Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Not to want to lose my human rights on the whim of a government minister?

301 replies

SecondRateFrog · 17/10/2021 18:45

Dominic Raab says he wants to bring in a system which allows the Government to legislate against UK court judgements in human rights cases if it doesn't like them. Without going through a debate or a vote in Parliament.
Is this the end of the role of the courts in our democracy?
"Raab threat to ‘correct’ court judgments is ‘deeply troubling’, warn legal experts"
It's in The Telegraph too.
uk.yahoo.com/news/raab-threat-correct-court-judgments-144345935.html

OP posts:
Peregrina · 18/10/2021 18:20

We didn't hear many complaints about the holding of the referendum when Remain thought they were going to win it.

But we heard plenty from Farage when he thought Leave would lose, and Johnson and Gove looked gobsmacked when they saw that Leave had won.
Leave have now got their Brexit and they are still not happy.

SecondRateFrog · 18/10/2021 18:24

@MadameMaxGoesler

SecondRateFrog Having our laws made by people we can get rid of is considerably better than what we had in the EU.
Speak for yourself. I can't see any other country in the EU leaving it. We're seen as nutcases in a failing country, led by a corrupt and wholly untrustworthy populist. But perhaps you're very wealthy and have picked up PPE contracts from the government (despite running only a sweet factory).
OP posts:
TatianaBis · 18/10/2021 18:26

@MadameMaxGoesler

TatianaBis We didn't hear many complaints about the holding of the referendum when Remain thought they were going to win it.
Or maybe you weren't listening.
AnneElliott · 18/10/2021 20:18

How do you feel about an Act of Parliament which allows a Government minister to come up with any statutory instrument he or she wants?

Such a wide ranging Act would need to get through the Lords. Which is most unlikely. Anyone who's taken legislation through Parliament (I have) knows that the Lords scrutinise the secondary legislation powers and often table amendments to restrict them. There is no way the Lords (where the current Gov do not have a majority) will pass open ended legislation enabling Ministers to table SIs that amend primary legislation in order to change the law without a parliamentary vote.

But the Gov has always been able to table primary legislation to change the law (or usually be more specific about the intention of parliament) if a court judgement is handed down which is seen as unhelpful.

JackieWeaverHandforthCouncil · 18/10/2021 20:50

‘We didn't hear many complaints about the holding of the referendum when Remain thought they were going to win it.’

Notice how Brexiters speak as the though monumental issues such as damaging trade and neutering an independent judiciary can be reduced to a football match with ‘winning’ and ‘losing’ teams? They support ‘their team’ right or wrong. No wonder they are so easy to manipulate into voting against their interests.

TatianaBis · 18/10/2021 21:24

Anyone who's taken legislation through Parliament (I have) knows that the Lords scrutinise the secondary legislation powers and often table amendments to restrict them.

Like they tabled useful amendments to the referendum act? Eg a threshold; or requirements for majorities in key cities/states in addition total votes like Australia; or requirements for a referendum committee to ensure both sides don’t print lies and to ensure equal media coverage like Ireland?

SecondRateFrog · 18/10/2021 21:55

The House of Lords can't stop legislation. If the government want to do this, then they can and no doubt will.
www.parliament.uk/about/how/laws/parliamentacts/

OP posts:
MadameMaxGoesler · 18/10/2021 23:01

AnneElliott Hooray! Someone who knows what she's talking about.
SecondRateFrog The House of Lords can stop legislation in certain circumstances.

MadameMaxGoesler · 18/10/2021 23:03

Peregrina I was telling Lord Frost only on Saturday what a good job he's doing.

MadameMaxGoesler · 18/10/2021 23:05

wewereliars What on earth do you mean by the "executive arm of government"?

MadameMaxGoesler · 18/10/2021 23:08

AnneElliott Bet you know my in-house lawyer Grin

MadameMaxGoesler · 18/10/2021 23:20

SecondRateFrog "But perhaps you're very wealthy and have picked up PPE contracts from the government (despite running only a sweet factory)."
As another woman said: “I always cheer up immensely if an attack is particularly wounding because I think, well, if they attack one personally, it means they have not a single political argument left.”

MadameMaxGoesler · 18/10/2021 23:28

TatianaBis No-one complained about the wording of the referendum question or the structure of the referendum (simple majority) until Remain lost. The legislation to hold the referendum passed its second reading in the Commons by 544 to 53

SecondRateFrog · 18/10/2021 23:29

Just read the thread and all the attached materials, why don't you?
And maybe consider the enormous concerns expressed by senior lawyers.
You clearly feel that you, personally, benefit from the current regime. Which is not a good reason to come up with ignorant statements encouraging people to disregard those who actually understand how lawmaking works.

OP posts:
TatianaBis · 18/10/2021 23:32

They did but you wouldn’t read about it in the Daily Mail.

MadameMaxGoesler · 18/10/2021 23:34

SecondRateFrog I'll just go and check with my senior in-house lawyer who actually steers legislation through parliament and drafts SIs.

MadameMaxGoesler · 18/10/2021 23:35

TatianaBis “I always cheer up immensely if an attack is particularly wounding because I think, well, if they attack one personally, it means they have not a single political argument left.”

MadameMaxGoesler · 18/10/2021 23:42

TatianaBis By all means campaign for a referendum to re-join. With a super-majority requirement, obviously Wink

TatianaBis · 18/10/2021 23:55

Not sure what your quote is supposed to refer to.

We don’t need a campaign to rejoin, the economy is imploding by itself.

They wouldn’t take us back anyway until Brexit fuckwittage is truly dead. It’s primarily an over 50 vote, with the biggest age block being 65+.

TatianaBis · 18/10/2021 23:58

We may have to rejoin the SM + CU to save the economy at some point tho.

MadameMaxGoesler · 19/10/2021 00:00

TatianaBis It was referring to your ad hom Daily Mail comment.
"They wouldn’t take us back anyway until Brexit fuckwittage is truly dead. It’s primarily an over 50 vote, with the biggest age block being 65+."
You are assuming that people don't get wiser as they get older.

Mrstamborineman · 19/10/2021 00:00

What does the attorney general already do

MadameMaxGoesler · 19/10/2021 00:03

boobot1 Vaccine passports like they have throughout the Schengen area?
www.schengenvisainfo.com/news/all-details-on-eu-covid-19-passport-revealed-heres-what-you-need-to-know/

MadameMaxGoesler · 19/10/2021 00:06

TatianaBis No we won't. That would prevent us making free trade agreements with non-EU countries.

TatianaBis · 19/10/2021 00:12

That’s “particularly wounding” is it? Confused

Replace with whatever right wing rag floats your boat.

Swipe left for the next trending thread