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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think that "wokeism" is for the privileged few?

372 replies

Mooscow · 03/12/2021 15:30

Wokeism and identity politics seems rife at the moment in the UK. But Canada and the US seem even worse. There is this massive push to avoid the possibility of ever offending anyone, ever. For example, I work for a North American company and we've just been given a long list of words never to use. This includes "female", "blind", "deaf", "blacklist", "homeless", "rule of thumb" and it goes on and on and on. So you can't say things like "turn a blind eye" or "tone deaf" etc. any more in case it offends a blind or deaf person. Really?!

I've just read an article in the FT (sorry can't share) that says the US has only sent 111million out of its pledge to send 1 billion vaccines to poorer countries. The US has 2 and a half times the amount of vaccines it needs for itself and Canada has ordered 8 times what it needs.

I know that vaccines and wokeism has little in common but it just struck me how so much effort is put into this new purity culture whilst at the same time demonstrating utter selfishness and lack of compassion for anyone else.

It's also like the push to remove the word women from healthcare such as cervical screening in case a transman, as a "cervix haver" 🤮 is offended at being grouped with women, while 40% of women (especially those without English as a first language and those in lower socio-economic groups) don't even know what a cervix is. But screw them, let's let them get cervical cancer while we pat ourselves on the back and virtue signal at making sure we don't offend by telling the truth the tiny, tiny proportion of trans people.

I wonder if the whole work/identity politics stuff is based in the fact that privileged people can effortlessly virtue signal to feel better about themselves whilst remaining selfish, uncaring and apathetic towards people who are actually in need or vulnerable. AIBU?

OP posts:
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5
334bu · 04/12/2021 12:44

www.nhsinform.scot/healthy-living/screening/cervical/cervical-screening-smear-test/

Not a single " woman" here.

DameFanny · 04/12/2021 12:51
And yet the meaning is clear, and it also makes it clear that people who've had their cervix removed won't be called for screening. What's the issue?
DameFanny · 04/12/2021 12:54

@334bu

blogs.gov.scot/fairer-scotland/2020/10/19/period-products-in-schools-regulations-coming-in-to-force/

Not one mention of" girls" when referring to students who need period products.

Again, 'pupils' is fine, and the article twice states that availability of period products is important for gender equality.

What would be added to the content by insisting on 'girls' being specified, other than then having to say 'and trans boys and some non binary'?

334bu · 04/12/2021 12:55

Changing the goal posts again?

www.prostatescotland.org.uk/disease-tests-and-treatments

Lots of " men" here

DameFanny · 04/12/2021 12:58
So? Again, specifying women means having to spell out trans and non binary inclusions.

How does having a policy that primarily supports cis women - because most women are cis, but that also supports trans men and non binary afab - 'erase' women?

skullbabe · 04/12/2021 13:00

@PrincessNutella - please read my post. The use of female especially in the American context is loaded and is being used is a very specific way to denigrate women. It’s made clear when the style guide suggests using woman/women instead of female.

elgreco · 04/12/2021 13:02

I can't attach a picture for some reason but the HSE cervical test website mentions transmen with a cervix but not women. Women are "you" I think.

skullbabe · 04/12/2021 13:05

@334bu I think that using employees to discuss menopause is reasonable and inclusive. I’m not sure why it should refer to women as some trans men go through menopause and certainly would not like to be called women.

WokeToWomenAndGirlsRights · 04/12/2021 13:06

@DameFanny Have agreed with your posts throughout.

It's those who start up hate, call to arms with the latest word of the day (pc, woke, snowflake, virtue-signallers) that have the most faux-offended stance when challenged.

WokeToWomenAndGirlsRights · 04/12/2021 13:07

Well said @LuaDipa

AdaFuckingShelby · 04/12/2021 13:08

Oh my goodness me. Denial is a very powerful thing.

elgreco · 04/12/2021 13:09

@DameFanny you asked for evidence of the erasure of the word woman . Because you thought it was untrue.
On receipt of evidence you have now decided it doesn't matter. Yes?

skullbabe · 04/12/2021 13:10

I wonder if the people objecting to the lack of identifying women and girls in these policy documents forget that non binary people and trans men exist. I agree the prostate example is a perfect space to lobby for the removal of men/male and the prostate screening excludes trans women and non binary people. I think it reasonable to discuss with Prostate Scotland the importance of using NHS Scotland’s style guide.

WokeToWomenAndGirlsRights · 04/12/2021 13:11

Don't agree with not using the word 'women' though. DameFanny

Quite agree much more with what DuaLipa has written in that regard.

skullbabe · 04/12/2021 13:13

I’m with @DameFanny - how is making something more inclusive erasing anyone. I don’t understand. Transmen exist - some of them have periods, some of them have cervices and some of them go through the menopause. Including transmen in a conversation about women is not excluding women. Am I missing something?

DameFanny · 04/12/2021 13:14

[quote elgreco]@DameFanny you asked for evidence of the erasure of the word woman . Because you thought it was untrue.
On receipt of evidence you have now decided it doesn't matter. Yes?[/quote]
I'm asking you how this is erasing the word 'woman'. What is the mechanism by which women will no longer be called women when a handful of specific gynecological texts refer to people.

When I was growing up, it was the dream for women to be seen as people. It was also the dream for women to compete in the same sports teams as men, but I see that history's been rewritten as well...

But what is the actual mechanism by which I will no longer be able to call myself a woman? How do you think that works?

skullbabe · 04/12/2021 13:14

Some transmen get pregnant - again including them in conversations does not exclude women.

DameFanny · 04/12/2021 13:16

@334bu

Changing the goal posts again?

www.prostatescotland.org.uk/disease-tests-and-treatments

Lots of " men" here

You're right, they need to be more inclusive of trans men
334bu · 04/12/2021 13:20

Some transmen get pregnant - again including them in conversations does not exclude women.

Of course transmen can get pregnant as they have a female reproductive system and they should be included in anything to do with their female bodies
However, that does not mean you should exclude the other 99+ % of the group by not also mentioning " women"

DameFanny · 04/12/2021 13:21

Fig, transwomen, not transmen

Ereshkigalangcleg · 04/12/2021 13:22

Don't you think it's great that people try to do stuff better, to be better, share how they're trying to make things better

It would be great if they were. But they aren't.

DameFanny · 04/12/2021 13:23

@Ereshkigalangcleg

Don't you think it's great that people try to do stuff better, to be better, share how they're trying to make things better

It would be great if they were. But they aren't.

Some are, but they're labelled 'woke' and 'virtue signallers' so other people can feel better about not making the attempt
334bu · 04/12/2021 13:23

You're right, they need to be more inclusive of trans men

I think you meant transwomen. Transwomen are the ones with male bodies not transmen.
However, you are quite correct all these campaigns for male cancers should state that they are cancers suffered by men and transwomen

DameFanny · 04/12/2021 13:26

@334bu

*You're right, they need to be more inclusive of trans men*

I think you meant transwomen. Transwomen are the ones with male bodies not transmen.
However, you are quite correct all these campaigns for male cancers should state that they are cancers suffered by men and transwomen

Already corrected, and just saying 'people' is a great deal less unwieldy.

But you still haven't explained how 99% of women are 'excluded' from a service (your previous post) that I'm pretty sure they're all still using..?

DameFanny · 04/12/2021 13:29

And transwomen don't have 'male bodies', they have their own bodies, whatever they look like. This is denial of trans existence which is hate speech.