Insomnia is ruining my life. Is there anything else I can do?

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I’m 47 and absolutely knackered all the time. It’s effecting my relationships and making me depressed and anxious.
I’ve been on HRT for 6 months, and now on an oestrogen patch of 75 (for 6 weeks). I’ve cut out caffeine, I don’t drink alcohol, I go to bed and get up at the same time each day, I don’t eat after 6pm, I exercise regularly and am not overweight. I get outside in the morning daylight, I don’t go on my phone in the evening, I take multivitamins, vitamin d omega 3 and evening primrose, I’ve tried mindfulness. I tried CBD and Nytol 50 mg which made absolutely no difference.
I’m desperate for a good nights sleep. I can generally get to sleep, no problem but wake after a few hours. Is there anything I’ve not tried? Help!

Another life long sufferer here. Magnesium Citrate, be careful not to take more than 300mg, and phenergan both help me. I buy online as GPS hate prescribing sleep aids. I tried melatonin, various doses, it was a little effective but not noteworthy, similarly nytol (the one that isn't valerian) also did nothing. So valerian and calms, anything herbal is too weak to touch the sides. But there are days when magnesium citrate and phenergan just stop working and I come of for a week or three and grit my teeth until they start working again!

Your problem is an active mind. You may be physically relaxed, even doped up on melatonin or some other wheeze but your mind is chattering away and won't give you rest.
Talk with your GP - see if he will refer you to a sleep specialist.

Have you tried an Epsom salt bath in the evening ?
Have you tried drinking pure cherry juice ?

Have you tried Sleep Station OP? It’s CBT for sleep. In some parts of the Uk you can get it for free on the NHS, I paid for mine but it’s been worth the money and I never thought I would see my sleep improve. It’s not perfect now but it’s better. Would highly recommend and I’ve tried it all including HRT

I’m an awful sleeper. I woke up 5 times last night to go to the loo.

Melatonin didn’t really work for me and as understand it can help you gets to sleep but not stay asleep (and that is my problem).

Couple of things. If you don’t eat after 6pm could you be hungry? Low blood sugar waking you up? I read somewhere a protein snack before bed can help (especially if active/doing lots of exercise) so I often have Greek yoghurt with granola and honey.
I take Cherry night powder too.

The main thing that can help is sleep restriction. Sounds counter intuitive I know but sometimes can do a reset. You don’t say what time you go to bed but I had good results from going to bed later (and still getting up at the same time). You apparently need to create a ‘sleep hunger’ and be really tired when you go to bed (so you don’t lie there stressing).

I thought I’d tried everything but going to bed later and getting up at the same early time did have an impact. Also accepting I’m a night owl. That even though I feel like I’ve had shit sleep and I’m so tired I want to go to bed, my natural body clock simply won’t let me go to sleep at 10pm no matter how much I would love to!!

I sometimes jolt awake in the early hours..Active brain I think. Worse if I've had a busy day.

I find lying there trying to nod off does not work for me, so I get up, make a herb tea, and do some low level browsing, eg search ebay for a new teacosy or something boring and nonessential. I find fiction is too exciting, as I keep on reading! After an hour or less I make myself a hotwater bottle and go back to bed. I find being slightly cool, then getting warm again, sends me off.

Wow this is brilliant thanks so much. I thought I’d exhausted everything but there’s loads of excellent suggestions I haven’t tried yet. I’ve definitely got an over active mind which I really struggle to switch off in the middle of the night, so I’m interested to find out about sleep CBT. You’ve all given me hope I really appreciate it.

I use melatonin gummies, magnesium supplement, warm bath & keep a fan on in the bedroom
My husband rates ashwaganda for sleep but I found it gave me crazy dreams

After a recommendation on here I bought Kirkland's Sleep Aid from the USA and it works beautifully- much better than melatonin and phenergan ( although both work to a degree).

Also try white noise; I find it surprisingly effective.

i used to get it horrendously too.

the only thing that worked for me was to never ever ever look at the time when i pinged awake. then i had no idea how long i'd been awake for or what time it was and it really worked for me. plus going to bed cold helps. feet outside the duvet. etc etc.

I had given up but then someone on here recommended ‘The women’s guide to insomnia’ which is really good and has loads of tips to try that I hadn’t before. And obviously tailored to women and the hormonal issues that can be behind sleep issues.

I know you’ve got lots of suggestions but I have one that’s not been mentioned. A temperature regulating pillow called Moona. I had tried absolutely everything and one frustrated night I ordered it and now I only have occasional insomnia. It’s a bit pricey but after so long with insomnia it was worth every penny!

I realise in hindsight that I was suffering from peri menopause insomnia. I'd wake at 3am like clockwork with an overactive mind. Sometimes quite unpleasant intrusive thoughts. Often lay awake for a couple of hours, then struggle waking on my 6am alarm.
Things that helped (apart from going from peri to menopause): a half hour walk, come what may, after dinner, followed by a hot bath.
Then read, a proper book not kindle, till I can barely keep my eyes open. Late as I could get. Alarm goes off at 5.30 now, even on days off. That routine helps. If I wake at night, I do box breathing, breath in for 3, hold 3, breath out 3, hold 3, in 3 and so on. Or, deep breath through nose for count of 4 then blow out through pursed lips for a count of 6. It's quite hard to have many thoughts when I concentrate on those breathing exercises, so generally nod off quite quickly now.

The rare occasions I really can't sleep (if I'm anxious about say work or a family member) I get up and either read or listen to a sleepy story on Spotify. It's also been suggested by an insomniac friend to do a burst of exercise like press ups or jumping jacks. Sounds counter-intuitive but it's worked the couple of times I tried it.
Some really good strategies on this thread. I hope something works!

I had exactly the same, OP. I tried everything to no avail. Mertazipine works for me. No morning hangover, it's changed my life. It also keeps a lid on my anxiety.

Dammit wrote a long reply and got deleted. Basically get cbti, a counsellor, look into anxiety, magnesium, and medication from gp.

Also over-the-counter hypnosis. I know Paul McKenna is a charmless sod, but his sleep hypnosis works a treat when I have a run of insomnia. Get the book from the library, get the recording onto your phone, listen as you go to sleep. Works a treat when I am going through a phase of insomnia.

But also votes for magnesium - the oil is also good straight into your skin after a bath - and melatonin (try Biovea online, theirs is good). Also the sleep stories on Headspace. As you can tell, mine has been going on for a while, but it is mostly controllable

Get sleepy on Amazon music is good.
Chinese Acupuncture is worth a try, worked for me for migraines. My person does it for insomnia too.

Michael sealey has a lot of sleep meditation videos on you tube. Free and worth a try straight away.

I was going through this earlier this year. I found a really good YouTube vid. I’ll try and find it for you.

Magnolia bark massively improved my sleep.

It was a yoga nidra one. About 20 mins long. I did it twice before bed to practice. Then I put it on when I woke and fell asleep again.

I think mines due to an overactive mind. I was really struggling with some stuff earlier this year and I ended up barely sleeping. I’d wake in a panic every few hours through the night. The yoga nidra was very useful.

Have you had your calcium levels checked?

Have you tried reading constitutional law cases? My sil recommended it to me and they are so dry and boring you’ll fall asleep while reading them. If you don’t you’re learning something new.

In all seriousness I’ve suffered insomnia all my life but perimenopause has really upped its game. I’ve discovered keeping my mind occupied helps so I often fall asleep watching tv - as soon as I turn it off I’m wide awake but if I put it back on I doze I. and out of sleep which is better than nothing

I've considered myself a terrible sleeper most of my adult life - waking in the early morning with lots of active thoughts. Have tried loads of things -best of which was having a notebook by the bed to write things down before going back to sleep, other things - great at getting me to sleep but didn't solve the waking problem.
Then about a year ago I read an article about the history of biphasic sleep. It was like a penny had dropped. And now I don't worry about waking, I just think of myself as having a "first sleep" and "second sleep" with some time in between - and it's stopped me worrying about insomnia, and am getting more sleep overall.

This article is one of several on the subject
www.bbc.com/future/article/20220107-the-lost-medieval-habit-of-biphasic-sleep

I use chlorphenamine (piriton) which is a sedative antihistamine. Helps a little.

I also have the Kirkland Sleepaid tablets which do work but my God do they make me feel awful in the morning.

I am about to start HRT and helping that will help.

Insomnia is horrendous and mine is made much worse by increased stress of a new job.

Certainly would not try any Z drugs, nor benzo’s or any antidepressants really unless suffering from depression as they all have side effects and can be difficult to come off.

Dr’s are very unlikely to prescribe zopiclone or zolpidem nowadays anyway.

I keep my room as cold as I can bear it (16 degrees) and listen on low volume to a very boring podcast. (Today in Parliament is my current favourite) I think what you need is a "trigger" that tells your brain it's time to turn off now. So even if you wake up in the night you set your "trigger" off and your brain knows what it needs to do. For me it's a podcast on low. Try it, or maybe there's something else that works well for you.