To think I'm right and the doctors are wrong?

[Rabbitpoop]

DD is 13yo and has had really bad nausea and stomach ache for 10 days. Shes been off school the whole time and very little appetite. GP thought it was appendix related so sent us to hospital. First surgeon admitted us and said seems like appendix as she only has pain in the exact area of the appendix. Put us on the list for surgery.

Saw another surgeon who said he wanted an ultrasound first. Fair enough. They couldn't see her appendix during the scan but no obvious signs of anything else wrong so surgeon passed us to paeds.

Paediatrician came in and said it is constipation before he even examined her. She isn't constipated at all and the pain is only on the bottom right side in a specific area. I questioned him and pushed back quite a lot as I'm 100% sure this is not constipation. She's had no change in her bowel movements. Paeds said there's no sign of appendicitis in her blood tests so it's unlikely to be appendicitis.

I looked up the NICE guidelines and it says that you can't rule out appendicitis by blood test or ultrasound and that it can present differently in different people. It seems the only real way of telling is laparoscopy/surgery but the surgeons won't do it as she's not writhing in pain.

I don't know what to do. I'm sure it's not constipation and that it's something to do with her appendix. They said they wouldn't give antibiotics either as there's no sign of infection.

I'm worried they're just going to tell us to go home and she'll continue to be off school, feeling sick, barely eating and with a stomach ache.

Any advice?

Did they test her urine for infection?

Sorry ignore my post . Irrelevant

Also, I’m so glad she got the surgery and what an amazing mum you are. We’ll done for it all - sounds a horrible experience . All best wishes x

I’m glad DD had a good night snd seems to be on the mend. Well done that mum

Constipation can usually be seen on x-ray. You could ask GP to refer for an x-ray then rule out the constipation and they might listen to your concerns and consider other diagnosises.

@LunaAndHerMoonDragons

Constipation can usually be seen on x-ray. You could ask GP to refer for an x-ray then rule out the constipation and they might listen to your concerns and consider other diagnosises.

Any chance you could read the whole thread.....or even just the OP's posts there @LunaAndHerMoonDragons?? Things have moved on significantly and your advice is not relevant any more.

@Rabbitpoop - Delighted that your DD is now on the mend. I would consider complaining as they (the doctors and medical staff) will only learn to improve their bedside manner and their understanding of how a patient presents with X or Y or Z if it isn't brushed under the carpet. Please don't let this slide. You have a great timeline of events from what you wrote in this thread which should help.

I'm a healthcare professional. You should definitely still complain. Write a clear summary with timeline, and your particular issues. Just because the surgeon said things were handled as they should have been doesn't mean that they were or they lessons can't be learned. Get PALS involved as they can support.

Copy your MP in any complaint.

@Rabbitpoop

I shared my concerns about what happened with the surgeon this morning and he said that I had "misunderstood" that we were coming in for surgery and that it is normal practice to get outpatients to wait in A&E. I said I was concerned that we'd been told to go home twice without being seen by a doctor and he said the doctors had reviewed the bloods and they were fine so the nurses had done the right thing telling us to go home. He said he had only decided to go ahead with the surgery because we'd come in twice (which doesn't make any sense, we came in once and were told to go home and then come back) and that it is very unusual to have a case of appendicitis where the bloods are normal. Otherwise they would be doing surgery on every child who has stomach ache.

I am in no way convinced by this and its a slight twisting of what happened. It makes me feel there's no point complaining though as the surgeon seemed sure all the right things had been done and processes followed, we were just an atypical case.

I still feel that listening to the patient/parent should be more of a priority and the way we were treated was very bad. Particularly DD being left nil by mouth for so long and the decision that it was constipation without even examining her or listening to her history.

Thankfully it has all ended well but it definitely makes me feel extremely wary of being in a similar position again with my or my family's health.

This is so frustrating, and as another poster said, sounds like absolute arse-covering.

I would usually be reluctant to complain, when the outcome (finally!) was a good one but you & DD have been treated really badly. Certainly medically, but also in terms of humane compassionate care - you both were left with no food & drink for many hours due to their incompetency.

Thankfully you were clear & able to advocate. Someone else might have gone home as you were told, then would have had to come back & go through the whole process again, significantly sicker.

I hope you are finally getting a bit more rest & DD continues to improve. 💐

It's really interesting that the rude posters like @Schmz and the dismissive ones, which while medics, weren't willing to hear OP's points, like @Sickofthesoapbox24 didn't come back to acknowledge that sometimes situations present differently, and OP had a strong sense as a parent that her DD wasn't being treated correctly.

So pleased all is well x

@EarringsandLipstick

It's really interesting that the rude posters like *@Schmz* and the dismissive ones, which while medics, weren't willing to hear OP's points, like *@Sickofthesoapbox24* didn't come back to acknowledge that sometimes situations present differently, and OP had a strong sense as a parent that her DD wasn't being treated correctly.

I don’t think these particular posters were rude apart from one comment from *@Schmz that upset the OP. @Sickofthesoapbox24* merely pointed out the evidence behind how the doctors were reacting and why a child shouldn’t have a CT scan…. Which considering the surgeons who operated have said they’re also baffled it isn’t really surprising.

They also both stated that the OP should sit down and talk with the consultant in charge of her daughters case for answers as there was clearly a breakdown in communication?? I also don’t think that they claimed to be a medic?

Typical mumsnet anybody with an opposing view however valid is cast as a villain.

I’m glad your DD is okay OP.

I didn't say they were rude, other than Schmez.

I do think Sickofthesoapbox was dismissive. She told OP she was UR, and said that the 'wait & see' approach was merited - but this wasn't really OP's concern, it was that a different doctor had insisted on it being constipation with no exam / evidence to support it & she felt she was not being listened to

You're right they didn't say they were a medic, I assumed that from the detailed posts.

Also I didn't say they were a villain! Just that they didn't really hear the OP's concerns, even tho she explained them clearly.

Typical mumsnet anybody with an opposing view however valid is cast as a villain.

One poster called the OP 'hysterical' amongst her other uninformed comments. I don't think that's valid, it's certainly not helpful and I'm happy to say so. In the context of such a poorly child it's a disgusting comment.

I wonder why he did do the surgery then, if all signs pointed to not being needed. He’s not making sense.

God! They could have killed her! Well done for sticking to your guns, trusting your instincts, refusing to be bamboozled by their illogic, and advocating for you daughter.

Just read this thread and OP, I think you’re incredibly brave and a brilliant advocate for your DD. So glad she is on the mend and thank God you pushed for her to get the right care.

Appendicitis nearly killed me when I was 5. I was sick and had stomach pain at school, my mum took me to the GP in the morning who said it was nothing. My mum was still concerned and I was getting feverish so she took me back to another GP in the evening. They realised what it was right away and called the children’s ward to have me admitted immediately. My appendix turned out to have ruptured and I had severe peritonitis which would have shortly led to sepsis and death. I was operated on that night and recovered well thankfully. I think my poor mum is still traumatised by it 28 years later.

It’s admittedly harder to diagnose in very young children but shocking that at her age, your DD’s symptoms weren’t taken seriously.

Discharge in 24 hrs os normal for young fit person . TBH she less likely to get a wound issue at home as you sound like a very sensible Mum. As a health professional I would contact PALS and ask for a review of how the causeway handled. This is a complaint still buy sound less critical. Maybe emphasise you want it to be a learned from incident to teach staff how to handle thing better next time. Sometimes this actually helps staff with issues such as lack of resources or staff. Glad your DD is on the mend.

Sorry for the typos on my phone!

Some appendixes do go home in 24 hours if they recover well, pain is controlled and the op was uneventful. Especially if they do it laparoscopically.

Well done OP. Great to hear your daughter is feeling so much better. And yes they always cover for each other. Did the same with me when I was misdiagnosed. I wish I’d complained formally about my treatment but just wanted to put it behind me. Might be worth you contacting PALS though, things could have been a lot worse if it wasn’t for you.

Wow - OP I am really glad that they have got to the bottom of what was causing your daughter’s pain.

It is incredibly rare to have appendicitis without any rise in inflammatory marker bloods at 10 days.

Someone said that doctors on this thread including me should listen to the patient/ parent more.

I discussed alternative diagnoses but did not say that OP should accept that there was nothing wrong.

One final point OP - please do make sure that you have been told what the histology report from the appendix shows. Usually available 2 weeks after surgery.
Suggest you call the consultant’s secretary in 2 weeks to chase that result.
Very occasionally it shows an usual diagnosis and this happens most commonly in cases where things have not been routine.

I wish your daughter a speedy recovery

Great news the naughty appendix is out.
I'm another vote for a complaint. It's important that procedures are looked into when things like that happen.
I had a piece of wood embedded in my cornea that A&E missed as I wasn't checked properly. I put a complaint in because I don't want that to happen to someone else.

Someone said that doctors on this thread including me should listen to the patient/ parent more.

I'm not sure if you are referring to my post Olympic but if so I didn't include you intentionally, as I recognise you did indeed encourage further communication between OP & the doctors re possible diagnoses. 🙂