To expect my child to make progress in reception?

[LovelyMoans]

Even if they started the year already where they need to be by the end of it, in reading?

The attitude from school seems to be that because DC has reached the required level for reception, they should just sit at it all year while others catch up.

It's implied I'm pushy for questioning this because "DC is doing well, why are you concerned".

Doesn't every child deserve to make progress from wherever they started the year?

Particular keen to hear views from teachers as to what I'm missing as I feel I'm going a bit mad.

Teacher here- be aware that there has been recent changes and guidance relating to the teaching of reading & phonics.
School are really being criticised (by LA or OFSTED)when children are being given home reading books which contain letter sounds which they haven't YET been taught in class. This may explain why they are cautious to simply move a child to the next book band.
In practice this means children learn a set of letter sounds and then get given the books containing those same letter sounds in the following weeks.

Home reading books after often misunderstood in their purpose- they are to practise and consolidate what children have already learnt ( to make that learning stick) rather than to learn lots of new words. A rough guide which reading specialist teacher used was that a child should know approximately 90% of the text and just 10% should be new learning.
I always offer to give a 2nd book at the same level for extra text. Could your child have 2 yellow books?
Of course any reading and sharing of books will help enormously with reading skills, but I would say try not to let your push kill the enjoyment

We’ve had similar here. DD is getting to the point that she can read most of the books on her shelves at home to me (picture books rather than reading books) but school are really measured in their approach to her school reading books, which she can generally read straight off (and understand). My worry is that she's just going to lose interest in the school books as there's barely a storyline in the 16 simple pages of Biff and Chip. I've decided that rather than only reading the books given by school that I'll just give DD the opportunity to read some more interesting content with me (simple chapter books etc.). She does a lot of reading in the course of a day anyway - things like recipes, instructions for games, messages in cards etc.

Teacher here. Your child should be making progress in reading and in my opinion should be moved to an appropriate level. However difficult to say what that appropriate level is without knowing the child.

I often have parents telling me what reading level their child should be on. It's a difficult one. Sometimes a child's comprehension level does not match their word reading level. Sometimes the parent (and then the child) are very focused on moving through the bands rather than just enjoying the books. As a general rule, the book going home should be a book they can read fluently so she maybe reading more challenging books in class.

Early reading books are matched to phonic phases. She may be kept on yellow to consolidate what they are learning in phonics right now.

The most important thing is that she likes the books she's reading.

I know what you mean my child's progress was slow in P1 (Scotland so no reception) although an excellent reader they seemed happy just to plod her through the stages. Now in P2 and was moved up from stage 3 books to stage 6 in October. I do think she should of been assessed and progressed during the course of P1 but we just read at home plus did reading eggs so I don't think she's lost out.

@LovelyMoans

It could be a simple as the Reception classroom only has books up to a certain level and the next ones are in the Year 1 classroom and there isn't enough to go round.

This really seems like a poor excuse to not challenge a child.

What is her inference like? Is she able to answer questions about what she has just read, or tell you about the story on her own words? Is she reasonably fluent. They are the main reasons I’d have for not moving a child on. Sometimes a child can be brilliant at decoding, but that is quite different from really reading.

DC is fine at this but tbh on yellow level books there's not a huge amount to infer or retell. Pretty fluent. Will have an odd unfamiliar word they sound out but not loads. I do think comprehension is weaker area, its partly why I'd like harder/longer books, there's more to discuss.

You could ask other questions than just a retell. Looking at the pictures and asking DD questions based on them or asking why she thought such a thing happened or identifying the who, why, when, what, how from the story. You could also read your own books to her and ask her questions based after each page or so of reading.

Our DC who was a natural reader was paused on levels twice in reception, so her comprehension skills could catch up. Reading ability can outstrip comprehension. I would expect DC to be given more complex readers that suit their skill levels as long as comprehension and fluency is good at the current level.

@LovelyMoans

Lego I did actually offer personally to the governors to fund new reading books.... and was turned down.... I kid you not

If you could afford to fund new reading books for the school can’t you just buy a set for your DC?

@Mollymopple

Teacher here- be aware that there has been recent changes and guidance relating to the teaching of reading & phonics. School are really being criticised (by LA or OFSTED)when children are being given home reading books which contain letter sounds which they haven't YET been taught in class. This may explain why they are cautious to simply move a child to the next book band. In practice this means children learn a set of letter sounds and then get given the books containing those same letter sounds in the following weeks. Home reading books after often misunderstood in their purpose- they are to practise and consolidate what children have already learnt ( to make that learning stick) rather than to learn lots of new words. A rough guide which reading specialist teacher used was that a child should know approximately 90% of the text and just 10% should be new learning. I always offer to give a 2nd book at the same level for extra text. Could your child have 2 yellow books? Of course any reading and sharing of books will help enormously with reading skills, but I would say try not to let your push kill the enjoyment

I agree.

It is really worrying that there seems to be a mix of phonics programmes at the 'Op's school' and also that some of the advice on here also suggests a range of programmes.
I really wish that this without up to date knowledge didn't offer incorrect advice.

This is the latest reading framework. (July 2021) which we are all working to.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachmentdata/file/1000986/ReadinggframeworkTeachinggthefoundationssofliteracyy-_July-2021.pdf

If you could afford to fund new reading books for the school can’t you just buy a set for your DC?

It's the attitude towards progress that bothers me & what it means further down the school. I'm sure I'll get grilled for saying it but I do not think it's ok for my DC to be left coasting.

School are really being criticised (by LA or OFSTED)when children are being given home reading books which contain letter sounds which they haven't YET been taught in class. This may explain why they are cautious to simply move a child to the next book band.

I don't understand this. They won't be covering the sounds my DC already knows at school until at least year 1. How does this allow for stretching more able pupils?

You could ask other questions than just a retell. Looking at the pictures and asking DD questions based on them or asking why she thought such a thing happened or identifying the who, why, when, what, how from the story.

Again depending on focus and definitely not as part of phonics. I've just had a school severely criticised for a staff member doing the above with a child reading phonetically - because by doing the above, this is not consistent with teaching children to read phonetically.

[quote MananaTomorrow]@CouldIhaveaword was told a similar version for my dc.
This didn’t work for him and the areas where I predicted he would struggle, he did.

Learning self discipline by learning an instrument doesn’t always transfer into self discipline for school for example, esp when things are always coming very easily to the child.[/quote]
That was exactly the problem with DS. We were told that at sooner or later he would come across something that he found difficult and wouldn't be able to cope. He messed about at school and then It happened at university. He had a real meltdown. Couldn't work out how to study. I'm not sure that we could have done anything more to avoid this, but I do think that the passion he had developed for other activities helped to pull him through.

Like what should school do when a child has already learned all the letter sounds on the syllabus for reception reading?

Stop teaching them?

I don't understand this. They won't be covering the sounds my DC already knows at school until at least year 1. How does this allow for stretching more able pupils?

@LovelyMoans - I've posted the full guidance above to give you the understanding you need.

My dd was always very very able and she always got to a certain point and then they made her wait. The comprehension just isn't there even if the reading ability is. I really wouldn't worry. Play is supposed to be the focus until year one so I would just wait and see what year one brings

We bought a pack of reading books with the different colour levels (think along the lines of Biff, Chip & Kipper).

As DC read through them we moved them up a level at home, regardless of where they were at school.

Didn't notice any downside to this. Maybe you could do something similar?

Experienced teacher here. I don't think it's great from the teacher. Agree that it could be due to new gov phonics expectations. There's always uncertainty when something new comes along. Perhaps worth trying to speak to the literacy coordinator next to ask them to explain the system for moving up as you feel your child knows more sounds and is ready for blue books. Developing inference skills will be a priority for a good reader in reception and I agree that the lower books are more of a challenge to develop these skills so I'd state that as a reason to move up. Perhaps like someone else said your child isn't showing their best skills with the teacher. Could you record your child reading fluently and then share with them to check you're seeing the same thing.

@AshLane

You could ask other questions than just a retell. Looking at the pictures and asking DD questions based on them or asking why she thought such a thing happened or identifying the who, why, when, what, how from the story.

Again depending on focus and definitely not as part of phonics. I've just had a school severely criticised for a staff member doing the above with a child reading phonetically - because by doing the above, this is not consistent with teaching children to read phonetically.

Interesting, I'm not UK based, didn't occur it would be different 🤦. Our readers aren't specifically phonics based, we start with sight words and there is sounding out, but not within a specific phoneme and also inferring from pictures for words the child doesn't know yet.

Ashland thanks for that but that guidance looks to be on the basis that a child only knows what they are taught in school, I.e. the implication is they should be given decodable books matching what they are doing in class because they won't have the knowledge to do more so it won't give them a sense of achievement.

I can't see where it says what to do with a more able child who is working ahead of the level being covered in class, and how to ensure that child is offered the opportunity to be challenged and make progress?

This kind of thing really boils my piss and I'm a teacher. I have been really annoyed at colleagues in the past who seem to take a positive pleasure in telling parents their child isn't really very far ahead at all and can't move up a level.

That said, a few times in my experience children will read the words but have no book talk and wider experience of the book world, and need practice at talking about what they have read, so sometimes in the past I've had discussions with parents about this. Tbh though that doesn't sound to be what is happening here.

I'd bet that the new insistence from Ofsted that children receive texts matched to their phonics teaching is what's to blame here - schools are pulled up now if they send home anything that children aren't able to decode, and if you're playing it safe, for a lot of schools that will mean books matched to the phonics they are currently being taught. It's the fall out from unimaginative advice designed to suit the manufacturers of a few key reading schemes, rather than the varied needs of children learning to read.

AshLane

Eg page 54 says "Children practise reading only with books that are decodable for them at that stage of their learning"

This does not mean a child must only have books fitting the stage the whole class is on. It means a child shouldnt be given a book too hard for them to decode. If a child is ahead of what is being taught in the classroom with their phonics ability I can't see anything in this report that precludes them being given books consistent with their individual reading ability?

For those saying the child may not be progressing in other areas, that may be, but it's still not an excuse for the teacher not to provide appropriate differentiation for areas the child does excel. As a teacher and line manager, I see it all the time with some teachers spending so much time providing for the bottom, they forget or don't know how to effectively stretch the top.

At would just say at this stage, send the teacher a polite email saying you are really engaging with reading at home and DC seems to have been on yellow for a while, what can you be doing to help her progress. Then you'll get a response basically telling if there is a reason she's not ready, or if this is down to the school, in which case I would then flag it up.

That said, a few times in my experience children will read the words but have no book talk and wider experience of the book world, and need practice at talking about what they have read, so sometimes in the past I've had discussions with parents about this.*

If that was the case I'd be happy to try to work on it if they fed it back and would totally understand that decision but that's not what happens.

OP my parents encountered this with me when I was in Reception almost 30 years ago. I was able to read and write before starting but as others did not yet recognise their own name, they worked to the lower level and my mum still regrets allowing me to coast. She felt it was responsible for me losing the love I had for learning and reading prior to that.

I know things have changed a lot since then but after COVID closures, I did not trust for my DD not to have a similar experience so we went down the route of a selective independent. Her school place a huge emphasis on comprehension, inference, understanding the entire book, not just reading the words which it sounds like you are doing. We also do a lot of reading of our own books at home (can buy entire sets online if library is not great) as well as her following along when I read to her.

I’d be horrified if my child’s school refused an offer of money for more books. You can’t have too many books!

I would ask for meeting with the teacher so you can have a real conversation about why they aren’t willing to give your dd books from the next level. They may have a very valid reason but they don’t seem to be expressing this at the moment.

@Mollymopple

Teacher here- be aware that there has been recent changes and guidance relating to the teaching of reading & phonics. School are really being criticised (by LA or OFSTED)when children are being given home reading books which contain letter sounds which they haven't YET been taught in class. This may explain why they are cautious to simply move a child to the next book band. In practice this means children learn a set of letter sounds and then get given the books containing those same letter sounds in the following weeks. Home reading books after often misunderstood in their purpose- they are to practise and consolidate what children have already learnt ( to make that learning stick) rather than to learn lots of new words. A rough guide which reading specialist teacher used was that a child should know approximately 90% of the text and just 10% should be new learning. I always offer to give a 2nd book at the same level for extra text. Could your child have 2 yellow books? Of course any reading and sharing of books will help enormously with reading skills, but I would say try not to let your push kill the enjoyment

This makes sense as to what is happening in my dd’s class(year 1) She left reception on turquoise, now entire class on blue, teacher gives her an orange book every week as well. Capable of reading some purple band we have at home, lovely expression and understanding but getting her to read more than about 6 pages in a sitting is like pulling teeth.