To think learning how to behave around dogs should be part of the national curriculum

[Itsadogsworld]

I think schools should teach children how to behave around dogs, canine body language and so on. I think it would significantly reduce the number of children that end up in A&E each year due to dogs bites. I’ve seen some dreadful behaviour in my local park where children will run up to my dog and one child was continually trying to bear hug her own dog. Children clearly aren’t being taught this at home so I think they should include it in schools. I welcome your thoughts on this.

AudacityBaby

I agree with every word of your post.

My dog is trained because it's in his interests for me to make sure he is, I consider it essential for his safety and well being. I would always put his safety before a showdown over the rights and wrongs of someone else's behaviour towards him.

I simply cannot get my head around parents who think that because the law is on their side they do not have a responsibility to educate their child about safe behaviour around dogs. It does not remove responsibility from dog owners but it may decrease the risk of your child being killed or injured.

I suppose some people cannot understand it's better to be safe than right.

How about dog owners should have to have a license & prove that they are responsible enough to deal with managing their own dog.

This is coming from a dog owner, who can see the signs in their own dog and would step in before allowing him to be provoked to such an extent that he would hurt a child. I also would never leave him alone with ANY small children or even older children that I do not 100% trust.

Bad owners are the problem here.

@Whywonttheyhelpme

How about dog owners should have to have a license & prove that they are responsible enough to deal with managing their own dog.

This is coming from a dog owner, who can see the signs in their own dog and would step in before allowing him to be provoked to such an extent that he would hurt a child. I also would never leave him alone with ANY small children or even older children that I do not 100% trust.

Bad owners are the problem here.

Can we also have a licence - perhaps linked to compulsory parenting classes - for those wishing to become parents?

The standard of parenting that I frequently see is so incredibly low. Perhaps it would encourage responsible procreation...

Clearly you have no idea whatsoever the pressure that is on teaching staff - do you not read the teachers posts on mumsnet??.
Any other bright ideas what teachers should do instead of actual teaching?

I agree. Some parents are absolutely terrified of dogs, so never teach, just scream, jump and panic, this transfers onto the kids and just excites the dog further. My story - I was dropping off my boy at school, waiting for the gates to open. A dog (Staffie) had escaped its owner and was running freely in the park adjacent, owner yelling at it to come back, dog running for freedom, two kids walking to school together alone (brother and sister about 10 & 7 I would say) were scared and started running, arms flaring, screaming. They split up and the dog obviously then took chase, it had 4 legs, boy had 2, dog jumping up at his arms etc, turning at every turn the boy did, no matter what he did, the dog was on his tail. I ran up to the boy who the dog was chasing and just told him to stand still, fold his arms, no eye contact and just to keep moving his body away from the dog. The dog wasn't aggressive, was only young, but just thought it was play time, but the boy was absolutely petrified. The dog just got bored and walked off. When I tell you how petrified the boy was, he was a POC, but he was as white as a sheet, sweaty, hypo-ventilating, not nice to witness or see. I calmed him down and then handed this poor kid to the teacher who opened the gate.

I called the office to ask if they could do a lesson, where a dog handler comes in for a talk, to explain what to do in situations as running really isn't the best one.

@Loopyloulou007

I agree. Some parents are absolutely terrified of dogs, so never teach, just scream, jump and panic, this transfers onto the kids and just excites the dog further. My story - I was dropping off my boy at school, waiting for the gates to open. A dog (Staffie) had escaped its owner and was running freely in the park adjacent, owner yelling at it to come back, dog running for freedom, two kids walking to school together alone (brother and sister about 10 & 7 I would say) were scared and started running, arms flaring, screaming. They split up and the dog obviously then took chase, it had 4 legs, boy had 2, dog jumping up at his arms etc, turning at every turn the boy did, no matter what he did, the dog was on his tail. I ran up to the boy who the dog was chasing and just told him to stand still, fold his arms, no eye contact and just to keep moving his body away from the dog. The dog wasn't aggressive, was only young, but just thought it was play time, but the boy was absolutely petrified. The dog just got bored and walked off. When I tell you how petrified the boy was, he was a POC, but he was as white as a sheet, sweaty, hypo-ventilating, not nice to witness or see. I calmed him down and then handed this poor kid to the teacher who opened the gate.

I called the office to ask if they could do a lesson, where a dog handler comes in for a talk, to explain what to do in situations as running really isn't the best one.

It's all well and good telling kids (or adults for that matter) in a safe environment what to do when the object of your fear approaches. However in the real situation fear takes over.

My son had a phobia of dogs. I could explain until I was blue in the face to not run, but in the park when over enthusiastic dogs would bound towards him, flight or fight took over and he would run.

In the scenario you have painted where was the dog owner? It was their fault that the poor lad was terrified. They were pretty lucky that they were not reported for their dog being out of control.

@tigger1001 some people are so daft. Either you are terrified of dogs or you're not. It's not something you get over just because a dog is coming at you. I am such a parent, I am absolutely terrified. I've never taught my dc to be terrified but obviously they see it. I know not to run with arms flailing away from a scary dog but it's a joke that anyone would be put in that position in the U.K. and the owner doesn't face consequences tbh how will that kind of thing ever stop otherwise,

@Loopyloulou007 as you describe the boy as POC his parents may have a background where they have stray dogs in their country, it's natural to be terrified, dogs in some countries will literally rip you apart. I went to a third world country when I was younger and was walking up a hill and two massive dogs came bolting down snarling and bearing their teeth, I was so so terrified my body took over and ran eventually hiding in a bush, my knees literally didn't stop shaking until the next day! A lot of people can't seem to think the way they think should apply to everyone when there are simple things like putting a dog on a lead when there are scared people that resolves this for everyone.

@Whywonttheyhelpme

How about dog owners should have to have a license & prove that they are responsible enough to deal with managing their own dog.

This is coming from a dog owner, who can see the signs in their own dog and would step in before allowing him to be provoked to such an extent that he would hurt a child. I also would never leave him alone with ANY small children or even older children that I do not 100% trust.

Bad owners are the problem here.

Totally agree, as a dog owner I'm on the recieving end of bad ownership from others allowing their out of control dog (s) to approach and interact.

That's still not going to stop parents not supervising their child and either unwittingly or deliberately allowing and advocating their child to approach and interact with dogs even when the owner keeps them on a lead, under control and asks that the child doesn't. That's where the parental responsibility comes into it - teaching children to respect others boundaries, it's a two way street.

I haven't RTFT but I don't think it's the responsibility of schools because there isn't the time in the day. Parents, however, should teach their children in the same way they teach them to be wary of traffic and cross the road. Traffic is dangerous but we don't teach children to be terrified of it, we teach them to be careful. Unfortunately, many parents don't know how to behave around dogs themselves

Hmm. It would be great if schools could teach children everything, but you have to draw the line somewhere... The way I see it, as a parent I'd struggle to teach maths and science, for example, but I'm more than capable of teaching animal care, DIY, cooking... same with most of the general population. I'd rather schools concentrated on the stuff I can't teach!

[quote chillicrackers]@tigger1001 some people are so daft. Either you are terrified of dogs or you're not. It's not something you get over just because a dog is coming at you. I am such a parent, I am absolutely terrified. I've never taught my dc to be terrified but obviously they see it. I know not to run with arms flailing away from a scary dog but it's a joke that anyone would be put in that position in the U.K. and the owner doesn't face consequences tbh how will that kind of thing ever stop otherwise,

@Loopyloulou007 as you describe the boy as POC his parents may have a background where they have stray dogs in their country, it's natural to be terrified, dogs in some countries will literally rip you apart. I went to a third world country when I was younger and was walking up a hill and two massive dogs came bolting down snarling and bearing their teeth, I was so so terrified my body took over and ran eventually hiding in a bush, my knees literally didn't stop shaking until the next day! A lot of people can't seem to think the way they think should apply to everyone when there are simple things like putting a dog on a lead when there are scared people that resolves this for everyone. [/quote]
Exactly. People who think all they have to do is tell the terrified person to stand still when being faced with the thing they are terrified, have never been phobic about something.

I am arachnophobic. Now I know spiders in this country will not hurt me, and they will be more scared of me etc, however faced with a spider that knowledge deserts me.

My eldest is scared of dogs. I am not. He developed his fear as a direct result of some muppet owner not controlling their dog and allowing it to jump up onto his buggy and stick his nose in. Can you imagine being strapped into a chair unable to get away while a massive (he was a big dog but even more so to an 18 month old) sticks his nose in your face? The dog was friendly but that was not the point.

As a younger child I could (and did) explain he shouldn't run, however that logic left him when dog ran up to him.

I blamed the owners who inevitably shout "oh he's friendly he just wants to play" while not bothering to call their dog off.

We were in the woods walking one day when same thing happens. Stupid woman did nothing about her dog then lectured me to say I shouldn't have my child in the woods if he's scared of dogs. No, love, he is allowed in the woods but none of us should have to put up with your out of control dog jumping on us and chasing us.

I genuinely don't think people understand that there is a difference between not liking something and being terrified of it. Rational thinking leaves us in the face of genuine fear. The flight or fight reflex is really there.

You can't seriously think it's ok to let a child run up to a dog?! Jeez. The sense of entitlement of you is astounding. The world does not revolve around you and your precious children. You teach your child not to run up to my dog and I'll teach my dog to not run up to your children. Then we are all happy.

No, @Totallysuper is right. Entitlement is owning an animal capable of biting, but objecting to putting it on a lead, or expecting schools to manage the issue for you. Jeez indeed.

How to care for animals would be a better thing to do. And how to respond when their behaviour is wrong.

I have always taught my children how to behave around dogs. Unfortunately to many owners don't train their dogs. When my youngest was in the park age around 5 a dog chased him on his bike, this should never happen and made him fear dogs. If you carnt keep them under control esp in a park with young kids then you shouldn't own a dog.

You will have teachers wet nursing on their ‘breaks’ soon.

No. My 9yr old absolutely hates dogs and would be terrified if there was one in his school, I'm sure he's far from the only child who is afraid of dogs. He has NEVER approached any dog but has been pestered/jumped up on by strange dogs more times than I can count, hence his fear of them.

I actually think that the majority of dog owners should not have their dogs and that the laws around who can own or breed dogs for profit should be MUCH stricter.

I live in a tiny little village and the amount of people here who just should not have a dog is mad, we've had rottweilers roaming the streets without an owner, we've had people walking past with their dogs straining at the lead and barking trying to get at our cat just sitting outside our house minding his own business and others off the lead have chased him. There are regularly piles of shit on the 2 minute walk from our house to the school. We have parents at the school who keep bringing their mutts to the school gates despite requests from the school to keep dogs away from the school. We frequently see dog owners allowing their dogs into childrens play areas despite clear signage that dogs are not allowed. Several neighbours bought designer dogs over lockdown, one has already been rehomed as the owner couldn't cope and one has clearly not been trained at all as it just sits barking in its garden all day long and its owner just continues to shout ineffectively at it. My own mother has dogs that aren't properly looked after, one is very elderly, skin and bones and almost blind and deaf but she's stopped taking him to the vets for all his problems now as its "costing her too much" and they never bothered to get insurance, he is clearly suffering but they are now dragging their heels about getting the poor thing PTS. We also see frequent posts on social media about dog attacks on sheep.

Children don't need to learn about dog behaviour, the law needs to make it much harder for any old Tom, Dick or Harry to get their hands on a dog.

Not everything can or should be part of the national curriculum fgs. If a child approaches your dog you should make sure it is on a lead and say no please leave him alone. Parents also have a responsibility. I think most dog bites occur within the family with their own dogs. It is down to parents to supervise and protect their children.

Touched a nerve?! I didn't once say I objected to putting dog on a lead or say I expected schools to manage the issue ! I said I don't expect a child to run up to my dog.

The amount of idiot parents who encourage their darling children to stroke my dog is ridiculous. Luckily she's very friendly but they don't know that. Had one pull her tail last week. She didn't react at all, but if she had I would have blamed the parent of the child who was a total moron.

I totally agree. A situation, all parents waiting outside school, to open. Bloke came out of his flat with a young staffie off lead. Two kids walking to school by themselves, jumping, playing, running etc on the grass, this dog jumped up (only playing) but kids weren't to know, so kids got scared started running, dog then runs after one, jumping up etc, having a whale of a time, thinking it was playtime. The kid was absolutely petrified and was literally running for his life. I shouted to the boy to stop running, while running to him. Got him and just hugged him, crossed his arms into his body so nothing was flaughing about and told him to just look at me and not the dog. Dog still jumping up etc. Realising there was no more fun to be had as we were no longer engaging, just walked off. Not one other person said anything to the owner, I was too busy consoling the kid. But when I tell you, this kid was white with fear, hyperventilating, cold sweat scared for his life.

I went into the school and asked if they could do an assembly or something, I even got contact numbers for people that come in your school to do a talk and they wasn't interested,not on the curriculum.

Some cultures I have found, are petrified of dogs, so the fear is then taught to the next generation.

Running from a thing, waving Ur arms and jumping about, that has four legs and teeth, is never going to be a win in your favour, so I do believe knowledge is key.

@Loopylouloulala I think you forgot that you posted that story already...

I agree with all of this, could have pretty much written this myself apart from the personal bit. Sorry about your son pickly.

I think teachers have enough to do and the necessary training should be undertaken by parents and dog owners.

Dog owners need to control their animals. That is it. If a child approaches a volatile animal then the dog owner should prevent that by issuing a warning. It’s not everyone else’s responsibility to mitigate the harm that YOUR dog does.