Middle Class Ugly Clothing part two

[RoyalFamilyFan]

Original thread here.
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4446999-To-think-so-many-middle-class-clothes-are-ugly?pg=40

I admit I am hardly a style guru. But when I joined Mumsnet people talked about lots of companies I had never heard of like Toast. So I followed links of clothes posted and looked at the websites mentioned. And was shocked at how ugly so much of the clothing was.
Shapeless grey dresses. Black loose trousers teamed with black tunics which make the model look like she is a member of a cult. Shapeless brown t-shirts.
They are just so ugly. AIBU?

Totally agree with what someone just said about aspirational trousers ( weren't they a band, once? ) no matter what the rest of me yearns for, my waist and bum are now and forever Matalan!

Middle class doesn't =more money anymore though, does it?

I have a middle class job, but some wc jobs pay more.

Are mc clothes just supposed to be more tasteful? And do we associate tasteful with bland?

@toddybell I think we have similar taste

I wear shiny leggings from Zara
Like the leather look ones

Will I be immediately condemned as a lower class shiny legged heathen

@RobertaFirmino

What you should be alarmed by, is why they have been making impractical clothing for girls and women, with cut outs all over, to reveal sex organs

Really? Clothes for women that 'reveal sex organs'? Where on earth are you shopping?

A Womb With A View....

They're supposed to be frumpy. It's an extension of the art school boiler suit idea - shows you are not subject (either in class terms, or ideologically) to gender roles or sexualisation. It's the new Bloomsbury group look.

I agree it definitely tends to be upper middle class women who gravitate towards it but not exclusively - I know others who have ordinary backgrounds like me and a strong aesthetic/design interest coupled with strong politics who sees like this. I love it. I find sexualised clothing really depressing - all I can really see is the oppression, the imperative to catch a mate.

I don't have the mad purple plumo trousers but I have the slightly less mad writers pants!

I wrote this in response to old thread, apols if convo has moved on.

@anungratefulwretch

I don't get the hype about & Other Stories. It's another holy grail shop on MN but to me the stuff always looks cheap and flammable. I went into the big store in Manchester just before Christmas and it was a sea of over-priced polyester. To me it's no different to Karen Millen or Ted Baker.

Totally agree. They are owned by H&M and don’t seem any different to H&M to me.

Voted YABU as never heard of place mentioned in this thread. Looked at what I was wearing post getting pissed wet through exercising horses in the rain this morning, then popped along and have just blown £300

I vow only to slouch in cashmere in 2022

Each to their own eh?

What’s a middle class job? And what makes it a middle class job?

I think some posters are taking this thread too seriously (and personally). I enjoy talking about clothes and seeing people's different styles and have loved these threads. I would never wear the cult/art teacher/sister wife look because I am petite so I would effectively be wearing a tent. I do recognise it as a considered style choice that works for many women and yes, it does have a middle class vibe. So what? There is nothing wrong with being middle class.

Once upon a time, a wc job was more manual labour, whereas mc tended to be office based or a profession. There was also the idea that you became mc by having a certain job.

So I was born wc (parents left school at 15 , had whatever jobs they could find etc).
Went to uni, got a profession, became mc. Which means my kids are, technically, mc. Even though they say 'I seen' and 'I writ'

I know there are meant to be 7 classes now, so not sure where mc fits.

But I thought mc was more a state of mind than a salary.

I wore cheesecloth shirts tied at the waist in the 70s just before I hit my teens. I miss Laura Ashley for the skirts, as their length was OK on me. Adini used to do midi skirts as well, but now they are all too long for me in the styles I like. Seasalt cord skirts are great for work, and you can ring the changes with different boots etc.

I love Toast wrist warmers, but now get mine from Goose or Turtledoves. There are some things I like in the Toast sale, but never in my size. I've got some great bits from Joules that are very useful, and not just strictly tops. I bought an outdoor jacket last year that is very warm; a pair of boots that actually go round my calves, and a couple of shirts. I like Brakeburn as well, and Boden, if I'm feeling flush.

@TheMoth

Once upon a time, a wc job was more manual labour, whereas mc tended to be office based or a profession. There was also the idea that you became mc by having a certain job.

So I was born wc (parents left school at 15 , had whatever jobs they could find etc).
Went to uni, got a profession, became mc. Which means my kids are, technically, mc. Even though they say 'I seen' and 'I writ'

I know there are meant to be 7 classes now, so not sure where mc fits.

But I thought mc was more a state of mind than a salary.

Oooh! I grew up wc too! This is so interesting. I had no idea there are 7 classes…

That & other stories dress is, to me, poo brown (and not a colour that suits me, even without the connotations) and, being mostly viscose, I wonder how well the pleats would survive a wash. And, is it lined? If not, I can imagine some very unflattering clinging going on.

Toast is awful. I’ve no idea why it’s so popular. I ordered a tip from there for chilling in and it was horrible fabric and shapeless- really ageing

The fact that many have mentioned some Toast clothes as being an art teacher style, including an art teacher, is really interesting.
When I was a teenager there was a stereotypical art teacher style of white or off white smock with random arty colours.
It appears art teachers have to have a particular style.

I also think that some of this is just about marketing. I have a raincoat from B and M that looks pretty much like a Seasalt one. My DP does think it looks like something a toddler would wear, I really like it. But if it was only sold in B and M as a style, I am sure it would be widely derided on MN.

I don’t see that clothing is becoming more modest. Half the clothes in shops has got random cut outs, slits up the sides so you can’t wear underwear and so low that you can’t wear a bra.

I'm not keen on many of the & Other Stories clothes but some of the accessories are very good. Leather bags at reasonable prices, and I've had some lovely scarves.

When I was young, I wore minis and Biba clothes, then the hippy/boho stuff that I have felt comfortable in ever since.
I've never felt at ease in things like knee length skirts, white shirts (white anything), little dresses, etc.
Now that I am old and fat, I've included stuff like Toast and Cos because they are extremely comfortable and easy to wear. No riding up, pulling, adjusting, watching you don't show you knickers, etc. You can just be.

My favourites are carefully picked from charity shops, eBay and places like Blue Fish, Zarabesque and Hampstead Bazaar. They are expensive but the fabrics and the colours are fabulous (to me) Unfortunately, you also get postage and customs duty on top with the first two.
Just as examples, I wear this waistcoat from Zarabesque a lot as I think it looks nice over black clothes.
The dress/tunic is from Blue Fish ( I think I'm going to treat myself to it in the sale 😀)

@elbea what stores are selling clothing like that?

Getting back to the original question though and also to move the question on a bit. I'm assuming that part of the issue is to do with costs and moving away from fast fashion - which people know is hugely detrimental to the environment - is that right?

I'm middle-class but baulk at the prices on a lot of the sites suggested by MNnetters. I do - however - when I look for stuff these days try to look for things that are sustainable/more fairtrade/ecologically friendly/good working conditions etc etc as far as I am able to discern this. Even so - the items I've found haven't been the prices of a lot of the things I see on some of these popular MN sites. So - stupid question maybe -how are people viewing things in terms of sustainability, working conditions etc - is this a factor for many? Are there good sustainable, more ecological clothing with good working conditions that are more affordable? I don't subscribe to the price per wear arguments - as I see this trotted out so much from people buying vast handbag collections where it is used as a justification but at the end of the day if you are thinking along sustainable or anti-fast fashion lines noone really needs multiple super expensive handbags!

I'm not judging people by the way - although no I don't understand the bag thing and never will. But if anything not fast fashion or more consideration of conditions and sustainability is part of the thinking for some - perhaps this needs chatting about too? Those talking about very very low cost items also need to accept that if you buy something incredibly cheap that it is usually part of the fast fashion problem and it's hard to imagine how the working conditions needed to make things so cheap can be justified. I suppose I'm looking for a middle ground here.

I think mumsnet would definitely see my clothes as common though- I love dungarees and baggy tracksuit bottoms. Work wise I wear pinafores and drop hem dresses
Shoe wise it’s ether trainers dMs or converse
I see the other Mums looking much more stylish than me but if I wear what’s popular in my area I just look ridiculous for some reason. I did get some bits from fat face and sea salt but my teenager took the piss and said I looked like the posh kids mums

@alliscalm start shopping the menswear department! Total revelation. Better fabrics, nicer colours, cheaper price.

Love an M&S man’s v-neck. V necks suit me better as I have big boobs but I don’t want a woman’s v-neck which draws more attention to them.

I buys womens trousers and shirts but mens t-shirts and jumpers are just perfect - slightly slouchy in a fashionable way but not tent like. And - did I mention this before ;-) - much better quality at a cheaper price point.