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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

AIBU to ask about friend's finances?

51 replies

sabrinas86 · 31/01/2022 16:01

I've just spent a couple of days away with a wonderful friend who seems to be having constant money problems. She's single and works full time in a supervisor position and doesn't have children. She doesn't seem to go out much or have any huge extravagances.

I had originally booked the trip with another friend who was unable to go and this other woman volunteered to come. Due to pandemic uncertainty, we agreed that she wouldn't pay my friend back for the event tickets we had until they had actually gone ahead. We've known about this for a few months.

The day before we left, she messaged me to say that she hadn't budgeted for the events and would it be ok to give me the money in 3 weeks time when she gets paid? I said that was ok (because I didn't know what else to say!) and I've paid my friend back myself because I don't see why she should have to wait.

The restaurants we went to were really reasonable (think chain restaurants a step up from McDonalds) and neither of us were drinking over the weekend. When the bill came on the first night she seemed embarrassed and asked if I could put it on my card. I did and she promised to pay me back. The same happened the next night. She's said she'll bank transfer me on payday for her food and the events.

DH and I keep finances separate and have a joint account for bills etc but as soon as I got home he asked if she paid for anything. I explained she will pay me back in 3 weeks time and he pointed out this means she got paid a week ago and also she had several months notice and that she shouldn't have agreed to the trip when she couldn't afford it.

She's brilliant company and a great friend but seems to be absolutely terrible with money and I don't want to exclude her from anything but I feel bad constantly fronting her the money and then feeling like I'm bankrupting her every payday.

OP posts:

IsDaveThere · 31/01/2022 16:06

I wouldn't be booking anything or going anywhere with her without getting the money up front in future and I would probably write this one off as well.

I don't know how anyone could go away for a couple of days, knowing full well that they didn't have the money to even buy their meals. She was so embarrassed at asking on night 1, that she did it again on night 2!

Original poster

sabrinas86 · 31/01/2022 16:08

@IsDaveThere

I wouldn't be booking anything or going anywhere with her without getting the money up front in future and I would probably write this one off as well.

She has never ever not paid when she's said she will.

OP posts:

skipperjonce · 31/01/2022 16:09

She’s not a brilliant friend. She’s a user. Better write that money off now.

MichelleScarn · 31/01/2022 16:10

You're not excluding her for not bankrolling her. What would she have done of you couldn't have done so?

Original poster

sabrinas86 · 31/01/2022 16:11

@skipperjonce

She’s not a brilliant friend. She’s a user. Better write that money off now.

She's never ever not paid me back for something. She transfers the money on the day she gets paid and without reminder.

OP posts:

grapewine · 31/01/2022 16:12

If she has paid you previously as promised, make sure she does again. And then don't book anything in the future without her giving you the money upfront.

Salmakia · 31/01/2022 16:22

I don't think you are unreasonable to ask about her finances in this case and you can approach it gently. She has always paid you back when she says she would but perhaps she is in a cycle of borrowing from friends and family every month, paying them all back on pay day and then not being able to socialise as all her disposable income has gone on paying back friends. Maybe ask her if there is something you can do to help as you noticed she seemed to be struggling on your trip? Maybe suggest doing a no spend month together where you meet up for walks in the park, take travel mugs with drinks from home and stuff because having to not see anyone while she gets back on track with money would be really isolating for her. There might be something bigger going on that she is struggling with but afraid to raise and giving her an opening could let her seek support from a debt charity or something.

Original poster

sabrinas86 · 31/01/2022 16:25

@Salmakia

This is a really helpful response, thank you.

I did worry that maybe she's borrowing a lot and that's why she's completely wiped out on payday.

A no spend month would be an excellent idea. She's working from home just now and I don't think the isolation of not seeing friends would be good for her.

OP posts:

Museumland · 31/01/2022 16:34

Probably against the grain here. I had a not dissimilar situation with a friend but on balance l felt pushing the matter could make her feel awkward and embarrassed, I let it go on the basis that it was a one off incident and my friendship meant more to me. If it's a long term friend and you can afford it, I would let it go. If it's not then I would ask again...

Original poster

sabrinas86 · 31/01/2022 16:38

@Museumland

She has never not paid me back and I do trust that she always will. She's a good friend that I don't want to lose but I'm a little bit concerned as to where all her money is going. It would be awkward for both of us to bring it up though.

OP posts:

Chely · 31/01/2022 16:55

Stop doing that. She has to learn to manage money herself and you keep offering a crutch allowing her to do things she can't afford at the time and not willing/able to save for.

I doubt she will appreciate you asking how she currently manages her money.

Pearlyqueen21 · 31/01/2022 16:55

It seems odd that she didn’t offer to put one of the meals on a credit card during your trip, so it sounds to me like she’s carrying a lot of CC debt. Paying that each payday could instantly bring her down to rock bottom - it’s a cycle some of us can get into too easily. I managed to run up CC debt over the last few years, just stuff here and there that I didn’t pay off straight away. Before you know it you have a few grand that you can’t budge.
I think it would be nice to raise it, as pp said, assuming your friendship is that close. Offering to support her in a No Spend month, and maybe keeping social stuff very low cost, might be just what she needs. Financial problems are very isolating, and can bring a lot of shame IME. Sounds like you’re a good friend.

Original poster

sabrinas86 · 31/01/2022 16:59

@Pearlyqueen21

It seems odd that she didn’t offer to put one of the meals on a credit card during your trip, so it sounds to me like she’s carrying a lot of CC debt. Paying that each payday could instantly bring her down to rock bottom - it’s a cycle some of us can get into too easily. I managed to run up CC debt over the last few years, just stuff here and there that I didn’t pay off straight away. Before you know it you have a few grand that you can’t budge. I think it would be nice to raise it, as pp said, assuming your friendship is that close. Offering to support her in a No Spend month, and maybe keeping social stuff very low cost, might be just what she needs. Financial problems are very isolating, and can bring a lot of shame IME. Sounds like you’re a good friend.

She used to have a CC and about six months into lockdown in our friends groupchat myself and another friend had remarked how we had cleared all our CC's as we hadn't been going anywhere for months and this woman said that she had been the opposite.

I think you might be onto something with that because I think if she had space on a CC she'd have offered to put one of the meals on her card and we'd be even. I'm wondering if she's maxxed them out.

OP posts:

Rainbowshine · 31/01/2022 17:00

Just tell her that next time you aren’t able to pick up the cost and wait for her to repay, so you can do free/low cost things to help both of your cash flows. Also you could signpost to her that you found a good budgeting tool online and advice which is helping you manage money better. So make it about you, rather than highlighting her situation.

Snuggleworm · 31/01/2022 17:18

I noticed that you said she was single. Would you have any idea of her yearly salary. Sometimes being single is hard as you still have to pay full price for heating a house, paying utilities, maybe a mortgage/rent etc and for a couple there are 2 wages coming in if you get me? I know that I could never afford our mortgage, car, heat/electricity, broadband phone etc on my wage alone.
When you think if it, the broandband, heating etc are still the same price if they are paid by 2 or 1 person.
Maybe in lockdown her hours were reduced and she was living off credit cards ( I know we had to dip in to our savings for a while when my hours were reduced initially)
Also, she was probably so embarassed to say she could not go as poverty can bring a lot of shame and then she probably did not want to let you down either.
You seem like a really good friend to be worried about her and I think it would be a great idea to gently discuss this with her. She might be carrying this burden alone and will be so relieved if she can share her money worries with a good friend.

GETTINGLIKEMYMOTHER · 31/01/2022 17:28

Is she a shopaholic? Or paying off a lot of cc debt?

Or gambling online?

andysgirl22 · 31/01/2022 17:49

I think this is difficult as it could be really embarrassing for her. I think that as she has always paid back and without reminders she is aware that she has debts to people and is doing her best to be conscientious about paying them back. I think it is as others have suggested that she has got into a cycle of repaying everything on payday and it is leaving her with nothing. She clearly makes the effort to prioritise repaying people so i think she would be upset to inconvenience you. I also think the fact she had months of knowing about the trip but didn't have money available for use on it suggests that she really couldn't save up etc. All the best op x

NinaProudman2022 · 31/01/2022 18:02

I don’t think I would ask your friend about money as this could be embarrassing for you both.

But I would subtly suggest a walk a coffee at yours or a bottle of wine at yours rather than book any restaurants or expensive activities for a little while.

latetothefisting · 31/01/2022 18:11

If you want to stop fronting her the money, then do so. As the pp said, do less expensive events with her, or only do things (like buy tickets for show) after she's paid the money. It would be fine to say "I'll buy them but I need the money upfront," or similar.

It's great that she always pays you back, but what would she have done if you hadn't been able to subsidise her on the weekend? As much as you say she is nice, it could have lead to an awkward situation if you only had limited funds yourself, and tbh it is very odd behaviour to agree to go on a weekend away but not even have a spare tenner to pay for a nandos or similar. Did you not do anything that cost money over the whole weekend? Did that impact on you? Also agree it puts you in an awkward position in relation to paying the original friend back. If you had said no you need the money now would 2nd friend have had to drop out last minute, leaving you with nobody to go with? She might well be a good friend in lots of ways but none of this is great behaviour.

It's up to you whether you want to go as far as having "a talk" with her, or if you'd rather just engineer events where she doesn't have to spend much/has to pay upfront.

ToooOldForThis · 31/01/2022 18:14

I think it sounds like she has debt, so wages come in and between bills and repayments the whole lot just goes straight back out. It's a scarily easy position to get into. If you don't want to broach it with her that's OK but she might appreciate your support

DSGR · 31/01/2022 18:17

She probably has debt. It wouldn’t bother me paying for her as long as she paid it back (which she does). I don’t agree she’s using you!

AnneLovesGilbert · 31/01/2022 18:21

Why did she agree to subsequent meals out when you both knew she couldn’t pay for the first one?

Perhaps beside the point but why keep eating out instead of having a cheap lunch in?

Original poster

sabrinas86 · 31/01/2022 18:21

@Snuggleworm

I noticed that you said she was single. Would you have any idea of her yearly salary. Sometimes being single is hard as you still have to pay full price for heating a house, paying utilities, maybe a mortgage/rent etc and for a couple there are 2 wages coming in if you get me? I know that I could never afford our mortgage, car, heat/electricity, broadband phone etc on my wage alone. When you think if it, the broandband, heating etc are still the same price if they are paid by 2 or 1 person. Maybe in lockdown her hours were reduced and she was living off credit cards ( I know we had to dip in to our savings for a while when my hours were reduced initially) Also, she was probably so embarassed to say she could not go as poverty can bring a lot of shame and then she probably did not want to let you down either. You seem like a really good friend to be worried about her and I think it would be a great idea to gently discuss this with her. She might be carrying this burden alone and will be so relieved if she can share her money worries with a good friend.

I don't know her salary, I know she has a supervisor position so always assumed it was decent.

I was single for many years and really struggled in flatshares. So many people told me I should just live alone but I don't think they could grasp the concept that one person living in a flat isn't half the cost of two! Even things like council tax you only save 25% on your own. So yes, it is definitely more expensive.

OP posts:

Original poster

sabrinas86 · 31/01/2022 18:24

@AnneLovesGilbert

Why did she agree to subsequent meals out when you both knew she couldn’t pay for the first one?

Perhaps beside the point but why keep eating out instead of having a cheap lunch in?

I'm not sure to be honest and that's kind of part of the discussion.

I was aware she was on a budget so a couple of times I suggested doing things that were cheaper. We only ate out once per day and it was in really reasonable places but that we both knew we'd like. It was a holiday and we wanted to have a nice time as well.

OP posts:

grapewine · 31/01/2022 18:26

I don't think she's using you either, as she always pays the money back. She could have debts, you have no right to know about those in my view. Being single is expensive too, in the sense that there is only one person to pay every bill and expense. Maybe, like another poster said, do less expensive things with her. Eating out and going away adds up quickly.

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