Early Christmas decorations = working class

[FaLaLaLaLaaaar]

I know Mumsnet loves a class debate, so thought I’d share an argument I had with a friend last night.

She insists that only working class people put their Christmas decorations up in November, I insisted she’s a snob and class is more redundant these days so it’s a ridiculous argument.

So Vipers, I’ll ask the question as if it is coming from me to make it easier:

AIBU to think only working class people put their Christmas decorations up in November?

Yabu - No, don’t be such a snob, middle class people do too.

YANBU - Yes, it’s a working class thing.

I will be showing her the results of this.

@CounsellorTroi

Christmas tree up in my road already. The horror - this is a naice road!

This is how is starts. Before long you'll have old washing machines in front gardens and tenants. Act now. Put anonymous notes through their door and start a campaign to have your road redesignated an avenue.

Its interesting how important people consider being MC. In my experience the 'solid' MC barely give it a thought. They just are who they are. It seems to me thats its people who are teetering on the edges that asign the rules, the new arrivals, the ones whose background doesn't match their current circumstances. It makes me wonder why they care so much? Given similar incomes, there is nothing that 'being MC' affords you in this day and age that's not equally open to WC people. So while I can understand people chasing higher earnings, I genuinely don't understand why they need a label to go with it.

We have just moved to the UK this year and I'm shocked this is even a thing. We have ours up already. We have always done it early because it's just for us to enjoy for longer. It's sad though how people judge others on things that are so insignificant.

@5128gap

Its interesting how important people consider being MC. In my experience the 'solid' MC barely give it a thought. They just are who they are. It seems to me thats its people who are teetering on the edges that asign the rules, the new arrivals, the ones whose background doesn't match their current circumstances. It makes me wonder why they care so much? Given similar incomes, there is nothing that 'being MC' affords you in this day and age that's not equally open to WC people. So while I can understand people chasing higher earnings, I genuinely don't understand why they need a label to go with it.

But that’s a classic ‘established MC’ sneer at the nouveau riche/ arrivistes.

I'm a long way from established MC Agedvellum. I'm from a solidly WC background, with a degree, and a good job, and decent income due to partner in high earning trade, but definitely WC, and sneering at no one. From my perspective my social class isn't a barrier to my access to things associated with being MC. I can decorate my home how I choose, wear what I please, access the leisure activities of my choice, give my DC opportunities. So genuinely don't see how 'becoming MC' would make any positive difference to my life. Yet other people seem to value it very highly, and I wonder why.

In fact, if anything joining the MC seems to be rather stressful if it requires policing your purchases, activities, lifestyle choices, Christmas decorations, appearance, career choice, all in accordance with a set of inexplicable criteria that you can barely find two people who agree on.

I think for me is where I am. I'm in Australia and everyone around me has already up their Christmas decorations by the end of November partly because it's a combination of Christmas and going for main school summer holidays rolled into one.

In Spain where Christmas is only celebrated by public holidays and kids have only a 2 week off school, decorations start mid December and are much more focused on Christmas than on holidays.

It doesn't suit me to put decorations up in November then rip them all down as soon as possible after Xmas. I'd prefer to put them up a week or two before Xmas then enjoy them afterwards too, rather than being desperate to clear it all away like some people seem to be. I like a real tree, which probably wouldn't appreciate being inside for a month either! I don't think it's particularly class related, more related to people who get overexcited about Xmas too early, then are sick of it all by the time it actually arrives.

My old next door neighbour is often quoted in our house after she said “I do like to drive around not such nice areas and look at the Christmas lights”. Lol

Pre covid I would have agreed.

I believe people put lights and decorations up early to cheer themselves up, so the poorer and more socially disadvantaged have usually gone for early decorations because they have little else to enjoy. But as a nation we are feeling more depressed and emotionally drained so this year, and last year, I have seen decorations in November across a range of houses, wealthy and poor alike.

I’m certainly not established middle class. My mother grew up poor and while my dad was a teacher his father was self made. DH is from a working class background.

I’d personally rather put my decs and (fake, pre-lit) tree up later and enjoy them for longer but I don’t really care what other people do.

@5128gap

Its interesting how important people consider being MC. In my experience the 'solid' MC barely give it a thought. They just are who they are. It seems to me thats its people who are teetering on the edges that asign the rules, the new arrivals, the ones whose background doesn't match their current circumstances. It makes me wonder why they care so much? Given similar incomes, there is nothing that 'being MC' affords you in this day and age that's not equally open to WC people. So while I can understand people chasing higher earnings, I genuinely don't understand why they need a label to go with it.

Tbh i dont think about and worry about the label because its pointless for me.

I have absolutely no argument i can make that im working class or from a working class background. I'm just MC and there is no point contesting it.

Equally i dont really feel a need to prove anything. Certainly not to the neighbours. Don't like how i live my life? Tough. If the most you have to worry about is Christmas Trees bringing the area down in standards then I think it just illustates the sheer lunancy of it.

I do think its all about insecurity though.

I just can't be arsed.

@RedToothBrush, it is positively refreshing to hear someone say 'I'm middle-class.' Perhaps you could give an official pronouncement on decorations.

@Worldgonecrazy

Pre covid I would have agreed.

I believe people put lights and decorations up early to cheer themselves up, so the poorer and more socially disadvantaged have usually gone for early decorations because they have little else to enjoy. But as a nation we are feeling more depressed and emotionally drained so this year, and last year, I have seen decorations in November across a range of houses, wealthy and poor alike.

Honestly, this is such a myth. Lower income and WC people enjoy their lives just as much (or as little, depending on other variables) as MC people do. We see friends and family, we go out and access entertainment, get satisfaction from our jobs and hobbies, work towards and achieve meaningful goals, laugh and have fun. Of course there are people who are very disadvantaged and have miserable lives, but typically that level of deprivation is unlikely to facilitate displays of Christmas lights.

Fancy that 5128gap, like real people?

It's like there's a whole social class of people who form the majority of the population who cannot be accurately represented by watching 'Won't pay? Then tough fuck loser'.

@5128gap

Its interesting how important people consider being MC. In my experience the 'solid' MC barely give it a thought. They just are who they are. It seems to me thats its people who are teetering on the edges that asign the rules, the new arrivals, the ones whose background doesn't match their current circumstances. It makes me wonder why they care so much? Given similar incomes, there is nothing that 'being MC' affords you in this day and age that's not equally open to WC people. So while I can understand people chasing higher earnings, I genuinely don't understand why they need a label to go with it.

All of this. If you have to SAY you're middle class, and keep on trying to prove^ it, by parping on about all the middle class things you do, and buy, and all about the middle class ways you ACT; that just make me roll my eyes.

You are anything but middle class if you have to keep telling people you are and keep trying to act it. And the genuine middle classes are laughing at you.

I am working class but know a number of middle class people, and they are nothing like the posters on here who claim to be be middle class. The faux middle classes on here, are just judgy and self righteous and snobby, with their 'ewww look what the working class, and lower class chavs do' type comments, and are ANYthing but middle class. They do look very silly though.

You do know there is a sector of society who are not working class, but would probably be called that by others? If a family have not worked for several generations then they are not working class.

It’s these areas of high deprivation and unemployment that generally used to be the first to put up the decorations which is where the snootiness of some (both working and middle class) comes from.

I guess Some people like to find a reason to look down on others.

And I’m actually glad some of you have lived a sheltered life and not had interaction with those who have been born into less fortunate circumstances, and so don’t realise that this sector exists and is sadly, a large sector, and getting larger.

Far from sheltered, I am the daughter, niece, ex wife and cousin to miners who went from WC to unemployed in the 80s, often with their health shot, and in a community at the top of the indices of deprivation. So I'm very familiar with long term unemployment and poverty that spans generations. I completely agree that no one should be looked down on, but equally, to pity people because you believe they have nothing in their lives but Christmas decorations is misplaced and patronising. You think you are speaking up for them, but imagine expressing that view to them. What reaction do you think you'd get?

I lived in Germany for a few months many years ago, and my landlady there said they never put the tree up before Christmas eve, but would leave it up until the middle of January, at least.

If a family have not worked for several generations then they are not working class.
Idle rich?

My dad is very proud to be working class. He is in his seventies and to him it means having worked in a non managerial role for a wage.

When we were young he worked two jobs.

He wouldn’t see unemployed people as being working class, and he doesn’t understand why people consider people who don’t work as working class.

I suspect by most people’s standards he is actually middle class. We had two cars, a holiday in the states most years, private tutors, and my parents owned their own home.

Dad’s rule is no decorations before 10 December - always a real tree and always warm white lights😂

If they have not worked for several generations they'll be part of our revered royal family. Who, according to tittle-tattle from many years ago, are just jumped up German nouveau pushers-in and not nearly as posh as Princess Michael of Kent or the Spencers. Bit common really

Strange that it is OK to say on MN "I am proud to be working class", but should anyone say they are proud to be middle class they would be derided and accused of snobbery.

@TrickyD

Strange that it is OK to say on MN "I am proud to be working class", but should anyone say they are proud to be middle class they would be derided and accused of snobbery.

Its not really strange is it, given we live in a culture where its generally considered better to be MC, and inappropriate to brag.

I am lolling at the knowledge that you'll be judged for the tone of your white lights. 😂

It's a tough old world