Is it weird that I don’t believe in love?

[IStoppedBelieving]

Particularly in so called ”romantic love”?

I wanted write more about this, but didn’t even know what to write.
But I guess it bothers me since I’m here, asking strangers what they think….

YABU love is a real thing
YANBU don’t believe much either

I struggle with love but I'm pretty sure I'm autistic.
To me it's just something you say to someone else after they've said it to you for a while and it starts to get awkward, two choices, either run away or agree and say it back.
I got married because I wanted a child but it was horrible giving up my freedom and I'm not sure I did the right thing. Regret it most days.

@TMChappyascanbe

I do know people who really love each other years into their marriage, but it's a different sort of love, not the overwhelming feeling you experience in the first weeks and months. Having said that, I know that this is exceptional rather than the rule in my age group (fifties) Most friends and family in long term partnerships and marriages would be happier apart but stay together for a range of financial and other reasons.

I agree with this. ^ Although there IS such a thing as genuine romantic love, I really believe it's the exception rather than the rule.

As you say, many many people stay together as it's more convenient for them than leaving. They have a certain lifestyle, and a good quality of life, and are financially comfortable. And they'd rather stay in a dull mundane marriage to someone they don't deeply love, than leave them, and have a life of penury.

As I said, it's a tough life single (for many - especially women,) and staying in their marriage is the preferred option, (to being alone and poor, and living in a shitty damp-ridden bedsit.)

Most women have to wait until they're widowed to have a peaceful, moan-free existence, where they are not poor. Because 'widows' are ultimately better off financially than women who just leave their husbands. Coz even when divorced, many women - especially the working classes, don't end up with much, because their working class husbands don't have any more stuff or assets or 'wealth' than them!

And who wants another man anyway after 30-40 or so years of tolerating a man who didn't pull his weight with the housework and childcare for 90% of the first 20-25 years of your marriage, fucked off out to the pub, or to do his man hobbies or his big important job. And then and spent the last 12-15 years moaning about everything from the government, immigrants, and the neighbours, to his declining health, and multiple ailments.

As I say, women are only OK financially (without a man) when they are widowed. And also, as I said, the vast majority of them will NOT want another man. Not after 30-40 years of being stuck with one they didn't really truly love, and who irked them half the time. I can't think of a single widow (over 55-60,) who has hooked up with another man again. They all stay 'single.'

If they have spent 35-40 years in a marriage to a man they never really loved, (and would have left if they had been financially well-off,) the last thing they're gonna do once they're in a better financial position, is get stuck with another man! And especially not one over 60. (Which is all they are likely to get!) Fuck that!

I'm not saying widows over 60 don't ever remarry, but in 'my world' (the world of the ordinary working classes,) women (55-60+) whose husbands die, never remarry, and almost never engage in a relationship with a man again.

Footnote. As I said in an earlier post, this is fairly anecdotal, and is based on people in my world. ie, the working classes.......^

I know what you mean OP.

I think the problem is that our society fetishises "romantic love" which is actually code for lust / limerance with a bit of status chucked in.

Actual love: long-standing affection for people -- either in a sexual or non-sexual context - which is underpinned by respect and trust, is real. But the problem is that what passes for "love", the Hallmark card brand of love, bears absolutely no resemblance whatsoever to this and a lot of people never learn to tell the difference. An awful lot of people, particularly women, spend their lives searching for the second kind and structure their entire lives around the search for this, when what they should actually be looking for is the first.

The Disneyfication of our lives has a lot to answer for. I wouldn't want to go back to a time where people married purely for money and security but I do think it would be healthy to introduce a dose of pragmatism to the way we think about "love" and educate ourselves to be able to tell the difference.

I’m with you OP. I’m 47 and have 2 failed marriages behind me. I thought I was head over heels in love with them and they me.

Besides my children, I have two people I totally completely love. I want the best for them, I would walk over hot coals for them and I like the person I am around them. But this love has taken decades to blossom. No one will ever take their place in my life and one happens to be a single man which complicates things!

If I were to ever look for another partner I would look for someone I enjoy spending time with who respects me and treats me with kindness.
Thunderbolts and lightning is all bs I think now that I’m older and (like to think) wiser. I’ve had that and it has not served me well.

My parents were married for 50 years. Everyone thought they adored each other and were madly in love. Really they were just so codependent with each other they couldn’t function without the other.

And then and spent the last 12-15 years moaning about everything from the government, immigrants, and the neighbours, to his declining health, and multiple ailments.

So, you have met my dad, I see.

@FMSucks

I’m with you OP. I’m 47 and have 2 failed marriages behind me. I thought I was head over heels in love with them and they me.

Besides my children, I have two people I totally completely love. I want the best for them, I would walk over hot coals for them and I like the person I am around them. But this love has taken decades to blossom. No one will ever take their place in my life and one happens to be a single man which complicates things!

If I were to ever look for another partner I would look for someone I enjoy spending time with who respects me and treats me with kindness.
Thunderbolts and lightning is all bs I think now that I’m older and (like to think) wiser. I’ve had that and it has not served me well.

My parents were married for 50 years. Everyone thought they adored each other and were madly in love. Really they were just so codependent with each other they couldn’t function without the other.

Your point about your parents is an interesting one. So many people think a long marriage is something to aspire to.

In fact many long marriages look dreadful to me. Decades of codependency and limiting one another’s horizons, endless bickering and resentment and constant compromise.

I’m sure in some cases people can remain happily committed for decades but in the majority of cases I just see needy people who have lost the ability to function autonomously.

”My parents were married for 50 years. Everyone thought they adored each other and were madly in love. Really they were just so codependent with each other they couldn’t function without the other.”

”Your point about your parents is an interesting one. So many people think a long marriage is something to aspire to.”

These two comments are spot on!
My parents have been married for 40 and I think they are just afraid to break-up and too lazy to do divorce.
They NEVER spend any time together, won’t even talk to eachother.
Years, decades lived like that!

I think that the initial rush of what we call romantic love is just a combination of hormones, sexual attraction and an appealing personality/enjoying the person's company a lot. If it continues, it's strengthened by respect, affection and shared experiences. That's not to say any of that isn't wonderful, but I think the idealised, magical image of romantic love that many people grow ip believing in is sometimes pretty unhealthy and ends up being used to justify bad choices and making people (particularly women) unhappy.

@lazylinguist

Spot on.

The question is how do we educate people primarily women as women have the to lose from walking into the wrong relationships to avoid confusing the miasma of "romance" with proper love.

Parents and society don't always arm young women with the right tools for this. The emphasis that's placed on finding "romance" is often really unhealthy.

I'm really unsure whether to believe or disbelieve the existence of love. It's such an abstract concept. Furthermore, it's something I have never experienced, or if I have, just wasn't aware. A tad clueless, really 🤔.

The question is how do we educate people -- primarily women as women have the to lose from walking into the wrong relationships

I don't know. There are things which some women take as signs of true romantic love which I would take as massive red flags. I seem to have raised an acerbic cynic of a daughter, so I'm not too worried about her falling for the hype!

I used to love my DH, but it wore off.

42 years old.
There's only one person I've ever loved, my daughter.

I never felt a connection to my parents, mum left when I was young, dad was too old for any common ground.
My brothers had different dad's, so they never felt like proper brothers.
People I got into relationships with was more about time and place.. a drunken fumble with a person I just met turns into a relationship based on shagging, that turns into loving together etc. They pissed off, I wasn't bothered.

But my daughter?.. she is the exception.

You're not alone OP.

littledandelionclock

And then they spend the last 12-15 years moaning about everything from the government, immigrants, and the neighbours, to his declining health, and multiple ailments.

@IStoppedBelieving

So, you have met my dad, I see.

LOL!

I think this is a description of most working class, 50-75 year old men!

”My parents were married for 50 years. Everyone thought they adored each other and were madly in love. Really they were just so co-dependent with each other they couldn’t function without the other.”

I think a lot of people who have been married many years fit this description.. I think quite a number of people who have been married 30 years, (or more) would say the same. That they would struggle alone now.

My parents have been married for 40 and I think they are just afraid to break-up and too lazy to do divorce. They NEVER spend any time together, won’t even talk to each other. Years, decades lived like that!

I couldn't stay if it was this bad.

My great aunt and uncle were like this. Together 45 years - married 43 years (right up until his death,) and they were like strangers. They had nothing in common, and barely spoke. He would make her pay for her own drinks in the pub, he made her pay for her own food and clothes and toiletries etc, and he used to light up a ciggie and never offered her one. Also, he would go off on daytrips and weekends with mates and never even let her know, let alone ask her to go.

She got a job when their 3 kids were 12, 11, and 9, as he only gave her enough money to buy food, and very little else. So she worked to get money for herself.

They only spoke when they had to.

Shockingly I think there are/have been more marriages like this than people realise.

Awful.

Occasionally, my DH annoys me, but 90% of the time he's fine - we are fine. We have some fun together, look after each other, support and defend each other, and help each other when we need it, and always consider each other when doing anything, and we pool finances. So neither of us has more than the other.

It was harder for the first 10 years, when DH was more selfish with money, and rarely helped with housework and looking after DD. And we argued quite a bit. But then he grew up a bit and became more mellow, and he did more around the house and with DD. And tbh even though he still irks me a bit occasionally, if I had the choice to be without him, I would refuse. I do actually love him, and he does me.

And I shudder at the thought of being in a marriage like my great aunt and uncle's. As I said though, quite a number of couples are like this.

Weird how? Unusual, maybe.

How do you feel about people close to you? Your family and friends? Do you have children?

@IStoppedBelieving

By love I don’t mean lust or spending time in the bedroom.

I don’t make that connection at all.

I mean that deep care for other person they both have genuinely chosen to have eachothers lives.
And building a life together.
That sees beyond looks or sex or jobs and doesn’t worry about social pressures.
Or secretly (or not so secretly) keep checking what else is out there.
Commitment and contentment.

But that kind of love exists? Lots of people I know love one another like that.

DH and I have loved each other through unemployment, mental breakdowns and all sorts. Genuine 'for richer for poorer, in sickness and in health' stuff. We've both looked better than we do now and still adore one another regardless. 7 years in and we're still interested in each other as people, and actively choose one another and our relationship, rather than just being here because we can't be arsed to do anything else - we are committed, and content (and sex is still very important to us both - you can have committed, content love and still have great sex. In fact, I'd say the great sex is because of it, and times when our sex life has been less good, we've approached it as a problem to solve, because it's part of our relationship).

But also, you seem to think that caring about sex, or employment etc, are frivolous, unimportant parts of a relationship. That this mythical type of Love overcomes all those things. To me, you're contradicting yourself here - either you fall in love regardless, in which case those things don't matter, or you deliberately choose to love each other and commit, in which case the choice includes things like compatibility in life goals (which could include your employment) or sexual compatibility.

FWIW, I agree with the latter - falling in love with someone at the start, the lust and chemistry stage, stuff like jobs etc doesn't always seem relevant. But when you realise you're working towards actively choosing a life with someone, putting together the building blocks of that life together, then you'd be a fool not to consider how compatible you were on things that were important to you. And I'd never marry someone who was e.g. in the Army, because that doesn't suit what I want from my life or my values, nor would I marry someone who didn't want sex, because it doesn't line up with what I want in life. So those things are chosen as part of choosing be in each other's lives, and that in itself is romantic - it says, "I see you and who you are, and I want that in my life.".

I believe in it and have experienced it.
Just because it hasn't happened to you doesn't mean it doesn't exist but I understand because until you do feel it it's just an alien thing I suppose.

I went on vacation to the very lovely Mediterranean island that my father is from to visit family. Both my DH and I were students back then so we could only afford for me to go. Even though I consider that island to be one of the most beautiful places on earth, it just wasn't as beautiful as it is when I visit it together with my DH. Nothing is as beautiful if he is not there with me.

@HarlanPepper

Weird how? Unusual, maybe.

How do you feel about people close to you? Your family and friends? Do you have children?

My parents and I are quite distant, always been. I have had/have friends and relatives that I care about. I’m not saying I’m unable to care about people/things/animals…

Just that I feel I have lost or never even had in the first place, much faith in ROMANTIC love.

@GoodnightGrandma

I used to love my DH, but it wore off.

How do you feel about him now?

I’ve just read the thread where op didn’t want sex anymore, and everyone told her to break-up and it’s just once again confereed my belief that love does not exist.