AIBU To keep back half of my son's PIP payment?

[Whiskyinajar]

DS is 18 and autistic, he attends a college for people with learning disabilities and needs a lot of support both there and at home with anxiety, interpreting life and his emotions etc.

At 16 we had to apply for PIP which he was awarded but with me as the responsible person for using it in his best interests,

Now PIP has been really helpful for him, when he has need of counselling etc we can pay for it privately to help him. We put it towards seam free socks etc and the rest of it bar £150 goes in the pot towards household bills.

I'm interpreting the "in his best interests" part as keeping me at home so that if he has a crisis (not infrequently) I can get to him and help. The issues he has mean it isn't easy for me to take on work alth9ugh we have tried.

Initially I transferred a very small amount a month to him as pocket money etc . When he hit 18 he wanted to get a mobile phone which is okay as hisnold one was falling apart and very old. He didn't go for anything fancy and pays £15 a month .

Then he started asking about having more of his PIP money and I agreed to give him £150 a month but told him he needed to budget for his phone out of that. A phone is pretty necessary for him so I thought it would be an easy thing to budget for.

However he's not managing this and every month I end up putting the money over for his phone the day before it comes out. Because he's autistic I don't want him having phone issues so the bill has to be paid.

Financially it's a struggle every single month because we rely on a mix of UC and also what my husband earns form his job. This was severely affected in lockdown but is gradually recovering,

So to the current issue. DS is (I know) feeling resentful that I don't hand over all the PIP payment to him . We've spoken openly about it but he still wants more than the £150 I give him.

DS has no real interests apart from gaming as he finds socialising very difficult. A SW has said to me that it's okay for him to spend the PIP on gaming as that's how he socialises and I get this but it doesn't feel right

He's just been to me and asked again if he can have all his PIP.
It went into my account two days ago and I gave him the usual £150.

He asked about the rest and I pointed out I'd had to put petrol in the car, pay towards a trip for college and buy him some new clothes he needed. I have £45 left until Carers Allowance goes in (about 10 days time).

In the meantime that £45 will be petrol costs and anything he needs for college, husband will deal with food bills.

DS is so resentful though .

I've got the offer of a job at £10 hr from January...it's just 10 hrs a week but will make us better off and I can work from home . This means he could have all his PIP money then but I also know he won't manage it.

Don't know what to do tbh.

SW suggested I transfer all the PIP to him and let him cope with the mistakes he makes. I know absolutely he will blow it all within a few days on gaming and I'm not comfortable about that...even if it is his way of socialising.

Should I continue digging my heels in . I have already said that PIP is not really to be used for gaming.

Does he not get ESA? Or do you get UC for him?

I think this is fair.
I'm waiting on a PIP decision. My dad currently gets DLA. I'm her responsible person. If she awarded it I intend to give her a weekly allowance, save some for her in her account and about a bit for extra shopping, household as there are costs above the norm. She does just fine and doesn't want for much but she Is not good with finances.

I meant to quote a previous poster.....I failed 🙄

Bloody typos galore!!

"I think his SW has a point though to let him manage his money independently and cope with his mistakes, it will help him learn money management skills or if he finds that challenging, help him to realize that your assistance is vital."

^this

IveGotAsongThallGetOnYNerves A MAST worker said that when I was getting ds DLA money, I spoke to DWP who stated that using the money towards household bills was using it for his benefit because if he was sat in a home that had no heating, hot water or food would mean that he was being neglected & if using his money to pay towards these things meant he was being cared for then it was to his benefit ( some of his money was used to pay for Xbox Live membership, Google Play Music & other subscriptions for him) Also I used to pay for petrol for the car so I could do the school run & go shopping which were also for his benefit, unless you are blowing the money on drugs, booze & gambling then whatever you spend the money on is for your child's benefit.

It’s a difficult situation but isn’t some of the point that he learns to budget effectively, as all teenagers need to do irrespective of additional needs. It is his money and if you were saving it for him for the future I might be more pro that but as it sounds like you’re using the majority for the household that doesn’t really seem fair on him. Wouldn’t it be more fair to have an amount he pays you from it as rent/ bills etc, an amount that he must save for future and an amount for him to use as he wishes - you could discuss this with him so it feels fair for you both?

As you know PIP is provided for his care needs. Being divided into two sections: daily living and mobility allowance.

If he is living at home and you are paying those for him - car, petrol, lifts etc; food preparation, help with socialising etc - then a good % of the money should go to you to cover these.

It’s not spending money for him to do what he likes with.

There is a section on PIP called “Managing Money” and you may already have filled hat to say that you have to help him manage his money.

Wow you think any teenager with additional needs can learn to budget effectively. Well, no.

@Maxiedog123

As PIP is his income , then he should be paying some of it as Board for food and utilities, then the remainder to spend as he wishes.

That’s not what PIP is for, it’s for care needs and the extra costs incurred due to disability.

Board and utilities would be covered by UC or ESA, except that he’s studying and living with his parents.

That’s not to say that PIP couldn’t cover board and utilities in the circumstances.

Absolutely take this job in January and make a plan that from then on he can have his PIP less the agreed amounts for phone, clothes and board money which you will take off first.
You pay the phone, Clothes money goes into a savings account for him and the board money goes into the household account.
More than fair for all concerned.

He does need to learn to manage his money independently tbf. If he spends it all on gaming and doesn’t have enough for clothes, or when his phone is cut off etc that will teach him to budget. You just have to make clear that you won’t be covering those costs otherwise he won’t learn.

Maybe tell him now he’s 18 and you’re all struggling how much renting a bedsit would cost/how much food he eats. If he’s able to comprehend that. That he needs to pay you board etc as if he’s not working you can’t afford to pay for everything indefinitely

Yanbu.

We're in the same situation and i hold the lot in a seperate account but top up my sons as and when needed..... Otherwise he'd spend the lot buying food to binge on. Which isn't good. This way he gets to do what he wants but is also supported and has savings so if he fancies a weekend away with his dad on a whim (( trainspotting, no revelry here)) he has the money there to do it.

Are you aware your son is also entitled to universal credit?

He's 18. Does he pay you any rent? If not I would be asking for it out of his PIP. What does an 18 year old need A HUNDRED AND FIFTY pounds a month for when all their other bills are paid bar phone? He needs to spend that much on gaming?? Sounds like you have evidence that he's not quite ready to be managing his own money, which is a component of PIP assessment anyway.
You're doing the right thing. You're not being unreasonable.

@girlmom21

You're breaching the trust of the system by supposedly acting as his 'responsible adult' and withholding his money if he's capable of managing it himself, which he believes he is.

Get the money paid directly to him but tell him he needs to pay board money.

The carers money is for you.

It’s so complicated with autism he may think he can manage it but only OP knows the truth and is saying he can’t.

I have a similar issue , I will not hand it all over to my asd and adhd dc iam the representative and she cannot manage money at all. No concept whatsoever but would say all the right things of asked then once has it does the opposite as has no impulse control

So I said no. If she needs or wants anything with it she has to put her case to us and we will then purchase . It also goes towards non nhs therapy and other things. Each month we show her how every penny has been spent and she says ‘oh yes well I would have wasted it ‘ but the the next month is asking again 🤦‍♀️

@Sixtycats

He's 18. Does he pay you any rent? If not I would be asking for it out of his PIP. What does an 18 year old need A HUNDRED AND FIFTY pounds a month for when all their other bills are paid bar phone? He needs to spend that much on gaming?? Sounds like you have evidence that he's not quite ready to be managing his own money, which is a component of PIP assessment anyway. You're doing the right thing. You're not being unreasonable.

Pip isn’t for rent costs. ESA or UC are for general living expenses.

@Lorw

He does need to learn to manage his money independently tbf. If he spends it all on gaming and doesn’t have enough for clothes, or when his phone is cut off etc that will teach him to budget. You just have to make clear that you won’t be covering those costs otherwise he won’t learn.

That’s how it would work for a NT term but unfortunately not always for those with autism. It depends on the individual only OP knows of her dc is capable of learning how to budget its kit that easy to just learn from mistakes of you have no impulse control or an obsession that you could just spend all your money on

She isnt breaching the trust of the system as she isnt spending his money on herself..... The op absolutely should nlt be out of pocket. Her son still has to pay towards his food amd things like the petrol costs mentioned above.

When my dp takes ds on his trainspotting weekends we use his pip to pay for all of it including their meals. Simply because my dp isn't really interested in looking at trains. He's there to support ds who wouldn't be able to go without his dad.

Could you meet him halfway by helping him work out a budget from his PIP, including board/rent for you. Then you can transfer him all the money but help him set up an automatic and immediate bank transfer back to you for the board (and perhaps his phone too) so that you're not left out pocket for that.

Then if he blows his clothes/lunch/whatever else money on gaming, that will help him learn to manage the money without you being left painfully short.

It's a bit convoluted (you would transfer the money on 1st of the month, then his automatic payment would transfer some back to you on 2nd, for example) but it would mean he 'sees' all his money and can start to understand what it needs to pay for.

The PIP is his money. He is an adult. Unless you have a POA for him turn you have to give it to him. You can’t keep/take money from an adult without their content unless provided for specifically for legally.

It’s so complicated with autism he may think he can manage it but only OP knows the truth and is saying he can’t

But as an adult he is entitled to spend it unwisely. Unless of course he lacks mental capacity to manage his own finances and OP holds deputyship for his finances (POA shouldn't apply in these circumstances)?

@Poppadoms but it's called a personal independence payment.

I have a sibling with autism and the parent she lives with withholds her money too, claiming she'd be unable to manage it, whilst herself complaining she has no money and ordering takeaways 4 times a week so maybe I'm a bit cynical

@LadyMacbethWasMisunderstood

The PIP is his money. He is an adult. Unless you have a POA for him turn you have to give it to him. You can’t keep/take money from an adult without their content unless provided for specifically for legally.

It's not POA but you can get someone's PIP paid to as a responsible adult if they're not capable of managing their own money.

The idea isn't to keep it to yourself. It's to help them manage it appropriately.

He's a student, so how is he meant to get ESA or UC? I'm genuinely asking as I was under the impression students couldn't claim.