New employee unable to return to office

[monotonousmum]

Someone on my team started working for us in December - a few days before we were told to work from home again. Employed through and agent, not direct - if that makes a difference.

Happily (it seemed) was in the office for those few days. We were only doing one day a week each in the office at that point.
I wasn't happy about the return home, as it makes training very difficult and she's not had an easy start because of that. I've kept her on easy tasks for this reason, until we return and can do proper training. She seems OK so far, just desperately in need of more training.

Next week we are due back in the office - this was discussed last week (2 weeks notice) and I've said I'd like her in the office 3-4 days a week to start, to attend training. All agreed, no issues.
This would then drop down to 2 days a week in line with the rest of the team, once fully trained and capable of doing any part of the job from home.

She's now gone to my collegue to say she can't return more than one day a week, if at all, and has got a doctors note to confirm this.

I'm not really interested in whether or not I should believe her, she has a doctors note and I'm not going to accuse anyone of lying. Not mentioning it to me when discussed has pissed me off, and in December there didn't seem to be an issue attending the office every day (ongoing medical issue - not new). But we are where we are.

We were clear in the interview that currently the team were doing one day a week in the office but this was due to increase, and they must be able to work from the office full time if that's what the business decides.

My AIBU:
Would it be unreasonable/unprofessional/illegal to say, 'if your medical issue prevents you from attending your place of work then you're off sick until it's resolved'?

I know there is some work she can do from home, but it's not sustainable to keep doing these easy tasks indefinitely - it's not what she's employed for.

There may be some doubt over what the agent told her regarding working from home - which shouldn't really be my problem if the agent is lying to get staff, but the interview with us was definitely clear.

This is an HR issue, not an AIBU issue. You need sound legal advice. The Equality Act is a thing. Flexible arrangements are a thing. You need to tread carefully. It is illegal to discriminate against workers on health grounds.

OP, does she have SMART objectives for meeting required standards of the role based on having completed the training within a usual/average/reasonable timescale? If she has (and she turns out not to be classed as having a disability, or even if she does but the objectives are already reasonable for someone with her condition), failure to make the expected progress against her objectives would be grounds to extend her probation at the very least.

Do you have an Occupational Health department (or outsourced service)? If so, I would be making an urgent referral and asking some specific questions: is her condition likely to meet the definition of a disability under the EA? If yes, what reasonable adjustments are required to enable her to complete the training / fulfil the role? Are there any aspects of the job she would not be expected to be capable of (include a job description and copy of her objectives)?

I’d also contact HR regardless of their inefficiency; at least you’ve tried to seek support/advice even if they fail to give it. And above all: document, document, document, as factually and objectively as possible.

From a different perspective: can the training be carried out remotely? Is it that it absolutely can’t be, because it needs access to equipment / processes only available in the office, or is it that it could be, but would need a significant investment in the time of whoever delivers the training to change the usual training materials, plus thinking logically to overcome surface obstacles to it etc?

As she's not your employee, as you say, your HR aren't going to be interested directly from an employment perspective (and don't sound very good), although as I'm sure you are aware there are still discrimination opportunities for handling non-employees.

Do you know if she was hired by her employer for this role, or whether she's a longer standing employee of theirs? The latter may give them more options.

Is it a "may be fit for work" fit note with WFH as the adjustment? It sounds like you're happy with her trajectory as a team member and this is plausibly only for a month.

Would you prefer her doing the easy tasks and maybe doing some training if she's up to coming in, or being a team member down? What does the contact for her services say about her being sick/the company being unable to supply a trained worker? Has her LM at her employer been spoken to by you or your peer? I guess that company are the real addressee of the fit note, not your company.

Reading between the lines as to what this might be, I'd suggest talking to her and being honest about your appraisal of her and the situation from your company's point of view. Reassurance will probably help. She may be able to help come up with options and solutions that fit all sides well.

Is there a way you can have her working for you part time (just on the tasks she's trained for?) for the month and either taking sick due to lack of available adjustment for those days or doing other tasks for her actual employer from home?

OP you need legal/HR advice on specific case.
More generally for those saying just sack, if there was discrimination it potentially isn’t just the agency

Protection from discrimination

You have the same protections from discrimination as other workers and employees.

You must not be discriminated against because of a 'protected characteristic', for example your sex, age or disability. The agency, hiring organisation and their staff could all be held liable.

www.acas.org.uk/agency-workers/understanding-your-employment-rights-as-an-agency-worker

If the job can be done entirely remotely, just training needs to be in the office then:

1. You're on dodgy ground to say she can't do the job because she needs to WFH. You're openly admitting there isn't a problem beyond a very short initial training period. So a reasonable adjustment is entirely possible with some creative thinking

1. You/the other manager need actually communicate effectively. It's not hard to ask if she could manage the training period as it is (as it's short term) or whether she could manage it via an adjusted manner (e.g. extend the duration and train 1-2 days a week.) Or whether she might be able to manage it in it's original or adjusted format soon. And that communication should make point 1 clear - after training she can WFH every day.

I have a chronic health condition. WFH is much better for me. I used to have adjustments to allow it 1 day a week, giving me a mid-week break from the extra strain of commuting, etc. I had years when I had almost no life outside work as evenings and weekends I needed to rest. I wasn't a parent then. I couldn't do that now!

And yes, for some, 1 day can mean the difference of working somewhere at all or not. Office environments can be awful for some conditions and then add the commute. A have a friend who spends 3 days wiped out with a migraine and other issues following a day going into an office building to work. (Multiple comorbid conditions). Thankfully, her employer understands that and knows she's damn good at what she does - from home. Some of her colleagues are dickheads though.

The ableism on this thread is awful. And for those unaware, employment rights against discrimination kick in immediately.

P.s. An extended period of training could be worked to your (OP's) advantage - phased learning where she gets to immediately try each stage/step before moving to the next one. Of course that depends on the training and job.

I have had to deal with quite a few of these situations at work (requests for adjustments/doctors notes).

Firstly; you really should clear it all with HR just to cover yourself, but if they’re as rubbish as they sound I think it’s fine to email them with what you intend to do and say “and if I don’t hear from you by the end of the week I’ll go ahead” - then if they ignore you it’s their problem.

Firstly, you can’t disregard what the note says, if it says she can’t come into the office at all, but she says she can do one day a week you’ve got to go by the note, not negotiate over it (you’d be liable for not following it, not her). I presume the GP has ticked the “able to work with some adjustments” box. It’s then totally up to the employer if the adjustments can/can’t be made (but if you can be shown you’re unreasonable about it, then you’d potentially be liable for disability discrimination).

If, as clearly seems to be the case, the role is not 100% doable from home then you’re right - you treat it as a not fit for work at all note and she’s on sick leave for the duration of the note

Regardless of whether wfh is justified for her, I’d be fucking pissed off that she said Yes to my face & then went behind my back to a colleague. This would make me more predisposed to get rid of her and feel she was just looking for a soft touch.

I would get back to the agency and put it firmly on their plate to solve - the person they’ve supplied can’t complete their training, you aren’t allowed to see their sick note, so what is their solution? You’re not the employer so it’s up to them to manage.

Also agree with pp, if the GP had said no going in the office then you can’t take her in at all.

Can you tell us whether she is currently entitled to company sick-pay if she’s signed off?

What is your company line with working from home? Can you choose or are you required to go to the office?

@monotonousmum

I know the easy option is just to let her go - but she seemed good in that initial training, as is doing OK with easy tasks. She fits in well with the team personality wise. We've had some rubbish staff, would rather avoid getting rid of someone that's potentially a good fit.

Sick note apparently for a month. So if she she needs to be off for a month and then start training I can cope with that.

That's the pickle, at Times especially when you find a potential gem, all the best op

@Ricksteinsfishwife

Op this doesn’t sound quite right, doctors don’t do sick notes any more, it’s fit to work notes and all they say is fit to work yes or no. They do not say if fit to work in different environments like home or office.

And if she’s a contractor jist tell the agency she’s not suitable.

@Ricksteinsfishwife - honestly though you don’t want to get rid of her OP, her bringing up sick notes, reduced working and going to your colleague about it and plus taking 3 times as long to train remotely, I’d let her go now as I think she’ll be trouble otherwise. Yes she’s employed through a contractor but easier then to let her go.

I’d reinterview as lots of candidates and lots of jobs.

@bhooks

If the job can be done entirely remotely, just training needs to be in the office then:

1. You're on dodgy ground to say she can't do the job because she needs to WFH. You're openly admitting there isn't a problem beyond a very short initial training period. So a reasonable adjustment is entirely possible with some creative thinking

1. You/the other manager need actually communicate effectively. It's not hard to ask if she could manage the training period as it is (as it's short term) or whether she could manage it via an adjusted manner (e.g. extend the duration and train 1-2 days a week.) Or whether she might be able to manage it in it's original or adjusted format soon. And that communication should make point 1 clear - after training she can WFH every day.

I have a chronic health condition. WFH is much better for me. I used to have adjustments to allow it 1 day a week, giving me a mid-week break from the extra strain of commuting, etc. I had years when I had almost no life outside work as evenings and weekends I needed to rest. I wasn't a parent then. I couldn't do that now!

And yes, for some, 1 day can mean the difference of working somewhere at all or not. Office environments can be awful for some conditions and then add the commute. A have a friend who spends 3 days wiped out with a migraine and other issues following a day going into an office building to work. (Multiple comorbid conditions). Thankfully, her employer understands that and knows she's damn good at what she does - from home. Some of her colleagues are dickheads though.

The ableism on this thread is awful. And for those unaware, employment rights against discrimination kick in immediately.

P.s. An extended period of training could be worked to your (OP's) advantage - phased learning where she gets to immediately try each stage/step before moving to the next one. Of course that depends on the training and job.

A load of these stories always go ‘and disabled/chronic condition person is damn good at their job, and employer is understanding’.

Wonder what happens to those who are so-so, easily replaced but also have health issues/disability…

Talk to your HR and to the services company you get her from. As she's not an employee I would think you can ask the company to send someone else...... unless I'm completely misunderstanding the situation.

So if she was trained she could potentially WFH as a reasonable adjustment if this is due to disability? I have no idea if this is possible, or crazy, or would be an issue with insurance or polices at work, but given the issue is training and if she can get a fit note to WFH, could you go to her home and train her there? At least then you'd have a compotent employee who could handle more of the job.

Yeah I think some facts need to be cleared up a bit.

1. She doesn't work for you but via an agency
2. Can the role be trained remotely or not

1. If the answer to 2. Is no, then return to the agency to explain and ask for a suitable replacement
2. If the answer to 2. Is yes, then crack on

Her medical note or details of conditions are not for your eyes if point 1 is true.

So
a. What do you need and
B. How will the agency fulfil those needs.

The agency you used — did you just use them to find this employee or do they employ her? I occasionally use agency staff and the agency employs them.

If I were to ask an agency for someone to work flexibly around a number of offices and who needed to be available for a fairly extensive period of office-based training, and the person they supplied could not fulfil those requirements, I'd go back to them and ask them to replace find someone who could. I suspect she's their problem, not yours.

If you're legally able to, let her go. She's going to be a liability.

[quote monotonousmum]@hugr not really successfully - she's doing a very small part of the job because she's not been trained on the rest yet.[/quote]
So she's been unable/will be unable to complete the training and therefore can't carry out the requirements of the contract, the agency need to send an alternative if the person they have provided cannot do the job they have been hired for, regardless of the reason. As mentioned upthread if it is a medical issue that's actually the agency's issue, not yours. She's not doing the job you hired her to do.

I worked for a agency for a company like that , they basically let me go as i had to have two occasions of die to covid in the time when you had to isolate if a contact until a pcr
I was only there a couple of months and the agency just let me go they never used this excuse just made up i wasn't grasping the job like they thought I would , which was rubbish as They had been happy leaving me as the oky one in the office whilst they all wfh and told me in the interview it was a wfh with occasional office yet i ended up being just the one in the office
But anyway they got rid of me easily and I didn't have a leg to stand on

My dh fot note had 2 weeks off and can return after with adjustments
His adjustments were wfh as he was unable to drive and has to get to cliemts so he did the teams admin as such and phone appts for 3 months rather than be field based

I work in HR. most of my casework currently is around employees not wanting to return to the office after WFH. It's a real problem. This situation is different as this is an agency worker, employed to work according to your business needs. Its your call here, but personally I would explain exactly what you have said here TO THE AGENCY and get them to deal with it.

I'm going to look at ways we can adapt the training to be more effective when done remotely, but I'm not convinced tbh. Actually, training is the ONLY reason we need to be in the office at all - whether that's me training my team, or my team 'training' other members of the organisation in smaller parts of our system. Online training has not been effective so far, to the detriment of the business.

I would agree with this. Training remotely takes 3 times as long. That is 3 times the trainer/manager's time as well as the person being trained. Checking their work and giving feedback also take longer, because you end up typing long emails. It is possible, no doubt, but not efficient. When I have a new team member, I go into the office more often to support their training. It is for their benefit.

Either she does what she is told and comes in or is dismissed.

@Viviennemary

Either she does what she is told and comes in or is dismissed.

thank god that’s not how it works

Just read the whole thread. I can't see the issue here if she is employed through an agency. Either you are prepared to agree to her demands or not. If not just tell the agency she does not meet your requirements.