quietly and acting calmly.
Draw a line in the sand and decide what you will put up with and what has to change. I guess that you just want some calmness in the house.
Tell the children the night before that you are going to be speaking in quiet voices in your house from now on. So instead of yelling up the stairs for example you go to the children every time and speak in a normal voice.
Leave the clothes out for them as usual and in the morning you go to each one and tell them to start getting ready . You will be downstairs sorting breakfast . They have 10 minutes or whatever is reasonable for them.
If they are fighting dont yell at them to stop it- go near to them and stand looking at them . Your presence should remind them to stop what they are doing . You expect them not to fight and yell.Try not to shout even if they are. They wont be listening to you anyway so save your energy.
Instead of the shouting and yelling you should be able to chat about the coming day - nice things that will happen etc.
Be a bit Mary Poppins for a while - act it out if you can.
If you can get the mornings at least to be a bit calmer by channeling Mary Poppins you have gained some ground and can build on it.

Eldest minds about being late once she gets to School and realises she is late, but doesn't believe me when I say we will be late if she doesn't get ready. I put clothes out in consecutive order, starting with underwear, ending with shoes. But I have to prompt every single step. She has to be reminded to put toothpaste on the toothbrush, and will often just refuse to get ready completely. I've had years of oppositional Morning behaviour, and around food and bed times, so younger two are really just following suite, but when I have 3 of them fighting me I'm just outnumbered.
I have tried doing clothes first, then breakfast (they say they're too hungry to get ready), breakfast first then clothes (they don't want to stop eating breakfast before getting ready so cereal bowls thrown etc.) bath at night, bath in morning, star charts (at home, and at school).

I wonder if it comes down to practice, reinforcement and removal of the triggers. So doing what you can to avoid your own emotions bubbling up and putting in what you can to relieve your own stress so that the children's behaviour doesn't break the camel's back. You're talking about breaking a cycle that's all you have ever seen so it's going to take lots of practising the tips from the how to book you're reading. Sometimes people do a lot of reading but don't put an action plan together of how to actually change their behaviour based on what they're read.

I was really good with kids before I had my own. Mary Poppins is about right! I think I just feel a bit broken by Years of doing Mary Poppins with no positive effect. And now I've found myself parenting the way I didn't want to. Not the way my ex was, but shouty noisy chaos like my childhood.

I found it so stressful as a child when my siblings just would not do what they were told. But I was always helping my mum. It confuses me that my eldest will not help me in anyway. I know I can't expect that, but it's like she actively makes it worse as well. I have 3 DC behaving like toddlers instead.

I just really want some peace, I had quite a traumatic childhood, my early adulthood was stressful and traumatic, and I'm ready to step into a calmer phase. But it's so at odds with how it is with my kids.

Do you think it would work eventually if I just model the behaviour I expect? I've been wondering about just being the change I want to see in the world IYSWIM.
And letting the chips fall where they may.

So eg. Just getting up. Getting ready. Getting the kids ready. And if we are late we are late. If there vests are on backwards, so be it. If they don't want breakfast, Ok then. They can take an apple on the walk to school. They can wear a coat, or I'll carry it. Pick your battles right? Even if we get there an hour late at least I don't have to be burnt out and stressed all the time. I'll have to start work later and we'll have less money but I'll have some peace. Because I value peace above all other things now. So if I was living fully in line with my values that's what I would do right?

IDK how to make it work but if I never shout again for the rest of my life it will still be too soon

Sounds like you’re quite overwhelmed right now. After everything that’s happened to you all it must be difficult. We all shout sometimes, and it’s awful, so definitely understand.

Some great tips here.

For me, the biggest game changer was turning everything into a game. Works a treat to keep everyone happy, including me! try ‘who can find their shoes!’ Instead of ‘put your shoes on’. That sort of thing.

If they won’t get dressed, then play fight, wrestle, tickle, be silly or simply sit, help and hug. Make them laugh whenever you can. Same with any conflict when they started playing up. Be silly, or simply be still and hug them! Hugs are the best.

Don’t stress about being late. Accept you might be late from time to time and just slow down. Then you can work on being a family and reconnect.

You’ll get there x

I agree with pp- try and lean into it rather than fighting it. Make it a game.
Also see what your triggers are and try and plan for those- do you get up early enough to allow for these things to go a bit wrong? My work days when I have to get kids ready, dropped off, then to work are much more stressful and I can find myself being unkind. So I have started buying ready made pancakes and frubes. They can eat those in the car if not finished and I just help to get them dressed- I am a teacher, so can't be late. I have my cup etc sitting out and jackets etc ready, snacks done the night before. I can still get stressed but it has helped.
I also tell them "mummy is getting big feelings just now, I will be back in a minute" and leave to take a breath but it is important you, and them can attribute and describe your 'big' feelings,
Lots of perseverance and you will get there!

I don't really get a 'night before' because my kids don't really sleep at night. It's not just mornings, it's any time they are all together that things are awful.

I had a course of anger management years ago and my whole strategy was about walking away, counting to 10 etc. But it's hard to do when my kids follow me. To the point that I used to go the bathroom and do some deep breathing and maybe scream into my hands (silent screaming) or have a wee, but now they have broken the lock, and if I hold the door shut will scream and bang. It makes it worse. I did try saying to them 'mummy needs a time out' and things like that, and we talk about big feelings and how to express emotions a lot. But when they're all shouting it's like I sand even think clearly. I don't feel angry, I feel overwhelmed. I just can't bear the noise. It makes me feel like my brain is broken. When I was a kid I always had a bedroom to escape to, so even if my house was crazy chaotic and loud I had somewhere calm to escape to. Then with my ex one of his greatest tactics was to never let me have any space. He used to go to sleep after me and get up before me and just never leave me alone. So I know that it's obviously triggering for me and I'm not able to use my coping strategies easily either.

Just want to say that I relate so much to what you're saying. I have three kids 6 and under who drive me bananas and I shout much more than I ought to.

Just remember you are doing this alone and that is so very hard, and from the sounds of it trying your best. I bet those kids, for all the chaos, know they're loved!

I think the suggestions about games etc are great. What about instant rewards for good behaviour in the morning like stickers? I think kids definitely respond better to praise.

Here have a and a big glass of from a fellow mum with 3 feral kids. We'll get there in the end!

There are lots of online courses out there for parents who want to stop shouting at their kids, have you given any of them a try? If not why not - and I don't mean that in a shouty way I am interested in what is blocking it for you to get some help with it?

Thank you @yummyscummymummy01 And for you 🍷 💐 cheers

Can't believe it's 9.10pm and nobody is screaming for the first time since 4.10am this morning. Middle child just fell asleep. Eldest watching TV on super high volume while middle child snores on the sofa. Youngest upstairs in his actual bed (win!)

Got just got to make me and eldest some dinner (I know 😬 ), get her to bed, do some housework, wash and tumble their uniforms (because They have actually run out), have a bath, do a vital piece of paperwork and try and get some sleep.

Rinse and repeat.

Things sound very tough and it's not your fault. It feels hard because IT IS HARD. You're only human and all humans would find that situation hard. My daughter can be defiant and nothing worked on her. What did work was finding a tool for myself. I stumbled across a meditation about loving compassion a few months ago and I haven't shouted or got angry really since. (I listen to variations of it everyday) it's helpful to find compassion and loving kindness towards others, but mostly yourself. Took the anger out of a lot of life for me. Good luck x

open.spotify.com/track/1bIqdtU5MrD9iY42XtCQgH?si=SAUISG75SNmixbkxl3-_Qg

@intheblightgarden

Can you suggest any?

I have done two parenting programs in parenting after trauma/DV, a few online courses on child development and worked with a support worker for a while as well, but I am always open to doing more.

I'm not sure whether knowledge is helping me much though. I think it might be a case of 'too many chefs spoiling the broth' and actually I need to go back to basics and forget everything, including all the things I learned in my own upbringing

A thing I've just started doing with my just turned nine year old... so I've written a list of what to do in the morning, step by step on a big bit of cardboard and put it on the dining table so 1. Get dressed, 2. Eat breakfast, 3. Clean away plates etc etc I wrote at the bottom what time we need to leave the house. I gave him a watch and said if he isn't ready to leave the house by that time he won't have telly time on an evening. He was ready 20 minutes early this morning! Usually it's 10 minutes late! I was amazed. No having to nag him to put every item of clothing on or anything. He was so proud of himself too. He kept saying "we are ready ahead of schedule!".

Op I once took my refusnik DD3 to school in her nightie. I had 2 babies [DD4 & DD5] to get ready so simply couldn't dress her too [she was 6 and perfectly capable!]. I strapped her in the car with her uniform in a carrier bag on on her lap and miraculously by the time we got to school she was fully dressed bar her tie which she couldn't yet do herself. The threat of having to go to assembly in her nightdress was enough. This was nearly 30 years ago and ironically she is now an assistant head teacher. We often laugh about that particular incident! Also, if they were fighting in the car I just used to pull over, turn off the engine and stare out of the wind screen without saying a word. They soon got the message. It's really tough when you're out numbered OP.

It sounds really tough for you at the moment. I shout more than I'd like and can really relate to the kids being late and taking an age in the morning. We recently got my eldest DC (nearly 8yo) a watch with an alarm on it and we set alarms for when uts time to brush teeth, when its time to leave for school, when its time to get ready for sports clubs. As soon as the alarm goes I say "oh look your alarm is going what's that for" and DC knows and is getting better at taking responsibility for getting ready. I've found our younger DC copy the eldest so we're putting more attention on eldest behaviour because of this.

The other thing I try to do if kids are shouting is do a reverse. So if they're both shouting at me I pretend I can't hear them and keep saying "louder, louder, I can't hear you". When they get exhausted from shouting at me and talk normally I then say "ah that's better now I can hear you". We also have competitons on who can be the quietest and who can whisper. Sometimes I whisper to them when I want their attention instead of shout.

Weirdly, i also found reading the Mr Men book of Mr Noisy helped everyone!!

[quote ShoutyAnge]@intheblightgarden

Can you suggest any?

I have done two parenting programs in parenting after trauma/DV, a few online courses on child development and worked with a support worker for a while as well, but I am always open to doing more.

I'm not sure whether knowledge is helping me much though. I think it might be a case of 'too many chefs spoiling the broth' and actually I need to go back to basics and forget everything, including all the things I learned in my own upbringing [/quote]
You've clearly worked hard on it, good for you.

A psychologist called Catherine Hallisey I think does some workshops that look helpful but I don't know how much they also focus on parent wellbeing.

A lot of it is around the balance between having strategies you can use with the kids but also for yourself when stressed isn't it.

May be worth speaking to a psychologist 1:1 for some individual tailored support instead?

OP
You need your safe space, to be able to collect yourself.
Can you get someone in to repair the lock on the bathroom door.
And get a lock for your bedroom door as well.
Get earphones so that the screaming is muted.

Have a look at this book, it's a goldmine for what you describe.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/0349431264/ref=asliitlnodl?ie=UTF8&camp=1634&creative=6738&creativeASIN=0349431264&linkCode=as2&tag=wwwessexhypno-21&linkId=8d5fa1274dcc3c644e11b6643f8651b7&fbclid=IwAR12nAbSbOS8JMdXswxVTLrIIZYPGKMk_XQRjZtGGH6IQxgr--mmLoL2lok