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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To refuse overseas work trip?

98 replies

Bumbleumbo · 05/01/2022 12:51

Posting here for traffic..

I work for a large global company and each year over 200 employees from around the world meet for a conference in the US. This moved to virtual in 2021 but the will be back to in person this year, with a 6 night, 5 day trip planned next month. I don’t want to go. I’m worried about catching Covid whilst I’m out there and get stuck in quarantine. I’m a single parent to three children and my ExH is unable to have them anyway due to health issues.

I am obliged to travel overseas as part of my job and I’m expected to go. Travel wasn’t an issue pre-pandemic, however so much has changed over the last two years and childcare support is a challenge. Isolation could mean getting stuck in the US for weeks. Can I refuse to go even if it’s in my contract?

OP posts:

user1471447863 · 05/01/2022 16:51

In the past the biggest risk to travel plans was a terrorist incident or a volcanic eruption shutting down air travel for a few days. Of course you could always break a leg/car accident/contract a local disease but these were always remote possibilities

5 nights away generally meant 5 nights away. Now there is the very real possibility you could have to slap 10+ days extra isolation onto that or loger if you unfortunate enough to fall seriously ill with it. Or even if political will changes and somewhere ends up on a red list overnight and all travel optons go out the window along with 2 weeks hotel isolation when you do make it back.

The terror risk/ash cloud/broken leg risks are still there and are still as small but the Covid risk is very real and much much more likely, and if you are reliant upon someone's goodwill for childcare the real possibility of imposing an additional 2+ weeks on them is unreasonable.

I'd say it is bloody stupid of your company to run an in person multi national multi day conference at this time & they are just crying out for a massive companywide outbreak & associated costs (and liabilities)

A reluctant agreement then an unfortunately timed positive lft - 'what a shame, these things happen, good thing i found out now and didn't go and infect half the company -tinkly laugh-'

billy1966 · 05/01/2022 17:01

@wineandsprite

In your shoes, I would fake a positive LFT. Seems you won't be able to get a PCR very soon anyway. Honestly, it's not OK to put you at such risk, especially not with children at home that need you there.

I would do this.

It is unreasonable for them to insist and you should not feel force to resign prematurely because of it.

Definitely start job hunting if you think this will be an issue but until then do whatever you have to.

It is completely unreasonable for them to expect this during these times.

Do what you have to do.

ChampagneLassie · 05/01/2022 17:04

Surprising how many people are suggesting fake illness....but it does make me realise that if you try to force people to do something unreasonable many will just find a alternative than engage in conversation. @Bumbleumbo approach your employer optimistically - you've shown how you're able to do your job over past couple of years, I'd be surprised if they wouldn't want to adapt and support your circumstances

ilovesooty · 05/01/2022 17:17

Sadly it's not at all surprising that there are so many people who are inveterate liars, or see lying as the way to address situations.

Original poster

Bumbleumbo · 05/01/2022 18:25

Sorry, just catching up and lots of helpful advice.

I’ve scheduled a meeting with my boss for tomorrow and I’ll just be upfront. Another colleague with a terminally ill wife is also planning a similar conversation.

The rest of my team (all men) have admitted they’d be quite happy to quarantine for an extra two weeks in the US. No concerns about getting back to kids/family as they’re either single or have wives at home to take care of DC.

Pre pandemic, I had a healthy co-parenting ExH, and reliable after school childcare. My clinically vulnerable mum was also happy to help out and I used a live out nanny when the kids were little. I didn’t take this job without having the necessary support in place but things change.

I’ve spent the last 2 years successfully wfh and participating in these types of events virtually, so this event came as a surprise. Interestingly, our Christmas party (just the UK team) was cancelled and we’re still working remotely, yet this same logic isn’t being applied to this event (not business critical and more of a conference by day, jolly by night).

OP posts:

MrsTerryPratchett · 05/01/2022 20:18

What utterly shit fathers you work with.

gabsdot45 · 05/01/2022 20:28

I would also be surprised if this goes ahead. DH was due to go to Texas on Saturday for his annual sales conference and it was cancelled just 10 days before

user1471447863 · 05/01/2022 21:52

There may be an element of bravado/playing up for the lads in that posturing by the men. Sure some of them won't be bothered but some will be but won't want to come across as weak etc, as you can be damn sure it won't be entirely convenient or their wives to have a 2 week extension to their trip foisted on them.

@ilovesooty
Sadly it's not at all surprising that there are so many people who are inveterate liars, or see lying as the way to address situations.

What's your suggestion for addressing it then? If the company are insisting on something that we all (well it appears to be all) agree is foolish and very likely to end in unreasonable inconvenience then surely the sensible thing is to find some means to get out of going.
If they won't back down then people will use the tools at their disposal - that being suspected Covid and isolation. Assuming asking nicely/highlighting the fallacy fails to sway them.

ilovesooty · 05/01/2022 22:12

I'd expect people to discuss the situation with management, which the OP is going to do.

Original poster

Bumbleumbo · 05/01/2022 22:18

@MzHz

There were over 1 million daily infections in the us yesterday, it’s insane to consider going to a conference atm.

Have you had covid already? Your kids?

Do you think your boss would understand your concerns?

I’ve just read that too along with the fact that some states have vaccination rates as low as 30%, plus no testing or masks.

I’ve managed to dodge Covid so far as have my kids. I don’t actually mind getting it, it’s the quarantine risk that’s the worry.

OP posts:

adriennewillfly · 05/01/2022 22:30

This is all fairly simple. Apologise and say you won't be going. If your manager makes it a problem for you, then find a new job.

Deisogn · 05/01/2022 23:53

Plenty of professionals would lie in this situation. If you need to lie to buy yourself time to look for another job, I would. It's also not even a tiny bit surprising that the men wouldn't have a problem with being stranded for two weeks...people are living in La la land if they think otherwise

Italiangreyhound · 06/01/2022 01:31

It's really unreasonable for any company to be running a big conference overseas in the current situation. It could be a PR nightmare! They could run it on the internet for a fraction of the cost, MUCH less affect on the environment and 0 Covid risk. They are crazy.

in your shoes I'd tell them why it's a bad idea (in the current situation), if necessary I'd look for another job and yes, I might even lie if necessary. It's a real Covid risk and totally unreasonable for them to expect anyone to do it ion 2022!

sjxoxo · 06/01/2022 02:28

I think it’s poor of them to hold a huge event tbh.. also what about the environmental impact of this- is it really worth all that travel for you to all be face to face; can they not do something virtual?! I would be questioning my employers values based on that to be honest and I think re covid you are not being unreasonable- I wouldn’t go in your position. Covid risk or not, your personal life isn’t suited to the demands they’re making… I’d explain you can’t attend this time. If they are difficult about it, I’d leave xo

Contactmap · 06/01/2022 02:38

@nicelyneurotic

I'd agree to go and then at the last minute (if it doesn't get cancelled) fall ill... Your situation is difficult and employers might not understand.

Her employer will understand very well indeed if she pulls that stunt. Much better to have an honest adult professional discussion in advance. Unless of course your job is disposable .

GingerScallop · 06/01/2022 02:45

@Skiptheheartsandflowers

It's also 'sad' and in my view 'morally bankrupt' that so many employers are willing to disregard their staff's health for something that does not have to take place in this way. Not to mention the disregard for her family due to a situation that has only recently arisen, isn't her fault and is beyond her control.

If employers could be trusted to do the decent thing in circumstances like this, I wouldn't say lie about it. Unfortunately they often can't and don't. Women in particular who have caring responsibilities often get a raw deal from managers and saying you can't do something because of childcare - even if it's an 'extra' and not absolutely essential to your role - puts you in the bad books. Plus HR are going to prioritise what senior management want. They're not on your side. So in OP's position, I'm afraid, I would join those saying stay quiet and, if needed, regretfully test positive just before departure.

well said.

GingerScallop · 06/01/2022 02:56

@BellaChagall

Wineandsprite I don't disagree with you. I'm just saying that there is no need to fake illness. Any major corporate worth its salt would not expect unnecessary international travel from a single parent during a pandemic. OP needs to talk to HR.

you are right. But I don't know many corporate companies worth their salt. Most value maximizing profit/value and human resource use over real humans. Just look around at the many messes the world is in. Indeed most work place policies especially around travel are from the perspective of single men or men with a wife who holds the fort back home. So I wouldn't be surprised. Op knows her setting better than anyone and hopefully can assess the suggestions here and see what works best for her. I wouldn't be too bothered about lying but I would be careful op. I would say wait until closer to travel date as everything is so fluid with COVID-19. Am sure if you discuss this and can't go they won't fire you (although I can promise there won't be retaliations from colleagues).

givethatbabyaname · 06/01/2022 03:03

I’m in the US.

Where is the conference to be held?

I’d be astonished if it went ahead with no hybrid option. It’s just too expensive for the company in terms of healthcare costs, lost work hours, accommodations during isolation, rearranged travel. It won’t happen.

DailyMailHater · 06/01/2022 03:05

Speak to HR or your manager which ever you are more comfortable with, be honest with them. Please do not fake illness / LFT at the last minute, it is so dishonest and the firm will lose money flights / hotel etc and you will spend the next however long wondering if they know / you will be caught…..then what happens next year when you are due to go again be a bit much to suddenly be ill at the same time every year.

I worked with her someone who called in sick on the day they were due to travel to an overseas conference with our MD, they were found out (I am not sure how) but they were fired, and aued for the costs that the company had lost and due to people talking (small industry) people from other firms heard about it - her reputation was damaged and she struggled to get another job in the same field.

JasmineGarden · 06/01/2022 03:16

@Bumbleumbo

Irrespective of the childcare issue, I wouldn't be going. Apart from the quarantine, I wouldn't want to be out there & needing medical help for Covid.

Your contract was written before Covid, I'd love to see them try to enforce the travel part right now

MotherOfCrocodiles · 06/01/2022 03:49

If travel is actually an integral part of your job then you should maybe rethink your job

On the other hand if it's a yearly team building event or similar and you are just expected to go to show your dedication, I'd fake the lft this once on the basis that your employer is BU to expect you to take the risk of being separated from your family for weeks.

I actually do have quite a serious professional role involving travel too but in my industry we treat people like humans and would see that as a single parent you might not be able to do this at this time. We certainly would be looking at all solutions before kicking you out to replace with someone free to travel under any circumstances (ie a man probably)

CliffsofMohair · 06/01/2022 04:06

[quote JasmineGarden]@Bumbleumbo

Irrespective of the childcare issue, I wouldn't be going. Apart from the quarantine, I wouldn't want to be out there & needing medical help for Covid.

Your contract was written before Covid, I'd love to see them try to enforce the travel part right now[/quote]
Health care in the US during Covid is a /should be a big consideration. Is the company offering travel insurance to the degree that employees are protected if stranded/quarantined/hospitalised in the US?

MyOtherProfile · 06/01/2022 04:15

How far in the future is the conference?

RedHelenB · 06/01/2022 06:55

Covid is the red herring. Your problem is childcare by the sounds of
it, which presumably will be a problem for a few years? Time to resign and find a job that doesn't involve overnight travel

Zonder · 06/01/2022 08:19

@RedHelenB

Covid is the red herring. Your problem is childcare by the sounds of it, which presumably will be a problem for a few years? Time to resign and find a job that doesn't involve overnight travel

Except it sounds like childcare wouldn't be a problem without covid since now the dad and her mum can no longer so what they did. Or maybe the dad's illness isn't directly connected to covid.

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