So SO desperate - please please help! Need advice

[Beyondtired23]

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Another night of no sleep. Ive not slept properly in over 2 years now because of my pregnancy and baby. My pregnancy i was big very quickly in and it all became too unbarable, uncomfortable and painful to sleep. Once my dc came things were okay at the start. But gradually over time things got worse and worse. Dc is now just over a year but he does. NOT. SLEEP.

There is no hope. His sleeping is getting more erratic not better. I dont know where we are going wrong and its so upsetting and makes me feel despair. Everytime night hits i genuinely get scared and anxious. I cant sleep or even rest because i know what the night has in store for us all and its only a matter of time before he wakes.

I dont know if i shot myself in the foot but when he was a baby i would just bf him to sleep. At the time i was worried it would affect us in the long run but it worked for us and we just hoped he would grow out of it. But he hasnt. Sometimes he still has 4 or 5 feeds in a bad night. Its become his clutch to sleep and in a way ours ( although it is a lasy resort). He has never taken to a dummy or soft toy, any other kind of soothing. Sometimes we can rub his back and that will work but as soon as we can stop he bounces back up.

Its like his brain is hyperactive. He talks in his sleep, moves around alot, sits up, stands up and crawls IN HIS SLEEP. His dad sleep talks and sits up in his sleep and im wondering if they both have a bad case of restlessness syndrome.

Even around bed times he is never docile or sleepy. He will give us cues such as hair pulling but generally he is still mananic and running around. If we try to give him a bath he will only gain more energy. Whether i take him out during the day to exshaust him, or whether he naps well during the day, nothing correlates or changes the outcome of the night. Its all complete random.

Last night i had a burning sensation in my chest and my heart rate went up to 100. Today my chest is tight and off feeling. Ive suffered with panic attacks before but this felt different. Im only in my early twenties but was scared it was a heart attack. I think its my body telling me its now or never. I cant remember anything anymore. I repeat conversations, i cant remember how to spell. I live in a constant fog. I have no social life because of it and barely have the energy to tend to my baby let alone get us out for fresh air.

My hv has dissapeared of the scene a long time ago (thats another story) so i have no one to turn to. Drs dont want to know unless its an emergency. We keep to the text book, have wind down time. Keep routine at bed. Bed around the same time each night (even thats becoming a mission and a fight more and more) we dont talk to him when he wakes, avoid eye contact. Sometimes we ignore him and leave him to cry and he just works himself up. He sleeps in the same room as us. We've tried co sleeping but it changes nothing. We cant have him screaming as we have neighbours and people in the house next door to us that will all suffer too.

I dont want to have to resort to leaving him to scream it out, he would be distraught.

But i feel like my body is going to give and im beyond myself with desperation.

Please give me any tips or tricks. Tell me where im going wrong!

@ChewChewPanda

The reason I advised to stop breastfeeding was because they have already tried and failed to reduce night feeds. In order to fix the sleeping problem she needs to stop all nutritional intake during the night . At a year old her ds doesn't need breastfeeding at all anymore and fixing the sleeping issue is far more important than continued bf, so I suggested she gives it up completely as a first step. She clearly can't carry on as she is.

I wouldn't knock the own room. Both of mine had their own room when they came home from hospital and they were both sleeping a decent chunk at 6 and 8 weeks respectively. They may just have been naturally good sleepers though and it certainly sounds as if your son is very active.

I didn't exactly do controlled crying. I never fed to sleep. I put them down, wound up their mobile, put the light off (left a night light on) and left the room. For night time feeds I kept the low light, changed and fed them, no interaction or talking and then I put them back down. They soon got the idea that nothing fun ever happened at night. They might cry a bit and somebody would always come within 5 minutes or so but it was a lot of effort for them and no more fun than it had been before. Anyway they did sleep through at 6 - 8 weeks - not a solid eight hours but maybe six hours from midnight (their last night feed) through to 6:30 am or so. That seemed vaguely miraculous at the time to us.

I would never have done night feeds for a one year old. They are not tiny babies who have tiny stomachs and can't load up with enough milk to get through the night. I would have gone insane if I was doing night feeds for that long.

How old are they?

I'm going through this now with a 10 month old. I'm trying to break the problem down into small chunks.

Step 1: put baby in cot after each feed to stop them being in my bed. I've let them feed as many times as they want but always back in the cot at the end. Do this for a week or so.

Step 2: limit feeds. This is where I'm at currently, so I'm enforcing a three hour rule in-between feeds and shushing and patting and cuddling briefly at other times.

Step3: next I plan to get the cot in their own room when they are down to 1 feed or even (miracle happening) no feeds.

@Lpc123

Listen, you need to sleep train. At that age they do not need 6 feeds in a night. Agree with PPs, move into his own room and commit to a sleep training programme. I know it’s controversial and some may disagree but you can’t go on like this and you shouldn’t have to! And he needs proper rest and sleep in order to thrive! Join respectful sleep training/learning on Facebook and go from there

I agree with this. He doesn't need to BF 6 times a night, you need to break that cycle. It will not be easy I imagine but please do give sleep training some serious thought. It helped enormously with mine and, whilst it was horrid the first week (we did timed controlled crying so leave for 5 mins, soothe, leave for 10 mins, soothe ect), it really did work and we are now feeling human again finally!

I was like you at first, always fed him to sleep when he woke up in the night. Once I stopped that he was pissed off for a while but he soon realised it wasn't happening and there was no use in him crying about it. Soothe yes, but feeding was a no in the middle of the night.

What I meant to say was you can only do this when you feel ready as it's bloody exhausting but so is what you are going through now.

But when you start be consistent. Make sure they aren't ill.

It gets easier and you'll feel better. Try and see the problem as separate issues to crack rather than one insurmountable problem.

And yes to their own room too. It became completely apparent by 7 months or so that half of the waking was because we were disturbing him by turning in bed ect ...

As you can tell by the replies, there's as many solutions/suggestions as there are babies.
I had this exact same thing, it was hideous. It will pass, it really will (not helpful right now, I'm sure). One day he will sleep through and you will worry there's something wrong.
I breastfed both mine to sleep and then took them in for cosleeping for a bit, then did "shhh pat" (singing endless twinkle twinkle little fucking star), then rapid return. Each one worked for a bit. It was the rapid return, the no sleep after 3pm, the bottle instead of boob before bed, that cracked it in the end.
All of the above will be frowned on by some but just nod and smile and try not to worry. It's not your fault. This too shall pass. Good luck xxx

Get a sleep consultant! Might cost £100 but should save your sanity. Check out 'just chill mama' on Instagram I think she has some free resources and also sleep consultants available by phone.

I sleep trained and it's the best thing I ever did. Some people don't agree with it, but I have a 2 year old who is happy and healthy and she has a mum who is happy and healthy.

You’re exhausted, so first you need to work as a team so both you and DP get equal opportunity to sleep.

Right now because you have the magic boobs, you’re not getting that equal opportunity.

I would night wean at this age. It will be a shit few nights and your DP needs to be 100% on board and supportive and resilient to help you do it.

If you think you’ll struggle and need a ‘voice of experience’ there are sleep consultants who will give you a plan to follow.

You’ll still need to be resilient and it will still be really shit for a bit but many people need the back-up of an ‘expert’ to get the resolve to get through it.

There are developmental jumps that make sleep harder/more disrupted and it sounds like your DS is going through one (crawling in sleep etc) - I recall 14 months being shit! And I totally empathise with the dread & anxiety of nighttime. But night weaning I think sounds like something you have to do for your own health at this stage.

Sleep training! Own room in own cot and proper controlled crying. Hire a sleep trainer, I had one via Facebook (friend of a friend) she did it all via phone and video call and it cost us about £30 and my DDs sleep was sorted within 3 days. Life changing. Take back control.

I’m sorry you are going through this, lack of sleep drives you crazy. My son was also waking up in the night and then was ready start the day until he was two years old. You need to get a grip on this and come up with a plan. A sleep consultant will tell you completely black out his room (we have that black film on the windows), white noise machine - we do all that. When he wakes for milk the answer is no. You could at the very least deny him the first ask then if he wakes again ok as he might genuinely be hungry. But then gradually you need to phase each feed out one by one. Baby will scream blue murder about it all but if you stick to your guns they will learn soon enough. Just remember you are doing this for baby as they need a full night sleep and need you to be energised and refreshed.

Although everyone will have different advice, please do not drug your baby, I'm completely taken aback that someone suggested that - it's dangerous and really not okay.
Stopping breastfeeding is also terrible advice. It isn't just about getting nutrition at night, it's often comfort, for a start. You really don't need to stop feeding completely. For accurate advice about breastfeeding, please do contact the breastfeeding helpline (they have phone and online chat support), you can speak with someone who is trained and knows what they're talking about. They are brilliant and can also support and give advice on your sleep situation.
Breastfeeding isn't the cause of the sleep issues, you've not done anything wrong by feeding to sleep so don't blame yourself. Every baby is different, regardless of how they are fed. Both my EBF babies are different - toddler slept through from a few weeks old, always fed to sleep, think we've had 2 nights of broken sleep with him since due to illness. Baby also slept through from a few weeks but has had more episodes of broken sleep, and will generally be up at least once a night. A colleague of mine is at her wits end as her formula fed baby is up almost all night at 14 months old and has never slept well, it really does depend on the baby.
I hope you do find a way to improve the sleep situation for all of you though, if sounds very tough.

Book yourself into a hotel for two or three nights. Get someone else to deal with him in his sleep (DH or enlist another relative who isn't BF either!). It will be tough but you need to go cold turkey.

I agree he should be in his own room by now too.

Mine didn’t sleep through the night, by this I mean 12-5am until they were over 2. Youngest still gets up in the night at 6, but doesn’t wake us.

There are a few babies that sleep through the night in the true fashion, but it is seen as failing if yours doesn’t hence why people don’t admit to it.

Get your partner on board, my husband would do all wake ups before 11pm and would get up with them from 5:30am so I could guarantee I’d sleep 8:30-11 and 5:30-7:30 and I’d manage some hours between 11-5:30. Husband could get enough sleep to function at working - driving distances.

Also with Christmas coming up go stay with grandparents if possible, let them play with baby in the morning and have a really long lie in a few days on the row makes a huge difference.

I didn’t want to give up breast feeding and this kept me sane and rested with both mine.

I agree he should be in his own room by now too

“Should” is extremely unhelpful, untrue and utterly subjective in this case.

MELATONIN. It worked like a miracle on our non-sleeper. You need to get it on prescription.

www.drjaygordon.com/blog-detail/sleep-changing-patterns-in-the-family-bed

I used this for DS1 and found it very helpful. When DS2 is feeling better I will use it with him! It’s a nicer way of doing things.

I stopped feeding at 16 months and after a difficult couple of nights (and putting his fav tv show on as distraction until he eventually went to sleep) he started to sleep so much better! I still Co-sleep now and my DS is 2.5 so I’m not exactly a great example but it’s so much easier than it was. I feel for you, it really is torture x

I'm only repeating this in case it helps you feel like you've been given "permission" to do this - I remember the pressure and the guilt, and how relieved I was when lots of people told me to do the thing I thought was cruel and evil!

So: put him in his own room, sleep train and night wean. It might be hideous for a week or so, but it will be worth it.

Own room + controlled crying. My cousin had a no sleep baby and she was so exhausted that she used to heave constantly. She was up several times a night to BF too. It was absolute misery.

When her French MIL came to stay she was horrified at how shattered and grey my cousin looked. She took charge and insisted my cousin try putting her baby in his own room and doing controlled crying. I think it took 4 days until the baby slept through?

I have a child like this and I’m sending you solidarity. It’s hard for anyone to imagine what it’s like and I’m really not convinced this is about bf and “stop breastfeeding” is frustratingly impossible advice to follow. I think your best angle on this is to get help and support wherever possible with sharing the load and push the GP. We have referrals now, long overdue. When I filled in a survey to qualify, I was surprised when I saw the scores and realised that what we are dealing with is genuinely not normal.

I'm afraid I would also advise stopping BFing overnight, I had to do that with all 3 mainly as I was staring going back to work in the face and couldn't imagine doing it on no sleep. Controlled crying it was and it worked very quickly, within 2 or 3 nights and the children were happier in the day too as they also hadn't been awake several times a night.

Another one here who did controlled crying/sleep training! we used the Ferber method and honestly, it saved our sanity. I found it tough at first but it didn't take long to work at all. I still feel uneasy telling anyone we sleep trained as I feel like some people judge it quite harshly, but both me and my husband were on the edge, exhausted, arguing with each other and it changed our lives.

You need to get some sleep in order to work this through. Is their anyone who could have him just for a night to give you a break?

My youngest was like this and night weaning made a big difference. I used Dr Jay Gordon's method. It was a hard week but it did work. I did it rather than my partner but you might find it easier for your partner to do it instead.

I would also suggest a separate room.

You have to put your neighbours out of your mind until this is sorted I'm afraid. You can't go on like this.

GOOD NEWS is they do sleep eventually. My youngest used to be an incredibly restless sleeper and now sleeps really well.

Sending love xx

You say you don't want to do controlled crying. Don't.

I agree with pp re the sitting and crawling during the night - you need to speak to a doctor re this.

In the meantime can you and your partner work 'shifts' so you are getting a decent block of sleep?

This will pass, hang in there.