Had enough of being my mums emotional crutch

[Wintersnuggles10]

My parents are in their 70s. I am their only child. My dad is a very difficult man,always has been. He a classic narcissist. We do get on reasonably well now as I only have to see him in short doses. Obviously my mum is with him 24/7.

Since I was an extremely young child (maybe 5 or 6) my mum has used me as a counsellor, an emotional support, someone to offload all her worries on to etc. She made me dislike my own father when he didn't do anything to me.
Now I'm an adult and parent myself I see how awful this was because it gave me a skewed view of my dad. He was actually a very good dad to me and still is. Was never abusive to me etc. Their relationship wasn't great obviously.
Anyway, my mum is a quiet little mouse. She doesn't have any friends, doesn't go out anywhere with anyone apart from my dad or me /our family. We speak every single day. She contacts me alot. She says if it wasn't for me and the children she would have nothing to live for. If I don't reply within the hour, she's ringing me to see where I am, if I'm OK etc. I see her twice a week. But the trouble is every time we speak on the phone she's complaining to me about my dad and telling me how much she hates him etc. I am so drained after every conversation.
Right now my child has covid and is poorly with it so I'm dealing with that, and my husband is recovering from a severe injury. I have a lot to deal with. But her offloading to me has to come first.
I honestly feel like she and I need some therapy. She is far to reliant on me for emotional support but doesn't give me any support in return. Any tips on how I should deal with this going forward? I can't face anthother 10/20 years of it. But without me she'd be suffering in silence

Sounds to me as if you have both got into a habit here. She tells you all her woes because that is what she has always done and you let here. You listen to all her woes because you have been conditioned to do so since you were young and because now it feels like too tale to change things.

You can set some boundaries here, though, hard as it might be. Next time she rings and starts complaining about your dad, have some sentences written down in front of you that you can say to her.

Like ….

Mum, all you every do is ring me up to complain about dad. I’ve really had enough and don’t want to hear your complaints any more. Can we talk about something else?

Mum, if you are just going to go over the same old ground complaining about dad, I’m not interested. The only person who can change things is you. Not me. Can we talk about something else?

If she persists ….

Mum, I’ve told you I’m not interested in hearing you complain. I’ve had enough and I’m going to say goodbye now and hang up the phone. Let’s talk when you have something else to say.

Mum, you have no idea how wearing it is on my emotional health hearing you complain about dad all the time. I’ve had enough and I’m going to say goodbye now. Love you …. Bye.

Before you set out on your shopping trip:

Mum, we have arranged today so we can have a good time shopping together and get some Christmas treats. But if you start complaining about dad again, I’m going to turn the car right round and taking you home. I don’t want to hear anymore.

And follow through!

Cut down the number of calls. If she texts, you don’t have to answer. If she rings you, presumably you have caller ID, and can send her call to voicemail. Can you tell her a specific time in the week when you’ll be free for a natter? Tell you will be happy to hear from her but you won’t be interested in hearing her complaints about your dad.

@billy1966

Your mother has put herself first, ahead of your happiness and well being her whole life. Ahead of her child.

Are you going to do the same?
Because it sounds like YOU are now putting your mother ahead of your husband, children and your own family's happiness?

Your husband is not happy?
Yet you continue to allow your mother to use and abuse you?

You need to think about the above.

Why are you putting this woman ahead of your family?

You surely don't want your children to look back atvtheir childhood and just remember a stressed mother because she wouldn't put space between her and their grandmother?

You need to give your head a wobble.

Your loyalty is to your husband and children and NOT your mother.

You need to tell her that you need space.
You don't want to hear from her every day.
You don't want to hear her mention your father.

So what if she has nothing to live for?

That is NOT your problem to fix.

I don't mean to be harsh but you need to be a better mother to your children that she was to you.

Stop putting her ahead of your children and husband.

Your family need you happy and well.

She is preventing this.

Stop being a slave to her needs.

Seek out counselling to help you disengage from her.

Her happiness is not your responsibility.

When you get this, it is so freeing.

Don't waste this time with your children on her.

You cannot fix her.

Classic post, really spot on. OP I wish you all the best, please read what billy 66 has said over and over. Prioritize your own family unit now and let go. 💐

That sounds absolutely exhausting for you. And sad to carry all that turmoil about their relationship.

I think forget about joint therapy with your mum for now, but definitely do it for yourself. In all likelihood your mum isn't going to suddenly see the light or change, but you can change. You have the motivation and energy to learn how to set boundaries.

It may be that you find you have some other unhealthy relationships too, it is generally par for the course when you've been raised amongst such toxicity.

@Wintersnuggles10
I keep coming back to this… I wrote before and suggested that you question if your Dad was really the parent with Narc. personality disorder.

I think you need to also consider if your mother has no other frame of reference with which to connect to you (or anyone else.)…

She has no friends. (That’s telling also.) Her only topic is her and her relationship. If you take that conversation off the table, what can she talk about?
Can you try that? Maybe tell her that it’s too painful for you and it’s absolutely inappropriate. Tell her you will happily discuss anything else with her except her unhappiness with your Dad and see whether she HAS another channel.

*Also agree that joint therapy is actually inappropriate. She needs her own. You need your own.
Just as marriage counselling is inappropriate with an abusive partner, it’s not advisable in this case either. If you two went together, she would make it about her anyway.

What your mother has done to you is abusive. I'm sorry.

@billy1966 your post is PERFECT

You have a good opportunity now, with your son having COVID and DH recovering from a severe injury, to change things.

Tell her that you are physically and emotionally exhausted and you can’t take the additional stress of being your own’s mother’s counsellor, that you have discussed this with your doctor who said that it’s not healthy for you to be a counsellor to your own mother. Ask her if she takes all your time using you as a counsellor, where am I supposed to to get my own emotional support from?

If you let this go on, she will soon start using your daughter as a counsellor too. Protect yourself as you would protect your daughter.

@Justilou1 she's definitely not narcissistic but I think she does like being the victim.
When they met my dad was a big character, very sociable etc. My mum came from a strict family with a lot of rules so she found this very attractive. She loved the new life style but quickly realised that that came before anything else. He didn't look after the home or house. Money was for socialising.
Over the years my dad has stayed the same. He has lots of friends, goes to the pub every weekend, he's a loud, character who always has to be the centre of attention. But he also thinks that he is right about everything, that he is superior to everyone else, and it's his way or no way . He is also anxious and depressive and doesn't handle stress well. And has a bad temper.
Over the years she has retreated into herself and is basically a doormat allowing him to walk all over her. She is very quiet. Never argues back to him etc. He is in charge every day of where they go, what they do, what they eat, what they watch on TV. She let's him choose everything.
She gets jealous my life isn't like that. I've told her that if she pushed back and told him no sometimes then it wouldn't have gotten to this situation.
Since I've had kids I don't work at the moment, so she knows I've got the time to chat. Any time she is alone for 5 mins she will ring me to vent. No interest in what I'm doing or dealing with. I snapped at her about it the other day because she was complaining about how my dad couldn't choose what new car to get and it was stressing her out. I said she should try dealing with a sick child and husband like I am at the moment.

Maybe she’s depressed or broken or whatever, but it is still utterly her choice to remain where she is and to have put you in the position you are in. Submissive personality types tend to carry more power in their relationship than you will recognize. It allows them to avoid responsibility and accountability. Take a step back and try and be objective. What exactly does she get out of this deal with your dad? What does she get from you? Is she setting you up to take over from him when he’s gone?

I had the same thing too when I was a child.

Being used by my mother as an emotional crutch and having to hear her criticise my father's behaviour. The difference is my father was abusive towards me mentally and physically but never, ever to her and she never lifted a finger to protect me...she had a very nice comfortable life but was never happy,

I now realise that she was simply a manipulating, narcissistic individual who was playing the victim.

Her conversations were mostly about criticising everyone from her siblings to the neighbours. She was just an endless emotional drain and had no friends or interests. But she expected her family to always be there, no matter how she behaved.

In the end I cut all contact with her to save my own physical and mental health.

God, I got a queasy feeling as I read the post title as it is exactly how I feel about my mum.
My lovely dad died many years ago and since then I am expected to be my mums proxy partner/emotional support/helper etc. She openly said when I was a child that she was jealous because she thought my dad was my favourite parent and I ruined her marriage...

For the sake of my family and with the support of DH I had some really excellent therapy and put some boundaries in.
I even said no to her asking to sleep at my house the other day as I need space to work.

But gosh it is so hard and you really have my sympathy. My mum can be really unpredictable, people would see her as a devoted mum and grandma but she is actually an emotional vampire at times.

Sending solidarity and strong recommendations of some therapy for you to manage how you want to go forward with this relationship.

'Submissive personality types tend to carry more power in their relationship than you will recognize. It allows them to avoid responsibility and accountability'

This is such a good point. Endless complaining and offloading means you don't have any intention of actually doing anything about the situation. You get to stay in your 'poor me', victim role and encourage other people to feel sorry for you. It backfires of course because people have their own lives to be getting on with and it's bloody tiring listening to endless misery

I think you can try to improve it. And now is a good time. Its not a black and white situation where you give her everything or nothing or are a loving daughter or a heartless one.

You can have the chat. Mum i love you but right now with all this negativity and struggle in my own life i need some of our interactions to be more positive and to give me some relief. I know you find things difficult but its all a bit heavy and i need us to talk about easy and fun topics too.

Or at the meet up. Mum having a bad day. Lets have five/ten minutes to both get what we need to off our chests and then no more talking about Dad/work/DH. Lets just have a lovely day. Then at the ten min mark cut it off. And then remind her in a kind way each time she slips back into it which she will. You will likely have to repeat many times over many weeks. Its not cutting her off. But timeboxing her. Or each time she says something negative ask her to tell you something good that happened. Just increase her awareness.

Just think small things. If you can't face it. Push the gaps between responding. If she messages a lot-reply. Tough day mum. Call you tomorrow. Create space. That doesnt ha ve to be unkind. You are fundamentally there for her-but it doesn't need to be 24/7.

If these things dont work or you struggle to change even these small things you may need some therapy to put up some boundaries.

Its very hard op. My mother ruled the roost. I let calls go to voicemail. Strict boundaries. Then moods start. Not pandering to it. I envy easy families

My Mum has always done similar

She was always offloading to me about my dad as a teenager, even though i did tell her it felt inappropriate to me at the time. She said she couldn’t talk to her family because they would then think badly of my Dad - I guess she wanted to keep up the facade of a happy marriage.

Like many of you I have now done advising her to leave him - she still harks back to it time and time again.

Excellent post @billy66. That covers it all.

I have a difficult parent who would quite happily suck the life out of me if they could.

You have to accept that she's not much of a mum. Forget what a mum 'should be', she's not that and she won't ever be. Then you draw boundaries around the time you're willing to give her and don't budge. I speak to my father once a week. That's it. He doesn't visit my family and he never will. I don't care what anyone else thinks about that. It's all I can cope with.

@Wintersnuggles10 - there is a thread today about worst behaviour you’ve ever witnessed at Christmas (or something). You should read how many involve arsehole mothers. You’re not alone.

The children and I went to my parents for dinner over the weekend. We had a lovely time when we were all together fun and laughter, playing with the kids etc.
But as soon as me and mum were in the kitchen alone washing up she started immediately. Telling me what kind of hell she'd been through that week with him. She'd already told me during the multiple phone calls. She was on the brink of tears. Telling me he doesn't respect her etc and how he drags her down. I did snap and told her our conversations drag me down too.she was also explaining about how my dad had a difficult childhood which seems to be affecting /bothering him now. I used the opportunity to tell her how affected I have been from things from my childhood too. I made her very aware that neither of them have been perfect parents to me and left her to think about it. She messaged me yesterday to say how lovely it was to see us.
I am going to keep on repeating every time that I don't want to listen anymore

Well done Winter. It's really not easy to confront this kind of behaviour. Do you think she was able to hear what you said about the impact of it all on you?

Gold Star for you @Wintersnuggles10!!! Hope her head remains well and truly out of her arsehole from now on!

Well done OP.

Cutting her off abruptly the minute she starts off and not answering the phone are definite starts.

I think you need to tell her that this has to stop permanently. Every time she starts about your DF tell her coldly that you are putting the phone down.

She is responsible for her own happiness,

If you can afford therapy @Wintersnuggles10 then I would take it. It can really help you unpick and make strategies to deal with difficult family relationships. In the mean time it sounds like you are starting to put healthy boundaries in place.

@Justilou1

Are you sure your dad is the classic narcissist? They’re not usually capable of being good parents. Your mum’s inability to differentiate her role as parent is actually more telling. And to constantly choose the role of victim and remain so even to expect a small child to be her adult/hero/counsellor,confidante, etc…. I suspect that she is actually a Covert Narcissist, and your father may still have Narcissistic Traits, but actually be her “Beard.” I bet in their relationship, her “Victim” role is actually covering for her dominant, controlling behaviours. (Ie, having to know where you are at all times, calling you constantly, being intrusive, invading your private, emotional, mental space, etc.) He is acting as a dominant person, but is in fact, terrified of her losing her shit.

I agree. I very much doubt your Father was a good parent AND a Narc. From your description it’s more likely your Mother is - they come in different shapes and sizes. Anyway, it doesn’t really matter. What you need to do is really try and not be as available either physically or emotionally to her