Asking to be made redundant instead of going down the maternity discrimination route? Advice needed!

[Poppysmummy92]

Hello!

Some back story -

I joined my employer in December 2020. In January 2021 I told my manager I was 20 weeks pregnant and after that it went VERY downhill. My manager left unexpectedly and didn’t tell anyone, so for weeks I was trying to find out what I was meant to be doing and who I was reporting to as at the time it was a 100% WFH environment so I was completely on my own. I didn’t really get any contact from anyone until March 2021 when I finally was given a stand in manager who swiftly hired my maternity cover and I went on maternity leave in April 2021. In October 2021 I had an email saying they had appointed a new manager and he would be in touch but I didn’t hear anything. In November 2021 I emailed my contact and said could someone please contact me as I was due back in January 2022 and I had no idea who my manager was and what I was coming back too but nobody replied. In December 2021 I raised a formal complaint with HR as I genuinely believe as soon as I told my employer I was pregnant they wrote me off, and the communication since I’ve been off has been shocking.

So anyway, fast forward to today and the new manager has finally been in touch. He was prompted off the back of my grievance! He called and said he was sorry and he would look at options for my return and look into the grievance. I didn’t have any review meetings during my time at the company so I’ve never been given the opportunity to tell anyone that the job is not for me and it’s not something I want to return to and I told the new manager I wasn’t keen to return. Again, he has vanished and isn’t replying to my emails!

I get the feeling he is waiting for me to get fed up and resign. But I want some sort of compensation for the stress they put me under and their incredibly poor practice. I really want to ask them to make me redundant, but is that even possible?!

I’m just wondering if anyone had any advice on what I can do. The grievance route will be very very long winded, I work in employee relations I know the process to an extent. I just want to make it easier for everyone and leave, but not empty handed!

Any advice I’d be forever grateful this is causing me daily stress!!

I think if you have a genuine case for maternity discrimination you should pursue that rather than ask for redundancy. I assume most companies would only consider redundancy if e.g. they were restructuring and a position was no longer needed. If someone was unhappy in their post or not up to the role they would be managed out or expected to resign.
I experienced maternity discrimination and took my employer to an employment tribunal- it is not always easy to prove as you would have to demonstrate that how they treated you was related to your pregnancy (they might argue, for example that much of your situation was brought about by unexpected lockdowns this time last year, wfh and your manager leaving etc.)
I think you might also need to show that the company acted unlawfully not just an individual (in the example you gave they might be able to say that your old manager shouldn’t have made that comment, but they were unaware?)
My employer offered me a settlement before the tribunal hearing, based on a schedule of loss I provided which set out and evidenced my costs/ losses (legal fees, childcare etc.) so it is possible and worth pursuing if you think you have a case. I found that ACAS were able to offer me really helpful advice throughout, though even they admitted that maternity discrimination is on of the most difficult areas of employment law!

If you are 'trained in HR' then you'll know you aren't entitled to stat redundancy until 2 yrs service, so you are asking for paid notice and holidays? You'd also know they won't want to make you redundant, because that's fraudulent, the role is still there and they need someone to do it, it just doesn't sound like you are the right person for it. What you'd be looking for realistically is a settlement agreement on the basis of the discrimination, but unless your other examples are stronger than what you've posted, I doubt you'd get very much. You can raise early conciliation via ACAS and they may offer a small amount to make it go away as it would be cheaper than fighting it...but imo you are a chancer. Save everyone the hassle and move on!

I'm not sure what it is you want. You started at the company in December, and started your maternity leave in April. I'm assuming you hadn't been there long enough for a performance review, and also management changed. You don't want the job, and didn't like it for the 4 months you did do it, but don't want to quit. Even though if you had of had a review you would have quit. And now you'd like to be sacked so you can request compensation for not being treated fairly. I'd quit and get a new job. If the new manager does a proper return to work, what will you do? Keep the job?

I would say the best you will get is an ex gratia payment maybe instead of notice and a bit of dhut up money if you have documented evidence of what has been happening. I would go for constructive dismissal or similar if you can rather than mat discrim - its easy to prove a such and could be similar evidence.

It does sound like a complete cluster fuck so I would sit down and objectively list what has happened and what evidence youhave - I would also do an information request so you can see what has happened within emails in particular between various managers and HR then around your grievance.

You may have to go through internal processes first, if they seem like a no brainer and you have an eidenced claim - then I would go for a negotiated settlement. I would speak to ACAS for factual stuff and get yourself a lwyer to start warning shots and present your case in a way that exploits your evidence well.

How long she has worked or not worked is irreleant. On principle in my mind they need the book throwing at them for being so fucking useless. I have no sympathy for the company - they should know a damn site better

Actually the only way how long she has worked there is relevant is due to the 2 yr clause

You sound like a pain in the arse

Fingers crossed you get laughed out of the HR Directors office.

How much exactly do you think you are “entitled” to? Zero redundancy pay, a paper thin “discrimination” case, … you haven’t been through the full grievance process .. it will end up costing you to go through the Tribunal … and even if you were to win your case (unlikely on current evidence) you would be entitled to much of a pay out anyway.

Personally I’d be tempted give you £5k to leave, as you sound like incredibly hard work- which I guess is what you are banking on.

You can’t possibly work in HR

😂🤦🙄

If you work in HR you would know that a person is not made redundant- the role is. That means that the role is no longer required by the business and so the person doing that role is redeployed or given a payment. Your role is not being made redundant and so you would not be due any payment or option to move to another role in the business. You either go back and do your job or resign.

@GoBrookeYourself

Also why should you not leave empty handed? You’ve worked there (not including maternity) for a grand total of 5 months, what exactly do you think you’re owed?

⬆️

Next you will be telling us your employer is nhs 🙄

@BurntO

You sound like a pain in the arse

I think so too. It’s annoying because it’s people like OP that make employers hesitant to hire youngish women.

If this isn't a windup, people like you are the problem.

Did you go back in January ? Why not if not? What exactly is your claim for discrimination if your job was there to go back to? Are you after some free money to find your extended maternity period if you haven't gone back?

People are not made redundant, the role or the job is made redundant. If your role and/or job is still there then you can't ask for redundancy.

Sounds like you should follow up the grievance but it may still not be discrimination. What efforts have you made to contact them. Did you request KIT days? Did you give formal notice of returning? Are you now back at work? If your job still exists, and by having cover in place it suggests it does, you are not redundant.

Wait a minute.
So you were due to return in Jan 2022.
It’s now mid-Feb 2022z
What have you been doing for the past month? Have you been allowed to work in your current role, just with no contact from manager?

Do you mean to say you haven’t been allowed back into your role? Is that what you mean by ‘maternity discrimination’?
You can try contacting pregnant then screwed.

You won't be entitled to a redundancy payment with less than two years' service.

The time limit for bringing a tribunal claim is three months minus one day from the act of discrimination. If it is a series of acts, they may take earlier things into account but you'd still need something within the last three months.

A settlement agreement could work - but you'd need to be clear what you are asking for and why, and they are under absolutely no obligation to accept.

If you work in HR/ER, you should be clear on the above.

ok, maybe you go down the settlement route and part of that is an agreed reference - you can smell these a mile off and any HR team worth their salt will see this and potentially remove any employment offer. Would I want someone who was settled out in my team? Especially if it was after such a short term of employment with that company.

I hate to say it but you are really chancing your arm and if you want to stay within HR, I would resign and move on to a new role.

Unless you have solid evidence of discrimination (the 2-year minus stat notice period doesn't apply as pregnancy is a protected characteristic) and if they have your saying the job is not for you in writing, you have a very poor case and any HR director/Manager will advise the business to stand firm and not pay over what is contractually applicable.

You could try to go down the constructive dismissal claim but again this is very hard to prove.

Yes you could ask for a settlement but I don't understand why your business would go for this. I expect you were hired via an agency so have already cost them 10-20% of your salary in fees for 5-months work. You then expect them to pay you to leave, as from what I can see from your posts is piss poor communication and being in HR you could have pushed for this and raised it as it happened.

I hate to be harsh, but resign and hold your head high. Weak claims like this, make it harder for genuine cases to be heard and respected.

OP, you have to have put in a discrimination case within 3 months of the incident. If you haven't included that message in your original complaint, it's useless now.
And please don't listen to PPs - there is no chance in hell they'll pay you £5K..You'll be lucky to get a week's wages.

Please don’t leave, one of us might end up with you

Sounds like you’ve done f all apart from being a complete pita. You role is not redundant so you won’t get anything. If the job isn’t for you, get a different job.

Man alive, I feel for your company.

Sigh... it’s bloody chancers like this that put companies off hiring women.

Will you owe mat pay back if you leave now? If so, one option is to request that this is wiped clean so you benefit from being able to leave without paying back. That’s a pretty easy one for them to give. If you also have holiday accrued and can get that paid on exit in addition, that’s even better for you and again may be more palatable for them to give.

Did you tell them you were pregnant when you were interviewed or did you wait until you were hired? You said you interviewed in December 2020 and were 20 weeks in Jan 2021?
I think you’re chancing your luck for a payout because the idea of having to actually work for your money doesn’t sit well with you. People like you make me sick.