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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To sever joint tenancy even though DH doesn't agree??

92 replies

FigOPig · 30/01/2022 20:34

My husband and I own our house, both on the deeds.

When we bought it we naively didn't really talk much about what would happen on death, we didn't even have a will, and we proceeded as joint tenants without really giving much thought as to what it would mean.

Anyway, fast forward to now and we have a son together. My husband also has two older children from his ex.

I've been thinking more and more about this lately and I would like to change to tenants in common so I can ensure my 50% of the house goes to DS. It is likely to be the only thing of real substance we have to leave the children as we don't have huge amounts of assets.

I would like to do our wills so that whoever is left has life time occupancy of the property but it's then split 50% to DS and DHs half to whoever he wishes (obviously likely to be the children).

DH doesn't agree and wants to keep as joint tenants so the house passes wholly to whoever is left. It would then leave that person free to give it to whoever they wish in their will. In theory if it were me, I could not give DSC anything at all or if it were DH, he could split it evenly between the 3 which I don't feel is fair.

Anyway, I've been reading up and it seems you don't actually need the other owners permission to go ahead.

If DH really puts his foot down and says no to doing it amicably, WIBU to do it anyway?

I really don't feel comfortable with the idea of not being able to control my share of the house and leave it to my son. It's what I wish to do with it if something ever happened to me.

OP posts:

PyongyangKipperbang · 30/01/2022 23:51

My friends parents had this, her mother died, dad remarried and died shortly afterwards and his new wife got everything. She then cut off my friend, sold the house (that had been my friends childhood home) and swanned off with the money.

She was heartbroken that the home her mother had put all those years into was taken away just like that. Her father had made it clear that he wanted my friend to inherit and that he trusted new wife to do that so didnt "need" a will........

Having seen what previously close family will do to each other when money is involved I would have no illusions over what someone with no blood ties would do.

Stravaig · 31/01/2022 00:12

@Thirtytimesround Meant to tag you as well! So OP can unilaterally safeguard her share of the home for her son. But she can't give herself a lifetime interest in the home; she can only offer this to DP, and hope he reciprocates. So some agreement with her DP is going to be important to secure her own security. Have I understood this correctly?

Lalliella · 31/01/2022 00:21

Definitely do it. The other thing to consider is that is one of you needs care in the future after the first person has died, with joint tenants the entire amount (in excess of £23,000) can go towards providing care, but with tenants in common only the remaining half can, as the first half has been left to someone else. It seemed to be at one point the advice was usually joint tenants, but now it’s normally tenants in common.

timeisnotaline · 31/01/2022 00:31

This is the obvious thing to do when children aren’t all joint isn’t it? Do you think he just needs reassurance that his rights to live there and treat it like his won’t be affected? I’d certainly want to understand what happens re renovating or if you had to sell etc when you only have live in rights to half the house.

Cantleave · 31/01/2022 00:36

@MadeForThis

If it remains as joint tenants and you die first, it isn't just the house being divided in three you need to worry about. He could marry again and the house could go to his new wife on his death. All the kids could get nothing.

I knew a man who did worse than this. He had been having an affair for many years, but his invalid wife didn’t know anything about it. She had brought the money into the relationship and was very well off. They didn’t have any children and the wife wanted her estate to go to her nieces, when they both died. The were really like surrogate daughters to her and helped to look after her, take her out etc. He had agreed with this, with the estate firstly going to the survivor, then to the nieces. Unfortunately, she stupidly trusted him to carry out her wishes, and didn’t specify this in her Will!

When his wife died, he obviously got everything, which included 3 houses and a profitable business. When he died not long after, he had changed his Will and left everything to his mistress, completely cutting out the nieces! He didn’t even let the nieces have any of her jewellery.

SportsMother · 31/01/2022 00:46

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

LetsGoParty · 31/01/2022 00:52

I think you should try and sell the idea to your husband a bit more. It's in everyone's interests to do it.

silentpool · 31/01/2022 01:19

I think someone on a previous thread added language to theirs or knew of someone who did, where there was a lifetime interest granted (until the spouse cohabits with a partner or moves someone else in eg kids/relatives) or if the property is unable to be occupied (due to care home). Those events trigger the sale.

Thought that was useful!

TigerLilyTail · 31/01/2022 01:57

Does he give a reason for not wanting to change things?

My friend's parents wanted to leave everything to her oldest brother and she and her youngest brother would get nothing. I guess her parents saw him as taking over the running of the house and that was the most important thing that the house stayed in the family and wasn't sold and split upon their deaths.

It's not a point of view that I agree with but it's still a point of view. Does the OP's house have some kind of history to it?

Geppili · 31/01/2022 02:49

Do it. Do you have a Will?

gonnabeok · 31/01/2022 03:40

Yes you can just do it you don't need their permission. I did it through a solicitor when writing my will. They send a form to the land registry to notify them of the change to tenants in common.

Mogul · 31/01/2022 06:13

I think this thread is really sad, I would want my OH to have the value of the house to move or pay for his care once I was gone, isn't that what a partnership is? I would hate to think one of my parents left the other unable to do this just so they can leave me money.

Twinkleylight · 31/01/2022 06:59

We've own our home as tenants in common to ensure our children receive inheritance in the event of death and remarriage. Both dh and I have wills drawn up leaving each half of the property to the kids. Our solicitor also put in a life time interest clause in for the surviving partner.

sashh · 31/01/2022 07:22

You should probably go ahead.

I'd ask him about some specific circumstances eg you are both in a bad car crash, one of you dies immediately, the other on the way to hospital.

If you die first then each child will inherit 1/3 of the house which will have to be sold so they can inherit the cash (obviously they could come to an agreement, one could buy the others out ).

If your DH died first then you would inherit for a few mins and it would then go 100% to your son.

If your DS was in the car with you and he died, after both of you, then the house would go to your family, again leaving out his two older sons.

Sorry to make you thing about horrible scenarios but they are better thought about and provision made.

RedHelenB · 31/01/2022 07:35

What would the position be if you were to divorce?

OperationRinka · 31/01/2022 07:38

If you divorced then severing the joint tenancy would be step two anyway, step one would be changing your wills.

Porcupineintherough · 31/01/2022 08:19

@Mogul you are not the only one. I love my kids but the idea of leaving dh unable to be cared for in old age so they can get their slice of the pie makes me sick.

I dont think people realise what being left to the mercy of state provision actually looks like.

Aderyn21 · 31/01/2022 08:33

I think this is fine so long as you are willing to sell the house if your dh died - if you are doing this against his will, the relationship could become acrimonious and he might be unwilling to give you a lifetime right to remain in the house. In which case your relationship is dead in the water.

This does have the potential to turn nasty between you and dh - he will naturally see all 3 kids as equally important but to you your don is a priority and while on some level he already knows this is the case, what you are proposing really obviously spells it out. I'm not saying you're wrong - in your shoes I'd want what you want too, but if he's opposed you need to handle it carefully

Jarstastic · 31/01/2022 08:44

Could OP plan for provision for DC in a different way eg life insurance?

DH and I are starting to think about these issues at the moment. We certainly wouldn’t want the other to have to leave a house when one dies. But in a lifetime interest situation if a move triggers giving money to children the surviving spouse could be compromised too much with what they could buy with 50%. Eg May have to move areas. We should have choices and financial freedom after bereavement.

(We are thinking joint tenancy in our case anyway. We will give the children a good start, the rest is up to them. If anything is left when we are finished they can have it. But We are not keen on making sacrifices in our old age. It’s not like we don’t make them now.)

PaleBlueMoonlight · 31/01/2022 08:52

PP have identified the one main problem with the plan, which is that if your husband doesn't also change his will in order to grant you a life interest in his half of the house, then if he dies first you will not be able to stay in the house unless you are able to buy out your step children. You might think that this is a risk worth taking, but statistically he is likely to die before you and so I think it might be worth another go to get his agreement and make the changes together.

Quincythequince · 31/01/2022 08:53

@WonderfulYou

If DH really puts his foot down and says no to doing it amicably, WIBU to do it anyway?

Yes of course you would be unreasonable. You would also sacrifice your relationship.

As a PP said it works in his favour if he does this.
Tell him it will also give him peace of mind as if he died you could remarried and have more children etc.

This is ridiculous. OP would not be unreasonable at all. She is allowed to ensure her estate, in terms of her share of their house, is guaranteed to go to who she wishes it to. He doesn’t have to like it, but he’s being ridiculous to refuse it. Not his decision to make!

Crazykatie · 31/01/2022 09:16

I would say be careful how you handle this, at present the surviving partner has security and statistically women outlive men. You need lifetime occupation if you change to Tenants in Common.

Would I press this issue on an unwilling partner??.

It may be that he does not understand the implications in which case I would try to explain and reassure him, beyond that I would drop the issue. UNLESS I had a health scare myself and my survivability was in question.

phishy · 31/01/2022 09:52

You owe it to your child OP. Ignore DH on this.

Aderyn21 · 31/01/2022 11:25

Do your step children have a mother or family on their mum's side from whom they are likely to inherit. Maybe put it in terms that his children have two parents to inherit from and it's not fair if they inherit from three parents while yours only inherits from two.
Although that only works if the kids have a mum to inherit from.

LittleMissTake · 31/01/2022 11:50

If your husband’s Will does not grant you lifetime occupation as a surviving spouse (and vice versa) this can be under the Inheritance Act 1975.

Granted not the position you want to be in.

Best make an appointment for you both to see solicitors to write your wills and sever the joint tenancy.

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