We need to make it illegal to hit children

[Poetrypatty]

AIBU to think this should be done ASAP. I'm so annoyed that in our country it's still legal. It's not legal to hit adults. It just seems plain wrong to me.

It won't stop child abuse, no. But it would go some way to changing social norms around child discipline. It would be a start.

I agree with you. Like most 80s parents mine smacked me because they were taught that's how you parent. Keeping it legal suggests it's a reasonable option.

''x2boys : What do you think it will achieve Op?
Do you think abusive parents will suddenly no be abusive ?''

This is just dumb. Do you also suggest we remove laws that make assault, rape, domestic violence and murder a criminal offence because people are still committing these crimes?

Of course it won't stop child abuse sadly nothing will but it provides that clear legal line doesn't it that says its wrong???

It also bolsters the rights of the child and helps to enforce the idea that children have their own rights and are not possessions.

I can't understand the thinking behind, don't make it illegal because people will still do it?
Like drink driving or wearing a seat belt or smoking inside??

It won't stop child abuse of course, but it might at least take away any personal interpretation of what is and what isn't allowed. You don't lay hands on a child as 'discipline', full stop.

What do you think it will achieve Op?
Do you think abusive parents will suddenly no be abusive ?

Of course not. But it's a starting point and sends a message. If there's zero tolerance of hitting and it's illegal then adults and children will know that.

Keeping it legal suggests it's a reasonable option.

Exactly. We know that rape is illegal for example, yes it still happens but the law is clear. Should be the same with hitting children. Unacceptable full stop.

It should be outlawed. Criminalisation won’t be a magic wand which will make child abuse disappear, but it sends a powerful message to society in general that striking children is unacceptable.

I think banning “smacking” to stop the type of the child abuse like what happened with Arthur is conflating two issues really.

People that batter and abuse their children an anti smacking law isn’t going to do anything. (I’m not saying that means we shouldn’t ban it, I’m saying that it’s a conflation of two issues).

Giving a well looked after child who is cared for well and loved a smacked on the bum or hand when they’ve played you up all day, been sat out, had treats taken away and your just at the end of your tether cannot be compared to ruthlessly and sickenly starving a child to death.

Banning it is the way to go really. It sends the message that society has moved on and you should look for better ways.

It might not be a magic bullet to stop abuse but it might help with changing social attitudes that might in time reduce abuse. My question is - where is the harm in outlawing it even if it doesn't swiftly address abuse?

It could be the first step?

To stop child abuse? I think that's pointless.

Some people will still do it. But less of them. And those that do will know it is illegal. Kayla-Jayde Priests' Mum's girlfriend in defence (of her and mum beating the 3 year old to death) said she did hit her on two different occasions, but it didn't leave a mark. Literally using this law as her defence as to why it was ok to hit her, but that it got out of hand. I don't ever want that to be used as a line of defence for these kinds of Monsters, but unless it is written in law it will continue to be so

As a Scot I agree England needs to catch up and I've had argument on here before with people who think it's OK to smack children. It would make it clear what is socially acceptable.

However, the multiple agencies that were involved in that poor child's life that decided it was better to leave him in his family are the problem. It's a received wisdom that a child is always better with family. Sadly this is not always true.

The argument that prohibiting assaults on children by law won’t stop child abuse are entirely missing the point.

Of course some people will break the law and hit their children. Just as some break the law and commit rape and murder and theft. Just as people still assault their partners despite it being against the law. In that vein, do those of you saying it won’t make a difference, think it was wrong to make rape within marriage a crime because it still happens, or to have made coercive control a crime? What about the laws on forced marriage and slavery that have been introduced? Those things still occur. To follow your arguments we should not have bothered with any of that.

Of course hitting children should be made illegal. For all that some people will still do it, there will be others who will be deterred by knowing the law forbids it. And anyone witnessing such behaviour would know they have an absolute right to report it or to intervene.

I do despair somewhat reading the defeatist responses on here essentially saying outlawing assaults on children is a waste of time.

I agree.
Although I think that there are much fewer parents who hit children now than compared to eg the 90s downwards.

@TheVolturi

Well drugs, prostitution and rape are illegal but they still happen.

Well yes, and people are prosecuted for them when they are caught. Making smacking illegal won't stop people smacking or beating their children, but it does mean that the parents have no defence available to them.

I am not sure about this.

I think that there can be situations where a smack (on a place such as the arm or leg) is actually warranted. Such an example would be a child of 3/4/5 ish removing a car seat harness whilst the parent is driving. And this kind of smack would be a short sting designed to shock the child so that they understood the severity and dangerousness of what they had done. A simple "please don't do that" is no different to saying that same phrase for something very minor such as leaving a snack wrapper on the floor.

I wouldn't consider that assault, I'd consider it a protection against the child being seriously injured.

In case anyone thinks I'm a monster who hits little kids, my kids are teens who are bigger than me. And aren't getting hit!

@gsaoej

I am not sure about this.

I think that there can be situations where a smack (on a place such as the arm or leg) is actually warranted. Such an example would be a child of 3/4/5 ish removing a car seat harness whilst the parent is driving. And this kind of smack would be a short sting designed to shock the child so that they understood the severity and dangerousness of what they had done. A simple "please don't do that" is no different to saying that same phrase for something very minor such as leaving a snack wrapper on the floor.

I wouldn't consider that assault, I'd consider it a protection against the child being seriously injured.

In case anyone thinks I'm a monster who hits little kids, my kids are teens who are bigger than me. And aren't getting hit!

It is assault - in law it’s called ‘justifiable assault’

And it’s always so interesting to me that people see parenting as either hitting a child, or meekly asking for compliance like there’s no in between.

Your child will not learn to stop unbuckling their seat because you hurt them. They don’t make that connection. The trick there is to get a car seat they can’t get out of, not to be physical with them afterwards. It’s shit parenting.

@gsaoej it doesn’t matter whether or not YOU consider it assault....it’s assault.

It makes no difference to abused children. DH works with children in care. Being hit is the least of their worries. ( and no, I'm neither condoning nor making light of it) but illegal things still happen. Making them illegal doesnt stop these wee ones being starved, beaten, burnt with cigarettes and sexually abused. I'll stop because you dont want the stuff that happens to these kids in your head. Smacking is the least of it

Yanbu. We're really lagging behind with this. Loads of countries have made it illegal now. It was 53 in 2018 but is more now. I can't believe some scumbags want to keep it legal to assault children, which is what smacking is. It's perfectly possible to bring a child up without assaulting it!

I don't think it'll stop child abuse unfortunately, but yes, smacking needs to be made illegal. One of my partner's (older) family members still thinks smacking is an acceptable form of discipline, which is why they'll never be left alone with our kids, even though they apparently wouldn't do it if told not to.

Making it illegal removes the grey area. Whilst there is a grey area some people will abuse that to injure kids. If there is no grey area then anyone who hits a child is committing a crime, there is no more grey area. It doesn't leave it up to somebody to make a subjective choice, it becomes objective fact that hitting kids is wrong no matter how people feel about it

@AlphabetAerobics

It’s illegal in Scotland and therefore magically we have no child abuse.

This ^