AIBU to be totally confused (cost of living crisis)

[LittleBitHeiressLittleBitIris]

AIBU to not be able to understand/ grasp the scale of impending disaster that is building over the increased cost of living?

I genuinely don't see how millions of people with outgoings that are about to be actually higher than income is going to play out.

I'm not trying to be goady and obviously realise no-one has a crystal ball but am I missing something? Has this ever happened before in other recent times/ other cultures and what was the result. I can't even imagine what could happen.

I feel really clueless! Any ideas/ opinions/ further reading much appreciated 👍

Minor point, but my kids still do wear older sibling's hand me down clothes, shoes and underwear. Isn't that just sensible?

@parboil

Minor point, but my kids still do wear older sibling's hand me down clothes, shoes and underwear. Isn't that just sensible?

I thought it was quite normal too, we've done the same. Saves the hassle of buying a whole new wardrobe each time.

I did wonder the same as you OP, although I will admit the rising costs aren't going to affect us so I did keep in mind that I don't know other people's situations so can't assume anything.

What I don't understand is the universal council tax discount and apparent £200 off energy bills (that will need to be paid back). We don't need either but will be getting them regardless. Surely it would be better to offer it, then when some households inevitably refuse it, it can be given to others who really need it? We'll no doubt be pestered for bank details too since they use your direct debit bank details, which we haven't provided.

@parboil

Minor point, but my kids still do wear older sibling's hand me down clothes, shoes and underwear. Isn't that just sensible?

I think the underwear is a bit unusual honestly: I’m from a large & thrifty family and that’s not something I’ve heard of

10bn coffee shop economy in this country. House prices never been higher.

Yet food bank use soaring and people are genuinely worried about the gas bill.

We'll all have to do what we can to save money. That might include moving in with people you're related to but can't stand.

Clothes and shoes were mended at home

I mended our shoes. I was lousy at it. To be fair, cardboard doesn't last long when you've basically got a 3x2.5 inch hole in the soles of a shoe, particularly not in a rainy area or that part of year. And I did my best to wax sewing cotton to try and stitch shoes but, tbh, it was never going to work even when I doubled it up, and a standard sewing bodkin wasn't what was needed.

I'm forgiving myself though because I was very young and had no idea what I was doing. I know there are YouTube videos now but even so…

I should say that wearing hand-me down shoes wrecked my elder sister's feet from childhood onwards. By the time the shoes were passed to me I was their 3rd or 4th wearer and they were so distorted that they couldn't really do me much harm but they were already worn through at the soles.

EmbarrassingHadrosaurus

Shoes can ne mended at home, my father was pretty good at it. Soles would never be allowed to get so thin as to develop holes.
My dad would cut up pieces of old leather school bags and fix them to soles, rubber heels were fitted to new shoes before they were worn.
My dad had a cast iron cobblers anvil- he learned how to repair shoes from his father.
We have lost these skills- even simple tasks like darning worn woolen clothes.

@Fairisleflora

And your pensions savings get taken off your salary before your salary gets taxed, because your pensions savings get taxed when you draw on them later on in life instead. You aren’t taxed twice.

I didn't mean they tax you on your pension when you contribute it, I meant that you get taxed on your income when you work then have to pay NI which is in essence another tax. Then for those who will be privileged enough to retire before they die (state pension age is a joke) you will be taxed on your pension income too. That's what I meant.

@speakout

EmbarrassingHadrosaurus

Shoes can ne mended at home, my father was pretty good at it. Soles would never be allowed to get so thin as to develop holes.
My dad would cut up pieces of old leather school bags and fix them to soles, rubber heels were fitted to new shoes before they were worn.
My dad had a cast iron cobblers anvil- he learned how to repair shoes from his father.
We have lost these skills- even simple tasks like darning worn woolen clothes.

Hands up, as I said, I wasn't good at it. Some of that was down to resources and the fact that our shoes already had holes in before they were passed to us.

As a matter of interest, can you repair shoes? Do you still have your father's cobbler's anvil with access to leather to cut up to resole shoes?

EmbarrassingHadrosaurus

Yes I still have the anvil- and I helped him a lot as a child, so I could make a fair job at some shoe repairs.
I do repair some clothes, but I have no financial need to repair my shoes.
My time is limited and I have money to replace stuff.

I'm place marking really. Have been reading the thread on and off all day.

I'm in the camp of already turned the heating off this winter and ds and I have basically been living in our bedrooms when home. I bought myself a heated throw and live under it. We very rarely use the oven, don't run a car, already on cheap giffgaff sim only deals, etc. My trouble is rent and council tax. They swallow a massive proportion of my income and can't be reduced. I have been trying to get extra hours or promotion for a couple of years and am hoping something should come through with that by September.

Slightly irrelevant but in defence of streaming services it is cheaper to, as I do, not watch live tv and therefore not pay for a tv licence and have netflix instead plus access to free on demand channels other than bbc.

The scary bit is housing insecurity. If my landlord decided to sell tomorrow we could be homeless because on paper my income isn't high enough to satisfy estate agents that I can afford even the lowest rents available and they don't take the fact you've been paying your rent reliably for 4 years as proof you can afford it but want instead someone in full time permanent employment who earns 30x the monthly rent per year and they don't include child maintenance or universal credit top ups in calculations.

I have to manage for another few years to see ds through secondary education.

A life that is considered OK enough to survive at the lowest common denominator is not a society that the country deserves or should ever be content with.

Shame on Britain for leaving people to struggle daily while at the same time expecting them to have a job and pay dearly to commute to said job and increase NI on said job and still not be able to afford a basic lifestyle without penury at home.

Enough. A country is judged on how it treats its most vulnerable. But it seems to me that as long as you aren't falling dead in the road from hunger that's OK Jack. Very sad state of affairs and should not be happening to anyone in 2022.

Anyone who tells me to eat porridge or grow veg will get a punch between the eyes from me for being so condescending.

The workhouse was better than expecting people who are actually working to live in workhouse conditions.

@Myee

A life that is considered OK enough to survive at the lowest common denominator is not a society that the country deserves or should ever be content with.

Shame on Britain for leaving people to struggle daily while at the same time expecting them to have a job and pay dearly to commute to said job and increase NI on said job and still not be able to afford a basic lifestyle without penury at home.

Enough. A country is judged on how it treats its most vulnerable. But it seems to me that as long as you aren't falling dead in the road from hunger that's OK Jack. Very sad state of affairs and should not be happening to anyone in 2022.

Anyone who tells me to eat porridge or grow veg will get a punch between the eyes from me for being so condescending.

The workhouse was better than expecting people who are actually working to live in workhouse conditions.

I agree with every word except for the last sentence - on a point of pedantry I don't agree. Some workhouses had hand cranks which people were required to turn all day because in a curiously prescient forerunner of some MN posters, the people who ran the workhouses felt that people must perform some work in order not to starve, even though the "work" was cranking a handle all day that did nothing at all. Things are bad but they haven't got as bad as the workhouses - yet.

There's definitely a sense on some of these threads that people would like us to go back to the bad old days; almost like we should live a more simple life.

It gives me the rage to think about it. 3 generations before me worked and made sacrifices so their children, and ultimately me, could have better lives. I have been doing the same for my children.
But for what? So we can go back to those days? Because of the choices our fucking government make?

I teach full time. Yes, I should be protected from the absolute worst, for now. But not if dh loses his job Because people stop spending. I don't have time to shop in various places for the cheapest stuff. I don't have time to mend things. I can't get to work without a car. I spend money on school supplies and printing.

The old days were shit. That's why we didn't continue to live that way. My dgf remembers hanging around the train tracks for stray lumps of coal to burn. The village had a boot fund, as you needed boots for school but not everyone had a pair. His family couldn't afford a coffin, when his little brother died. It. Was. Bollocks. And we shouldn't just shrug our shoulders and say:"oh well, needs must." Because I bet a lot of those exhorting us to put up with it, or,as they inevitably will, that we're in it together, won't be.

@daimbarsatemydogsbone

The workhouse reference is analogous to work that (as you say) achieves nothing for the worker today either except a misery of existence and not enjoying any of the fruits of labour.

If you work you should enjoy some benefits from that. From what I read here there is little to enjoy if your take home does not meet basic living standards anymore. It is a total disgrace.

And we shouldn't just shrug our shoulders and say:"oh well, needs must." Because I bet a lot of those exhorting us to put up with it, or,as they inevitably will, that we're in it together, won't be.

Exactly - fuck that.
I plan to retire somewhere where they don't hate old people, and don't always keep trying to outdo each other in a race to the bottom with their voting habits.

These arguments always go out to the extremes. I agree that the romanticisation of 'simpler times' when life was all make do and mend, is largely nonsense. However, it is also true that consumerism and disposable culture have reached extreme levels in recent years, and that this is simply not sustainable (environmentally as well as financially. You don't need to hark back to huddling round a candle and only having a bath once a month to argue that perhaps people don't need to replace their iPhones every two years and fret about whether they've put enough tat in their kids' Christmas Eve boxes? Surely there is a middle ground, no?

@EngTech

I remember filing down old half pennies to put in the electricity meter

It is going to be rough and people will cut back I.e. Ditch Sky, Netflix, holidays etc

That will have an impact ie Less disposable income which will filter through the food, supply chain

We are in a rough ride but the cost of cheap petrol does not sit easy with me if the price is at the cost of dead Ukrainian people, children 😔

The problem is such a lot these days is on contracts . So not easy to get out of . Especially sky!

I still can’t get my head round the fact that a phone contract could pay for a holiday each year .

Car contracts / phones/ tv contracts are all going to be hard to get out of .

@parboil

Minor point, but my kids still do wear older sibling's hand me down clothes, shoes and underwear. Isn't that just sensible?

Sa out 50 years ago we had one jumper that was passed between 6 cousins . It wore very well and can be seen in many family photos . Was not very nice being the youngest cousin .

My dad actually had a knitting machine and made some cracking designs .

@parboil

These arguments always go out to the extremes. I agree that the romanticisation of 'simpler times' when life was all make do and mend, is largely nonsense. However, it is also true that consumerism and disposable culture have reached extreme levels in recent years, and that this is simply not sustainable (environmentally as well as financially. You don't need to hark back to huddling round a candle and only having a bath once a month to argue that perhaps people don't need to replace their iPhones every two years and fret about whether they've put enough tat in their kids' Christmas Eve boxes? Surely there is a middle ground, no?

I think that all of us are now closely looking at our budgets and cutting down . But I appreciate there are people who are already on the limit .

It’s quite hard for the government to get the funds to the right people without full means testing .

@HardbackWriter

It either won't hit as hard as currently predicted or the government will have to take some action, however reluctantly. It's a bit like very early in Covid before furlough was announced and people were saying that the government would just leave people to lose their homes etc on UC because that would be typical of a Tory government. But actually - and with hindsight this is completely obvious - they had no choice but to act or to see the entire economy collapse. This is the same. They don't want to act and they're going to put it off if they can. But ultimately, just like it turned out we suddenly had bottomless money for Covid, help will be found if it's that or total economic collapse and that's what no intervention under the scenarios currently being bandied about would mean.

Yes, this is what I think too. know the government has no investment in us as individuals but I can't imagine that they could let the economy collapse in the way it inevitably would without intervention.

@Myee

A life that is considered OK enough to survive at the lowest common denominator is not a society that the country deserves or should ever be content with.

Shame on Britain for leaving people to struggle daily while at the same time expecting them to have a job and pay dearly to commute to said job and increase NI on said job and still not be able to afford a basic lifestyle without penury at home.

Enough. A country is judged on how it treats its most vulnerable. But it seems to me that as long as you aren't falling dead in the road from hunger that's OK Jack. Very sad state of affairs and should not be happening to anyone in 2022.

Anyone who tells me to eat porridge or grow veg will get a punch between the eyes from me for being so condescending.

The workhouse was better than expecting people who are actually working to live in workhouse conditions.

What is wrong with eating porridge and growing vegetables ? My parents have done that all their lives ? My dad also never earnt more than 70 pounds per week in the 80s working 60 hours per week .

I think you are the one being condescending . Some people have lived frugally all their lives .

My parents never wasted money at all . And are both in their 90s now and it’s the first time they have had help to pay for care .

I can't imagine that they could let the economy collapse in the way it inevitably would without intervention

I genuinely can’t see what they can do. Most of the cost pressures are on commodities we import so they have no control over prices. If they reduce taxes we’ll have to accept even more deterioration of services which will impact disproportionately on the poorest. They’ve already borrowed to the hilt.

@Unsure33 £70 in 1975 is equivalent to £624 today, so £32k a year. Not a low wage.

@parboil great post, there is middle ground, unnecessary extravagances are out the window for many now, I never entertained Christmas Eve boxes thank god !!

The scary bit is housing insecurity. If my landlord decided to sell tomorrow we could be homeless because on paper my income isn't high enough to satisfy estate agents that I can afford even the lowest rents available and they don't take the fact you've been paying your rent reliably for 4 years as proof you can afford it but want instead someone in full time permanent employment who earns 30x the monthly rent per year and they don't include child maintenance or universal credit top ups in calculations.

I'm in exactly this situation, after 9 happy years with a fantastic landlord he is selling up at the worst possible time for me. I'm in a constant state of anxiety and feeling sick. That's on top of all the other bills going up. It's hell.