Freezing schools

[Ineedapuppy]

DD8 has cried this afternoon at how cold it is in her classroom with all the doors and windows open. Apparently she’s not allowed a blanket from home and the only response from school is to wear layers under uniform

AIBU to think that this is unkind? At work (large multi National company) staff would NOT work in these freezing conditions. How can it be fair to expect young kids to do it and if so, why make them wear flimsy uniforms?

@Burnt0utMum

It was freezing here today. I usually leave the window open all day but couldn't cope today. No way kids should have to sit freezing all day when they're trying to learn. I have Raynauds and no amount of thermals has ever helped. The kids should be able to be comfortable so they can learn effectively.

How effectively will they learn if you/they are off with covid? Shutting windows is irresponsible. It’s the only mitigation schools have.

@Hummingbird80

YANBU. The government guidance literally says "you should balance the need for increased ventilation while maintaining a comfortable temperature". It sounds like the school is not following this - might be worth raising the guidance with them.

So where’s the balance? Close the windows and there’s no ventilation and the already high covid risk in a classroom rockets. The DfE are talking nonsense to cover their own backs. There is no way to balance those 2 things in reality. It’s a way to blame schools either way. If there’s an outbreak because windows were closed, it’s the schools’ fault for closing windows. When people complain their children are cold, it’s the schools’ fault for opening the windows.

I'm always really puzzled by the fact that it's too big a mental jump for some from "I/my child feels cold" to "Wear more clothing."

Layers layers layers I'm afraid.

At one point during last January's lockdown my classroom was 9 degrees (no pupils, I was teaching online from school around supervising the key worker's children).

It was raised that people in offices wouldn't stand for it and it was basically ignored.

We were only supposed to let pupils keep coats on if it was under 16 degrees (it was 13 the first day back after lockdown).

I wore thermal tights under trousers, thermal socks, vest, long sleeved top, shirt, jumper, cardigan, and pashmina/scarf when the pupils were in.

On days I was in on my own I cheated and brought in my electric blanket and wrapped it around my legs.

One teacher in our department was so cold one day she lit all the bunsens to see if it would make a difference.

@Hummingbird80

YANBU. The government guidance literally says "you should balance the need for increased ventilation while maintaining a comfortable temperature". It sounds like the school is not following this - might be worth raising the guidance with them.

How do you balance it? The windows are either closed, Covid spreads beautifully and education is disrupted or windows are open and it’s cold from now until March. I hate being cold but I accept it as the other option is increasing my Covid risk. Buy some thermals and convince the school to make some changes to uniform as the government guidance is not really any guidance at all.

How did people manage in days gone by, or in properly cold countries?

@Tootsey11

This is what happens when kids are used to overly heated houses. They cannot deal with a little bit of cold.

Wrap up warm and get on with it.

ODFOD. It was 1 degree here this morning, it’s not a little bit of cold. Yes, blankets are probably impractical, yes layers are the answer. But why not just say, “yes, poor kids, have you tried thermals?” instead of acting like an 8 year old child is being unreasonable for getting cold in a freezing classroom.

It’s not like there’s a prize for most unpleasant post, you know. You’re not in a competition to see who can be the nastiest.

Perhaps not the most environmental response but feet warmers are an absolute god send for kids and staff alike. They pop in your shoes and stay toasty warm like you’ve got a hot water bottle on them for the whole day.

Genuine question though - are some schools extending "must ventilate" to include "can't have the heating on either"?

the only response from school is to wear layers under uniform

Have you tried doing this? I would buy thermal undergarments for starters and see if that helps.

Personally I would rather they were in a well ventilated space to avoid catching all sorts of bugs.

@EstoPerpetua

I should think she jolly well isn't allowed a blanket at school.

One of my DC was a cathedral chorister from the age of 7, and it is absolutely freezing in an unheated cathedral in winter. Several thermal layers were the answer. He used to sing in two pairs of thermal long johns, thermal socks, two thermal long-sleeved vests, school uniform, cassock and surplice. I bought all (apart from the cassock and surplice, obvs) in Mountain Warehouse.

I assume it was voluntary though - school isn't voluntary.

My DD's school (private, usually very uniform strict) is currently encouraging: long sleeved/leg thermals, jumpers, non-uniform gilets under blazers, coats, hats and scarves in classrooms, as they have to have the windows wide open.

@HesterShaw1

Genuine question though - are some schools extending "must ventilate" to include "can't have the heating on either"?

Perhaps they're taking the view that radiators on plus windows open is burning £50 notes.

DD is still wearing just a polo shirt & pinafore, says it's still warm in the classroom. We have managed to swap from socks to tights and get her to wear a vest since half term but still no cardigan or jumper. We are northerners though!!

Neither my DM when I was at school or me would have accepted layering to be the only option. If layering had been tried and still freezing then they'd have been given a blanket to take in with them. It really is as simple as that.

We have a big COVID outbreak in our school (despite government saying last year that schools are safe and teachers not at risk and masking the statistics to prove their point). Most schools in the area (Midlands) are the same.
Teachers are off sick.
Children are off sick with COVID but siblings are still coming in (as per government guidelines).
Classes are being covered by anyone available eg 1:1s, just to keep open. Not much quality teaching being done. Interventions and support for those on ECHCP are non-existent.
Remaining staff are on their knees.
Like it or not OP, the windows need to stay open.
And yes, staff are feeling even colder than the children.

Perhaps they're taking the view that radiators on plus windows open is burning £50 notes.

This. We can’t afford a few glue sticks. We are counting every single paper towel or photocopy that we do.
Putting a radiator on when the windows and doors are open is a pointless waste.

My son wears a coat in the classroom as it's so cold - it was all pointless as been a huge breakout in the class anyway!

All of that shivering for nothing!

@EllaVaNight

What are people's suggestions for children from low income families? All these extra clothes simply are not possible for many families. Schools should be safe for poor children.

I absolutely agree. Thermals from m&s and forest schools are not on the radar of lower income families. These children are often sent to school in inappropriate clothing for bad weather. Poor kids.

@HesterShaw1

Genuine question though - are some schools extending "must ventilate" to include "can't have the heating on either"?

The heaters cut out in our school if they detect open windows (for environmental reasons). It's 9 degrees in my classroom at best. Layers and lots of them are how ill get through another winter in a classroom.

Reading this thread has just made me realise that when I visited school a week ago it was the first time that I haven't felt ill. Eldest DC is year 5 and school has always been hotter than hell, to the point that in the middle of winter you deliberately had to dress in a way that would make you freeze on the journey but just about avoid passing out while you were there. It wasn't cold when I visited just far more "season" appropriate i.e put a jumper on weather rather than stripping down to a t-shirt the second you enter the building. In full disclosure though we only really have 2 hours of heating on a day and all 3 of mine wear shorts to school pretty much all year round

Why would the staff be feeling even colder than the children? Children have greater surface area to volume and therefore lose heat more quickly than adults. Added to this, they often have less subcutaneous fat to provide insulation, and younger children especially have less ability to regulate their temperature.

It’s comments like that that give teachers a reputation for martyrdom.

Ditto the comment re “schools being safe”. Anyone with half a brain knows the government meant “schools are safe for kids because covid is generally not very serious for children”.

My daughter wears thermals/skins under her uniform. She either has tights or long johns under her trousers and wears wrist warmers which seem to do the job pretty well

Someone these replies. As if a child isn't allowed to feel cold and to get on with it. Ffs.
I feel the cold badly, even with layers. A child is allowed to say they are cold.

Haven’t rtft so sorry if this has already been suggested but could you get her some handwarmers? The reusable ones where you boil them until the gel inside goes soft, and then click the little metal disc inside when you want them to warm up. I used to take a stash in my blazer pockets on long, cold walks to school!

www.superdrug.com/Toiletries/Washing-%26-Bathing/Pampering-Gift-Sets/Superdrug-Fantasy-Star-Handwarmers/p/802461