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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think people should talk about what they earn?

81 replies

HoneyBlahBlah · 09/01/2022 12:13

Recently myself and my colleagues were talking about the hope of wage increases from our company due to inflation. We all agreed that we need to ask for more money, as our wages haven't increased to match inflation.

None of us knew what the others were earning, so I figured I'd just tell them my annual salary. One of the girls who has worked there longer than me (and is therefore more experienced - she helped train me and other colleague) was shocked, as she's on £1k less than me and other colleague. I told her that she needs to discuss this with our Manager, as there's no reason she should earn less.

AIBU to think people need to stop hiding their earnings from others? Surely you're just doing the millionaire business owners a favour by doing so, as nobody knows how much they're worth?

OP posts:
Hoppinggreen · 09/01/2022 14:58

[quote WorraLiberty]@Hoppinggreen it would've taken you less time to Google, than to type that pile...[/quote]
Because everything on the internet is true
I’m advising caution, no idea why that would be so upsetting for you

Aprilx · 09/01/2022 14:59

It’s the big bosses way of making sure nobody knows their worth, and therefore keeps everyone on as little as possible

It isn’t. It is to respect privacy and to prevent dealing with endless queries over why suchabody earns £100 more than suchabody. Seems to be a failure to appreciate that even if two people are doing two similar roles, no two individuals are identical or will be working identically.

If it were to keep everyone on as little as possible, how would knowing that everyone else be on as little as possible help? Your rationale makes no sense.

WorraLiberty · 09/01/2022 15:01

Oh dear @Hoppinggreen

You know it's perfectly easy to read from reputable sources, right?

I think you're just annoyed that you didn't bother checking first and engaging your brain.

That's quite evident if you have to pretend someone is 'upset' rather than simply pointing out that you're wrong.

ShadowGirls · 09/01/2022 15:12

I've been in my current job for four months and have been told very, very clearly to never discuss my salary with my colleagues

PegasusReturns · 09/01/2022 15:20

I've been in my current job for four months and have been told very, very clearly to never discuss my salary with my colleagues

Abs that should ring loud alarm bells

Original poster
HoneyBlahBlah · 09/01/2022 15:25

@Aprilx

It’s the big bosses way of making sure nobody knows their worth, and therefore keeps everyone on as little as possible

It isn’t. It is to respect privacy and to prevent dealing with endless queries over why suchabody earns £100 more than suchabody. Seems to be a failure to appreciate that even if two people are doing two similar roles, no two individuals are identical or will be working identically.

If it were to keep everyone on as little as possible, how would knowing that everyone else be on as little as possible help? Your rationale makes no sense.

Ok so, for example, my colleague who earns less than me was promoted in June. I was then promoted in November along with another colleague to the same position, but we were offered £1k more than previous colleague.

We have both been with the company a shorter time than the colleague who was promoted in June. However, they're not going to tell her that we were offered more and offer her a top up in pay because it would cost them money, so why would they? Therefore, it's their way of keeping her on as little money as possible. There is simply no reason she should be on less, as she is more knowledge in the role, and has worked there longer.

Make sense now? 😊

OP posts:
Original poster
HoneyBlahBlah · 09/01/2022 15:27

@PegasusReturns

I've been in my current job for four months and have been told very, very clearly to never discuss my salary with my colleagues

Abs that should ring loud alarm bells

Exactly! I would run for the fills if this were me 🙄

Some of your colleagues could be earning more than you for less work, and you wouldn't know.

OP posts:
Hollyhead · 09/01/2022 15:27

I’ve only ever worked in the public sector with published banded pay scales so all of this mystery around salaries always surprises!

tootiredtospeak · 09/01/2022 15:41

I would love this but work for a private firm where it is a disciplinary action to discuss salary and bonuses. They dont even publish pay scales its ridiculous.

Nanny0gg · 09/01/2022 15:47

@WorriedGiraffe

In my company we arnt allowed to discuss pay with each other, you can be disciplined for it. There are lots of perfectly acceptable reasons why colleagues could earn different amounts, everybody knowing about it could just create embarrassment and resentment for some.
Back in my day you could get Merit increases. So that's one reason why your salary was your business
WarmWinterSun · 09/01/2022 15:52

It is unlawful for n employer to prevent employees from discussing salaries. This is in breach of the Equality Act.

I agree wholeheartedly with the OP’s posts.

Hoppinggreen · 09/01/2022 17:35

@WorraLiberty

Oh dear *@Hoppinggreen*

You know it's perfectly easy to read from reputable sources, right?

I think you're just annoyed that you didn't bother checking first and engaging your brain.

That's quite evident if you have to pretend someone is 'upset' rather than simply pointing out that you're wrong.

How is advising someone to seek properly qualified advice “wrong”? I dont need to check anything as I havent given any advice myself and neither have I said anyone has given incorrect advice. The Legal and Employment sections begin with a caveat for a reason. As I said I have no idea why this bothers you and makes you feel you need to be so rude
Thadhiya · 09/01/2022 17:47

I work in a male-dominated industry, so we all talk salaries a lot to make sure the woman aren't being short changed.

Some of the salaries on here women are earning are absolutely jaw dropping. While your celebrating that payrise up to £25k, your male colleagues are on £75 and laughing at you.

Thadhiya · 09/01/2022 17:50

@Aprilx

It’s the big bosses way of making sure nobody knows their worth, and therefore keeps everyone on as little as possible

It isn’t. It is to respect privacy and to prevent dealing with endless queries over why suchabody earns £100 more than suchabody. Seems to be a failure to appreciate that even if two people are doing two similar roles, no two individuals are identical or will be working identically.

If it were to keep everyone on as little as possible, how would knowing that everyone else be on as little as possible help? Your rationale makes no sense.

See, it's hilarious to me you think we're talking amounts like £100.

A new hire was just brought on to our team at £75k a year, and yes - everyone knows. And now everyone's preparing to ask for similar pay rises based on their year's performance. Some are in the 40s, some in the 50s, some in the 60s. Everyone's rethinking their numbers.

The discrepancies are not small change - but your boss would like you to think they are. You could probably add a zero to your salary, but upper management will be there to tell you you're not worth it.

People need to learn to move jobs every 2 years.

powershowerforanhour · 09/01/2022 18:14

You are soooo NBU. I had been at a previous job for years...at my annual review and that of a another longstanding female colleague it was always "oh sadly there isn't enough to pay any of you any more right now". Then another colleague joined- she was strong, she knew her worth and got it. We got to discussing salaries one day and she let me know what she was paid for exactly how many hours. There was a huge discrepancy. I didn't even bother asking for a pay rise- it crystallised in my mind to make a big life change, and now I am getting paid more for doing fewer hours, in a part of the country one would expect a lower salary. Other long term colleague also left- and soon discovered at her new job that another (way more inexperienced, male) colleague was getting paid more than her there too. So having kissed that frog , she moved again and found her prince job. Knowledge is power, and power to women too. I'm all for it. You might think it breeds resentment but the resentment will be there anyway. It just confirms what people suspect, often, and hands them power to make decisions about what they will tolerate.

CoastalWave · 09/01/2022 18:17

The last 'proper' job I had was at a senior level (going back 20 odd years tho!) - I was made up to be paid £46k.

Not quite so made up when I found out the guy who'd had the job before me, and who had moved on up the company, had been paid £86k.

We absolutely should talk about salaries.

The ONLY reason I was paid less was because I was a woman and I had zero idea what the job was worth so to speak.

PegasusReturns · 09/01/2022 18:27

@Hoppinggreen yet you were very quick to challenge someone who has provided the correct information but not those who has provided the incorrect advice.

By doing so you reinforced the prevailing narrative on this thread that employees are allowed to restrict salary disclosures. They absolutely are not.

Notjustanymum · 09/01/2022 23:07

In most companies it’s not allowed to discuss it, and as PP have said, is a disciplinary issue if shared.
I was previously on a project where I would necessarily be able to see everyone’s salaries and before I could start I had to sign a confidentiality agreement.
It’s definitely not a good idea to talk about salaries with your colleagues, as all sorts of different factors come into play for people in the same pay band to get different amounts, and resentment can definitely occur if everything is completely transparent.

PegasusReturns · 09/01/2022 23:45

@Notjustanymum surely you understand the difference in sharing your own salary v sharing a colleagues salary?!

The former is entirely legal whilst the latter would be a serious breach of privacy.

PurpleRainlnTheSky · 09/01/2022 23:49

@HoneyBlahBlah YABU. It's got fuckall to do with anyone else what I earn.

Original poster
HoneyBlahBlah · 10/01/2022 00:07

[quote PurpleRainlnTheSky]@HoneyBlahBlah YABU. It's got fuckall to do with anyone else what I earn.[/quote]
Woah, calm down!

OP posts:
Original poster
HoneyBlahBlah · 10/01/2022 00:11

[quote PurpleRainlnTheSky]@HoneyBlahBlah YABU. It's got fuckall to do with anyone else what I earn.[/quote]
Again I will point out, you're part of the problem.

OP posts:
OhGiveUp · 10/01/2022 09:14

What problem? If someone thinks they're worthy of a pay rise or better pay, then they speak up for themselves.
There's all kinds of reasons why someone may be getting more or less pay than their colleague.
A candidate knows what their wage will be when they sign on the dotted line, what a colleague's salary is isn't their business.
Even my DH doesn't know my income.

MedusasBadHairDay · 10/01/2022 09:22

Years ago I got out on a disciplinary because I found out that a man I was working with (who had less responsibilities and did less hours than me) was getting paid significantly more than me and asked for a pay rise.

So yeah, my experience is that companies who don't want you to discuss wages are doing so to cover up that they aren't paying wages fairly.

Hoppinggreen · 10/01/2022 10:32

[quote PegasusReturns]@Hoppinggreen yet you were very quick to challenge someone who has provided the correct information but not those who has provided the incorrect advice.

By doing so you reinforced the prevailing narrative on this thread that employees are allowed to restrict salary disclosures. They absolutely are not.[/quote]
Apologies if it seemed as if I was challenging a particular individual.
My comments were supposed to be a general warning about ANY posts that suggested certain things were/weren’t legally allowed and a suggestion that anyone wanting to challenge their employers policies should make sure that they knew the correct legal position from a confirmed source.