To think a large dog breed meet up isn't the place for small children?

[Stitchybitch79]

(My second dog related post in two days!)

My dog is a well known and popular larger breed.

I booked dog into a meet up for this breed a few days ago. One of those enclosed field affairs, where they let them run, play etc.

My dog is a bit scared of children. She's never hurt one and gets on fine with children known to me, but I'd never leave her alone with them (obviously), and I don't let children she doesn't know stroke her as she is nervous around them and I'd rather be safe than sorry, if one hurt or scared her even by accident and she instinctively snapped or even growled, I'd feel terrible!

Anyway I got to this meet and several small children were there. It was at night, so dark (lit with some purposeful lamps) and I didn't dare let my dog off. Children were running about amidst the dogs, or on the sidelines, away from the adults, andI just didn't feel confident.

I left after a few minutes. :(

I felt that;

1)Fights happen at these events, It's inevitable with dogs that don't know one another well. I've see one or two at every breed meet up I've been to. Rarely serious and owners tend to just split them up and all is fine within a few minutes but, if a child gets caught in the crossfire or approaches an agitated dog even once they've separated, potential for a bad incident.

2. This is a LARGE breed. They can knock a grown man over, a small child who gets in the way of them playing has no chance!

3)Taking small children to an event with loads of dogs whose temperaments you really have no way of knowing about? Just irresponsible IMO.

I was actually quite upset to have to come away, I've not been to one for ages and was looking forward to it. It's a great way to socialise dogs and it is a breed renowned for poor recall (although mine has good recall, a lot of this breed owners dont ever let them off lead because of this, apart from at events like this one).

AIBU? Am I just bitter as I couldn't stay? I love dogs and It's generally a lot of fun watching them play happily together with their own sorts.

Aww love her, what a fur ball! She’s massive!

My sister had large dogs - she was at a highland show and the dogs were lying on the grass having a snooze behind her. She turned around to see a small girl lying over the top of them, giving them a cuddle, while the parents gazed on, smiling.

My sister had the shock of her life. Her dogs were farm animals and trained within an inch of their lives and she was really uneasy that a larwnr would allow their child to not only approach a strange large dog but to lie on top of them. Any dog can be unpredictable - but parents don’t always have the sense to teach their children this!

@Suzi888

Aww love her, what a fur ball! She’s massive!

Thank you. Yes she IS massive :)

And she's extremely friendly with most people, I think she's just quite sensitive and children's movements and noises are a bit much for her.

I don't think she'd hurt one but I don't know 100% that any dog wouldn't hurt someone if they were scared so I try to be careful.

Also even when she plays she's easy capable of knocking someone down or catching someone with her teeth so I'd rather be safe than sorry.

If any one of you walked in here now she'd bark, then make friends then want to snuggle up with you. I feel I've made her out to be a demon when she is far from it really :)

@KittenKong

My sister had large dogs - she was at a highland show and the dogs were lying on the grass having a snooze behind her. She turned around to see a small girl lying over the top of them, giving them a cuddle, while the parents gazed on, smiling.

My sister had the shock of her life. Her dogs were farm animals and trained within an inch of their lives and she was really uneasy that a larwnr would allow their child to not only approach a strange large dog but to lie on top of them. Any dog can be unpredictable - but parents don’t always have the sense to teach their children this!

That would terrify me and yes very irresponsible in my opinion! Thank god they were calm dogs but,if the dog had been startled and snapped that would be totally the parent's fault, but the dogs (and owners) would get the blame. Just bloody stupid of them.

Luckily her dogs never bit anyone (they were incredibly obedient and very good natured) however being bitches they would sometimes nip each other.

@Oswina

massive brown eyes that see straight into your soul and you there’s.

That is a beautiful thing about them. Our dog seems to mostly have no concept he's so big he is liable to sit on you like a lap-dog and look affronted if you complain! One of the first things he does in the morning after his walk (DP often up and back from walk while I'm still in bed) is run upstairs and lay on top of me like I'm a cushion and stare at me and tell me I now have to get up basically. He's so heavy but so cuddly and earnest that you always feel bad if you make him get off. He gives the best cuddles.

You’ve just given me lovely flash backs of growing up with a large breed. She used to sneak into my bed at night for cuddles like that. Occasionally she would end up kicking me out and I would be on the floor whilst she had my bed.

And your right the bigger the dog the less self aware they seem to be, so full of love they have to share... right in that second, the cuddles cannot wait.

It's a tough one. If the other parents at the meet know their dogs are "normally" good at recall and not too excitable or snappy with children then I don't really see a problem. And don't these kids live with these dogs, so are aware of knocks and falls of being around those trype dogs.
But yes you are right of your dog is not under your control it should not be let off it's lead, around kids or anyone.

I take my 4 year old to a dog Park with our pup, there are some big old dogs there's, but he stays with me at all times and the other openers don't let any dogs off that aren't under their control, but I do leave with him if I see any boisterous behaviour.

Any dog can turn and it’s wise to be respectful of any animal, they aren’t toys and children can be annoying. I don’t think you’ve made her out to be a demon, you know her best and if she’s not comfortable around children that’s it. You seem very responsible that’s all. I hope you find someone else you can walk with who would prefer a child free meet. Good luck

There is a few breed meet ups round here for the breed I own. Golden retriever. I haven't been to one myself but I have seen photos and never seen a child there. Obviously Goldens are usually known for being good with children but they are still a large breed and dogs not robots after all.
My breeder had a few of her current and previous dogs round recently and 99% of these live with children and yet still there wasn't children there.
I have two dog confident young children and id not take them to this sort of thing its too risky. So no op yanbu.
I'd probably not take my dog either if I'm honest because although I have never seen or heard of fights at these meet ups my dog is soft as butter and playful but would quite easily be bullied/snapped at if dogs were that way out and I imagine it would be quiet stressful for her.

On walks she is let off and we get many boisterous dogs jumping at her, being too full on and although she never reacts apart from to submit I do because its not fair. I will firmly tell dogs and owners to stop. Most people don't understanding dog behavior (and I'm no expert) and see bad behavior as play. A dog should be able to ignore other dogs and play when both dogs are comfortable and familiar.

When I read this and you mentioned that most owners don't let them off I knew it would be a husky!

I have a husky and he's never off the lead because he'll be off and I won't be able to get him back. He learnt how to open the back gate the other day which was fun.

Anyway, YANBU. They are big dogs and if a scrap starts then those children could be seriously hurt especially if they try and intervene.

And yes these parents should be teaching their children to respect dogs and not approach unknown dogs. My toddler understands what is appropriate even with our dog who is her best friend. We got my girl when she was 1 so they never had that tiny puppy stage with her which I think helped as she was bigger than them straight away.

People who bring kids to dog meets/ dog parks are the worst. 0 responsibility.
I am a dog owner and have kids. But those 2 don't mix. A dog meet is for dogs. Not for some kids . Kids are the worst with kids. My dog is the friendliest in the world. Yet it drives me bonkers if kids just pet my dog without freaking asking first. And their parents are just standing there....

I really don't understand the dogs and kids don't mix idea. Most dogs are family pets. I'm old enough that during my childhood dogs simply roamed free and it was fine. The policing of every single thing is so tiresome and it doesn't lead to better behaved dogs or children. Dogs are not velociraptors waiting to devour children. Most dogs greet far better off lead with other dogs than when their body language is constrained by a lead. The world has gone mad but then Mumsnet has always had a bizarre view of dogs.

I love dogs - absolutely. But there are enough owners who just don’t train their dogs. So many dogs around now (lockdown pups) - the park is full of dogs running off with the owner not even able to recal them ‘daisy! Daisy! Da-seeeeeeee! Come back! Come! Here! Now! You naughty thing!’. Or dogs merrily trotting along - then a few minutes later a frantic owner running past ‘did you see a dog??’. Train your flipping dogs! If they don’t teach recall they won’t be training them so you can take a toy/not be aggressive with children (sudden noises or rough petting).

More rescue dogs around now - you don’t know their history, so won’t know their triggers. We got a soppy rescue a while back - yes soppy with the dog handler (police pound) but turned out he was just unmanageable (bit dad, mum, my brother) so the handler actually came back and took him to keep for himself as he just hated everyone else (had been a badly treated guard dog).

I encouraged DS to ‘say hello’ to dogs when he was little. Always ask the owner of you can pay the dog, etc. You would get some who would say ‘it doesn’t like children’ and that’s fair enough.

The idiot woman with the pit bull up the road has no control over it and I usually see her arguing with other dog owners in the park as her dog just launches itself at other dogs. My niece has 3 pitties and they are pretty soppy and good with the children - but she is aware that they are strong dogs with teeth and like humans, can be grumpy or in pain.

I love dogs - but I don’t like bad dog owners.

@CailleachO

I really don't understand the dogs and kids don't mix idea. Most dogs are family pets. I'm old enough that during my childhood dogs simply roamed free and it was fine. The policing of every single thing is so tiresome and it doesn't lead to better behaved dogs or children. Dogs are not velociraptors waiting to devour children. Most dogs greet far better off lead with other dogs than when their body language is constrained by a lead. The world has gone mad but then Mumsnet has always had a bizarre view of dogs.

Oh yep..

They did in my day too, and I know there would be a kid bitten in the face most years - those dogs were just put down, no one tried to 'save' them, or keep them in, or train them, that was it.. if they didn't put up with unlimited shit from children or avoid kids at all costs, they were gone.

Dogs are not velociraptors, and yes they generally would behave more naturally off lead than on, but theres absolutely nothing natural about taking a large group of dogs (and a breed known for being particularly hard to read and subtle about their body language) who do not know one another and putting them in a relatively small space and encouraging them to run about - thats a recipe for aggro, anxiety and spats, if not full on fights. Adding children to that mix is frankly, fucking stupid.

In the nicest way possible OP I think you need a behaviourist to help you. You've got a dog that is treating children like playmates and bowing/woofing. At the same time the only child interaction your dog is having is a child lying on the floor and the dog being allowed to climb up in his face in the sofa....none of this should be happening. It's going to make things worse not better. Dogs can't see children as playmates to roughhouse with.

I have two large breed dogs - guarding breeds. We have four kids they've grown up with children therefore it would never occur to me to not bring the kids to something like that but this has made me think
I guess I just wouldn't expect a reactive dog of any type to be off lead in public

thinkbiglittleone That might be different but I can't envisage it really. This meet up is specifically for breeds renowned for their non-recall. Whenever I've met other owners of similar breeds back when I used to let my dog off freely, they were very surprised that I would do so-it's perpetuated that you can't let them off no matter what, so it wasn't that sort of thing at all, generally, most dogs there wouldn't have been trained in recall at all, many would not be allowed off lead until they're at an event like it.

If your DC is with you at all times that's different too-these parents weren't paying attention at all whatsoever. When I arrived, the owners greeted me, their DC were scattered all about the field. There were 2 more small DC running about the field, and another one off somewhere down the bottom of it jumping in puddles. Or some variation of .

suzi888 thank you. I used to be a bit too nervous about her which my DP does 'tell me off' about as obviously dogs pick up on that.

I keep that under wraps now.

Arren I adore retreivers! I think, had my dog not 'chosen me' that might be a breed I'd look into adopting. I think they're so beautiful. That meet up sounds much more sensible.

I did a lot of training with my dog when she was a pup, and a lot of reading as I know hand-reared pups are tricky as adults if one isn't careful. Still managed to go wrong somewhere obviously, but I honestly don't know what if anything I could do, if I had chance to go back, to prevent it

whenIsnappedandFarted Aw that's a shame!I've heard so many are escape artists! Mine isn't at all, before this 'kid' issue I used to leave her in my garden which had an open drive at the time. Never went anywhere. To be fair she isn't a full husky, she's a mongrel of husky types. If I know no children are around I will let her off too, perfect recall unless she's found something especially gross to roll in or similar, which I think most dogs fail the recall assignment on to be honest.

Cailleach sorry please forgive me if I am misinterpreting but that's a bit of an odd response- why would you preface that with 'in the nicest possible way'? Is there a nasty way to suggest a behaviourist?

Also there isn't a photo of a dog being allowed to climb up in a child's face on the sofa, on my post?

I know I've missed some posts out, will reply to the rest very soon

@underneaththeash

I don't think you should even own a dog that isn't good with children. (and we have a dog). What would happen if you fell or you dropped the lead?

I got my dog at six weeks old, he’d had an awful start in life and grew up not being good with kids or strangers. What would you have suggested I do? Put him to sleep? Dumped him at the pound?

@Marvellousmadness

People who bring kids to dog meets/ dog parks are the worst. 0 responsibility. I am a dog owner and have kids. But those 2 don't mix. A dog meet is for dogs. Not for some kids . Kids are the worst with kids. My dog is the friendliest in the world. Yet it drives me bonkers if kids just pet my dog without freaking asking first. And their parents are just standing there....

Ive had this a few times too. In dog friendly establishments and young kids just toddle up to my dog, parents nowhere to be seen leaving me backed into a corner, why would you let your child do that anyway, dog or not? I always thank small children when they ask first. 'She's a bit afraid of children so no, but thank you for Asking!' I really appreciate sensible parents and a good lesson for children too.

Having owned a husky mix and fostering a couple the mention of poor recall and keeping them on a lead gave it away.
Incredible breed I love them they’re such characters.

@Unforgettablefire

Having owned a husky mix and fostering a couple the mention of poor recall and keeping them on a lead gave it away. Incredible breed I love them they’re such characters.

Mine definitely has a personality larger than mine!