Freezing schools

[Ineedapuppy]

DD8 has cried this afternoon at how cold it is in her classroom with all the doors and windows open. Apparently she’s not allowed a blanket from home and the only response from school is to wear layers under uniform

AIBU to think that this is unkind? At work (large multi National company) staff would NOT work in these freezing conditions. How can it be fair to expect young kids to do it and if so, why make them wear flimsy uniforms?

@Ineedapuppy

It’s interesting to see such a mix of responses.

DD is wearing skins (sports thermals) but she’s freezing. She’s not allowed blankets, hot drinks, hot food in flasks for lunch (apparently a risk ) and I haven’t dared broach foot warmers.

She’s crying because she’s cold - she’s just of those types that feels the cold .

Why can’t we have air purifiers or bi-weekly testing or something else? Why put the burden in small kids

Totally agree, poor things. How awful that she has been crying from the cold whereas people are sitting cheek by jowl in the tube with no masks. I would complain about this, very very loudly.

I feel very grateful that DD's school seem to have missed the memo on ventilation.

A few times a year I have to spend 6+ hours in unheated churches. No amount of layers is enough. Generally I'll start off warm but by about the third hour the coldness really sets in.

Things I've found that help the most are lots of thin layers, then the warmest socks you can find and shoes with good thick soles so that you don't lose warmth through your feet. Would schools let kids wear fur-lined boots to school?

A quick google shows Norway and Sweden recommend indoor temperature of 18 or 19 minimum for 'light work'.

@Frlrlrubert I don’t know anyone who has their heating under 20-22 c all the time here.

Children also feel the cold far more due to their skin surface: body mass ration being so much higher than an adult's, and therefore losing heat much faster.

Guidance in the UK is that an office should be a minimum of 16 celcius, and this is based on if a the physiology of middle-aged men in an office environment (that's how the min appropriate office temps were set and why many women freeze in offices every winter).

So the minimum temperature acceptable for a child to be expected to sit still in and concentrate is much, much higher than that - probably at least 18 degrees. For children who feel the cold, or are smaller, maybe 20 degrees.

Yes - it is totally unreasonable OP to expect them to freeze and still work. If I am cold I can't concentrate at all. We can't expect children to learn like that. There is a limit to how many layers someone can wear. And many families won't be able to afford good thermals.

Not to mention that no matter how many layers they wear, you cannot feel properly warm if hands or feet are cold. How many layers can you wear inside school shoes. How many pairs of gloves can you wear while holding a pen?

You don’t need to have ALL the doors and windows open to ventilate a room. Having just the top windows open a bit will do the trick and not affect the room temperature too much. They’re going totally over board.

@TrulyPistoff

A quick google shows Norway and Sweden recommend indoor temperature of 18 or 19 minimum for 'light work'.

@Frlrlrubert I don’t know anyone who has their heating under 20-22 c all the time here.

I do.

@Frlrlrubert I work in a school and we have asked (begged) to lower the temperatures indoors because it is too hot.

So the minimum temperature acceptable for a child to be expected to sit still in and concentrate is much, much higher than that - probably at least 18 degrees. For children who feel the cold, or are smaller, maybe 20 degrees.

It’s going to be 0 degrees this week and still it’s brushed off for dc

I meant I have it set to kick in if the house ever goes below 20 degrees, even in summer.

Sorry - the opposite of what you meant!

I’m a lecturer so same situation. My best tip is sheepskin insoles in shoes/boots. If your feet are cold it is impossible for the rest of you to feel comfortable.

@MarshaBradyo

So the minimum temperature acceptable for a child to be expected to sit still in and concentrate is much, much higher than that - probably at least 18 degrees. For children who feel the cold, or are smaller, maybe 20 degrees.

It’s going to be 0 degrees this week and still it’s brushed off for dc

Totally unacceptable and I'd be making a formal complaint and encouraging other parents to do likewise.

Kids have been screwed over enough these last two years. Making them freeze all day is beyond the pale.

Feels a bit weird to be in a country where right now we have -22c, but no children would ever be cold in schools.

@TrulyPistoff

Feels a bit weird to be in a country where right now we have -22c, but no children would ever be cold in schools.

Please tell the UK Government this!

Just wait till you hear about some of the other shitty conditions in schools, like a lack of qualified teachers, bare bones SEN funding, pitiful catch-up funding.

Why is it kids going cold the one that gets parents really aerated?

You can get these back warmers which really help, they stop any cold air getting in and not bulky
https://www.nukunuku.co.uk/nukunuku-kids-haramaki-254-p.asp

@MyCatIsAFuckwit

@ 20:26 EstoPerpetua One of my DC was a cathedral chorister from the age of 7, and it is absolutely freezing in an unheated cathedral in winter. Several thermal layers were the answer. He used to sing in two pairs of thermal long johns, thermal socks, two thermal long-sleeved vests, school uniform, cassock and surplice. 🤣🤣 This made me howl, if you intended to be funny or not.....I can't quite make up my mind. I work in a school, lunch break included on a exposed hill. It is cold these days!

Exactly. Some of these posts are absurd.

Yeah, let's change all the school uniforms to dress like the michelin man!

@noblegiraffe

Just wait till you hear about some of the other shitty conditions in schools, like a lack of qualified teachers, bare bones SEN funding, pitiful catch-up funding.

Why is it kids going cold the one that gets parents really aerated?

Because being warm enough to concentrate is a percondition of a child being able to learn before any of the other stuff even comes into play.

With all of your experience surely you realise that?

Thousand yep absurd and agree re bad end of stick once again

Luckily my dc are ok (windows don’t open or seems to be warm enough, maybe heated) but if any child is crying or upset due to cold say something imo

I’m getting rather enraged to some of these answers. “Dress her warmly”, it’s the bloody School uniform rule that should be dismissed for this time. And I’m laughing at comparison with Scandinavian outdoor nurseries, have you seen what they are wearing? In the winter people wear down jackets and snowsuits and all that, not a polo shirt and a flimsy cardigan with an extra layer underneath.

And I say that as an autistic who got ZERO support in school at all.

Kids should not be sitting freezing cold at school to prevent the spread of an illness which barely affects them. It's just utter madness. Restaurants and pubs aren't freezing cold. Poor kids.

@Hellolittlestar

I’m getting rather enraged to some of these answers. “Dress her warmly”, it’s the bloody School uniform rule that should be dismissed for this time. And I’m laughing at comparison with Scandinavian outdoor nurseries, have you seen what they are wearing? In the winter people wear down jackets and snowsuits and all that, not a polo shirt and a flimsy cardigan with an extra layer underneath.

Indeed. Hardly comparable to a polo shirt and polyester jumper with a thermal vest.

And for many of the parents who struggle, where are they meant to get money now for thermal undergarments?

It's an absolute joke. Children should not be expected to sit in freezing cold classrooms all day. Nowhere else is doing this but once again children are bottom of the pile and expected yo just suck it up.

@Mantlemoose I assume it was voluntary though - school isn't voluntary

Cathedral choristers attend the cathedral school and rehearsals and services as part of their education. So for them, being at the cathedral is mandatory!

Teacher here. Classrooms generally colder in the mornings as teachers keep their outside doors open for children to arrive, but the rest of the time doors are closed and windows are open a little for air. All doors in the corridors leading you the playground are open all the time. Pupils are able to wear coats, hats, gloves or whatever but they're generally not required. My office is freezing but that's because the building is old and it's single-glazed and draughty and the radiators are rubbish! I keep spare socks and a coat in there at all times in case I feel particularly chilly.

No CO2 monitors, though, that I've seen, so no idea what the levels are in classrooms.

Because being warm enough to concentrate is a percondition of a child being able to learn before any of the other stuff even comes into play.

Indeed, but that doesn’t mean that the other stuff is ok and parents should let it slide, does it?

There’s a thread at the moment where a parent pissed off that her kid doesn’t have a qualified teacher has people queuing up to tell her it’s just fine.

Threads about lack of school funding or similar get tumbleweeds.

Parents should be this angry about the state of schools, all of it, not just the bits that are cold.