To ask how drivers of massive SUVs square it with themselves in terms of climate change?

[Bleepingtons]

Same goes for those who go long haul on the regular? Buy loads of cheap, disposable fashion? Etc etc? Do you just not worry about climate change?

I know I sound sanctimonious but I am genuinely baffled by people driving massive diesel SUVs like there isn't a major issue.

@EmmaGrundyForPM oh come on. A battered and muddy certain type of 4x4 is a status symbol in some circles.

I've just switched f3om a diesal medium sized SUV to a large hatchback that is petrol.

EV was out of the question because I cant afford it.

New car is not as fuel efficient and I'm doing all the same journeys but now am I allowed to look down on anyone driving a SUV?

@KayKayWat

But to be honest I would be glad if the human race died out. We have destroyed this planet and it won’t get any better if the population keeps growing.

I'm not particularly fussed at the prospect of the human race dying out, but neither do I understand this attitude of sacrificing ourselves for the planet. It's just one of many big rocks. There are 21,600,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 planets in the observable universe and many times that outside of it.

The environmental movement has a very anti-human element that sits very uncomfortably with me.

It’s like they think humanity is a black stain on the planet. How can we trust people like this to have our human interests at heart? That’s why they can block traffic and not care about the human suffering. Think of how little they will care if their energy policy kills people in a bad winter

@Spaceshiphaslanded

I’m one. This week with cop26 on, I curiously looked into co2 of eating meat and cheese etc as I’m veggie 100% and do a few days a week vegan. Media had me convinced this was the best way to reduce my footprint. Then I compared this to my diesel SUV. My god.....cheese is a drop in ocean vs the school run!!!

So OP - I think it’s ignorance rather than selfishness. We need more media focus on what actually will make a difference. Time for my house to get on their bikes.

I just wanted to say well done on educating yourself! We often think we're doing our bit by recycling or washing our clothes at 30 instead of 40 degrees without really understanding the impact of different actions. I think it's great that you took the time to look into this and I sincerely hope that you enjoy your future bike journeys .

@sammylady37

Do you have children, OP?

Oh, right, so that's the excuse. Obviously we can't tow Jocasta's pony with a normal car.

How did we ever cope without SUVs in the 70s and 80s?

How did we ever cope without SUVs in the 70s and 80s?

If we needed to tow, we used Land and Range Rovers.

"The environmental movement has a very anti-human element that sits very uncomfortably with me.

It’s like they think humanity is a black stain on the planet. How can we trust people like this to have our human interests at heart? That’s why they can block traffic and not care about the human suffering. Think of how little they will care if their energy policy kills people in a bad winter"

Yes I have an issue with this too. It is a dehumanising view of mankind, a wholly negative and sinister one and one doesn't have to move very far in that ideology to see where it can end up.

Yes you are being sanctimonious.

I have a 4 x 4 pickup and use it to take bales of hay and animal bedding for my animals because I live on a small holding. A two wheel drive would get stuck and would not carry ten bales of hay. People forget that these are commercial vehicles and in a lot of cases this is what they are being used for. Contractors also need them to get themselves and their tools onsite or for heavy towing.

I also need it for many practical tasks which are part of rural life. For example to take my bin to the nearest collection point means carrying on the truck up to the nearest road which is half a mile away

My vehicle does about 2000 miles per year so emissions would be way below those for an average driver driving an average sized saloon for the average annual mileage of 15,000 miles. All other driving is done in a 1000 cc car which does about 3000 miles a year.

I have seen lots of smug posts like this one on here and they really give me the rage.

Surely this is all about humans!

The richest 1% of the planet (eg us lot) are making life extremely difficult for everyone else. The average person in Bangladesh is vegetarian, doesn’t own a car and doesn’t fly. Yet global warming is causing flooding and drought.

Surely we should be trying to help other humans?

@Gallowayan come on. They used to be commercial vehicles, now they are mainly used by people driving their kids to school.
Its like harbours used to be worn by working farmers and mainly bought through farming accounts. Then they became a status symbol and every middle-class parent started wearing them.

Anyway the better off you are, generally the higher your carbon footprint. It would mean well off people basically living like poor people.

@julieca

Anyway the better off you are, generally the higher your carbon footprint. It would mean well off people basically living like poor people.

This.

Well a lot of these people also have 3 kids so they’ve already majorly fucked over the environment so what’s an SUV in the grand scheme of things? They’ll probably plant a couple of trees and recycle their copy of The Guardian and think the jobs a goodun.

Potentially they think “This Seasons must haves” are actually necessary to (social) survival and “clothes you need this winter” are actually necessary to stop them dying (a social) death at the prep school gates -assuming they get out their SUV.

[quote julieca]@EmmaGrundyForPM oh come on. A battered and muddy certain type of 4x4 is a status symbol in some circles.[/quote]
Really? Mines a Rav 4, is that a status symbol?

@Newgirls

Surely this is all about humans!

The richest 1% of the planet (eg us lot) are making life extremely difficult for everyone else. The average person in Bangladesh is vegetarian, doesn’t own a car and doesn’t fly. Yet global warming is causing flooding and drought.

Surely we should be trying to help other humans?

Lack of resources makes their life difficult, if they were richer with better access to global markets they would not be dying in large numbers when cyclones hit.

As I said, tens of thousands used to die in floods in China just decades ago. With better infrastructure and housing standards, it is now in the hundreds usually.

This is incredible progress

I don't think people really care.
They might do a few token things to say they've done something but that's all.

@Porfre

I've just switched f3om a diesal medium sized SUV to a large hatchback that is petrol.

EV was out of the question because I cant afford it.

New car is not as fuel efficient and I'm doing all the same journeys but now am I allowed to look down on anyone driving a SUV?

Yes because you won't take up as much room on the road or in car parks.

And petrol is better than diesel. I think. It seems to keep changing depending on what day of the week it is.

And you are no longer driving a "big bully car".

It’s like they think humanity is a black stain on the planet humanity IS a big black stain on the planet, although we do do good for the environment too. But it doesn't undo the damage we've done by a very long way.

Yes because you won't take up as much room on the road or in car parks.

Interesting, my medium/crossover SUV is the same width as an estate and was 22cm shorter - it was one of the major factors in us choosing it as we have on street parking, wanted the boot space but wanted to minimise our parking hassles.

And petrol is better than diesel. I think. It seems to keep changing depending on what day of the week it is.

Petrol = lower particulates, higher emissions.
Diesel = lower emissions, higher particulates.

"It’s like they think humanity is a black stain on the planet humanity IS a big black stain on the planet, although we do do good for the environment too. But it doesn't undo the damage we've done by a very long way."

Nice way to see other human beings 🤔 do you include your family and friends friends in that "black stain" category?

People with SUVs tend to have a lot of kids.

Having lots of kids isn't exactly good for the environment either.

It’s like they think humanity is a black stain on the planet humanity IS a big black stain on the planet, although we do do good for the environment too. But it doesn't undo the damage we've done by a very long way

👆

This is who they are. This is an ideology which is anti-human at core and won’t care if you freeze in the winter as long as your footprint on the earth is somewhat lighter…

Don’t let them gain political power

Quite easily. My 10yo RR doubles up as my horse box (well, with trailer behind her she does!), means I do a trip to the horse feed store once every 3 months instead of fortnightly like my estate car did. It means that when the snow comes in first on the volunteer rota not only to go in to work (health service) but to transport colleagues. It means we don't fly - UK caravan staycation. I use it for field maintenance wherever I can instead of needing the bloody big tractor that takes out half of the hedgerow the wildlife have cultivated for a home. I try to do the bits I can - turning off plug sockets, go paperless where possible, recycle, food from local farm shops, glass milk bottles instead of plastic etc... I won't be going vegetarian - if you can show me the peer reviewed evidence that my pork sausage from the pig raised on the same farm as my horses, slaughtered and butchered within ten miles of us and returned is more harmful to the environment than the avocado toast I will be happy to have a conversation. Same goes for the raw milk the cows on the neighbouring farm produce, or the cream and butter it's made into being more damaging than the who knows how many almonds (and dead rainforest to produce them).
At the end of the day if we all do little bits then we can possibly make a tiny bit of difference but when all is said and done the planet changes. I doubt the dinosaurs had mass protests prior to their extinction, nor the woolly mammoths holdings a summit. We're not meant to inhabit the earth forever. There's also a perverse irony in those of us who have the money and technology to engage in all this handwringing doing so while the major companies, corporations and leaders continue unchecked.

@UsedUpUsername

It’s like they think humanity is a black stain on the planet humanity IS a big black stain on the planet, although we do do good for the environment too. But it doesn't undo the damage we've done by a very long way

👆

This is who they are. This is an ideology which is anti-human at core and won’t care if you freeze in the winter as long as your footprint on the earth is somewhat lighter…

Don’t let them gain political power

100% correct. And what other ideologies viewed certain sections of humanity in that way too??

I think a lot of it is fear of change, and an inability to change ingrained beliefs.

Just look at the recent ASHP threads on here. People would rather believe the posters rehashing newspaper articles or myths they'd heard, rather than the many posters who actually have ASHP in a range of homes, old and new, big and small, who where typing from the warmth of these homes and giving personal accounts of positive experiences.

I've come across similar on EV car threads where I have categorically been told that EVs are NOT suitable for people living rurally. I live 300m up a mountain in Snowdonia and we have had a Nissan leaf for over 3 years as our only car, and we do just fine.

When these people do finally change their ways, they'll deny ever thinking or saying the things they did.