That the Met's suggestion of 'flagging down a bus' if feeling unsafe with a lone officer is an absolute joke

[hereforfun]

Apologies if there's already been a thread on this topic as I haven't seen one.

The Met police have also suggested that women should shout out to a passer by, run away and knock on doors or call 999 if they feel unsafe about being in the presence of a lone officer. The same applies if someone was to doubt the genuinity of a police officer.

I live and have grown up in South London where most bus drivers are known for being unhelpful/unfriendly. A lot of bus drivers will even drive past you without stopping the bus when you've signaled the bus to stop.
I couldn't even imagine being in an uncomfortable situation with the police and a bus driver stopping to see what's going on or offer their help. Also, if a bus driver was to stop after being flagged down, what is it exactly that they're meant to do?

As for running away and going to knock on doors asking for help I can only imagine this is some sort of joke? Many (not all, but many) police officers tend to use excessive force in situations where it's uncalled for. I would never in a million years think to run away even if I am seeking help, because many police officers would use that as a reason to use excessive force.

Lastly, I think it's ridiculous how the advice given focuses on ways women can keep themselves safe in situations as opposed to the Met coming up with ways to keep women safe.
Just a little rant about something that's been on my mind for a few days, what are your thoughts?

Why not sack the ones from the Whatsapp group that Couzens was in? And the ones who supported him in court knowing he'd raped and murdered a woman?

Yes, sack them - that only leaves 32, 755

@PattiPritell

They’re an embarrassment and rather than actually accept fault and open up channels of discussion with women to find out what makes them feel safe they’d rather suggest laughably stupid alternatives that re enforce the way society still looks at women as second class citizens.

What are your ideas for making women safe? @Sametoo

They could start by requiring 2 officers to be present if an arrest is taking place.

I get that it will be more inconvenient and expensive for the police (and therefore for society), but the onus really should be on the police to adapt and provide the solution, rather than women and bus drivers(!) trying to mitigate the risk on the police's behalf.

@noblegiraffe

There's also the proposal of an app where a vulnerable woman walking home can 'check in' when she gets home safely and which will alert people if she doesn't.

Not sure why the proposals are all putting the onus on women to challenge police officers, flag buses and download apps instead of making men change their behaviour. Oh no, wait....

Is that not just a modern take on "give three rings when you get in"?

However the fact he (the developer) thinks this is some great forward thinking idea just shows how out of touch they really are. We've been doing this since year dot and yet we are still here.

Yes, Patti, it's a fairly basic start isn't it? Given that two in the Met in the Whatsapp group were allowed to remain on duty while others from other forces were suspended during the investigation, it doesn't look like the Met is actually taking anything that they might need to do to restore trust seriously does it?

I suppose it gives the officers a bit more fun, though, as it means they can get the thrill of the chase more often with an almost guaranteed result at the end of it, what with women being slower, smaller and weaker

Is this when you are walking home at night?? Random police offers rugby tackle you.

REquiring two officers to be present at an arrest is sensible. Most officers are in twos I thought anyway.
Other suggestions @Sametoo?

@PattiPritell

REquiring two officers to be present at an arrest is sensible. Most officers are in twos I thought anyway. Other suggestions *@Sametoo*?

This would not work in practice unfortunately, as much as I wish for my own safety that it would.

We rarely work in pairs as we do not have the officers to do so. Single patrol is the default position and back up can be a distance away/already on another call.

An arrest is rarely pre planned and even the most mundane-seeming call can result in arrest - situation escalates/person turns out to be wanted etc etc.

I am as outraged as anyone else by what happened, as are every single one of my colleagues. However the overwhelming majority just want to do a good job in difficult circumstances. One evil individual, who I have no doubt would have found a way to commit a crime no matter what his job, does not represent us all.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-58834260

Broken travelcard schoolgirl denied entry to three London buses

One thing that isn't mentioned in discussions about policing is how society has changed. I'm sure with a quarter of officers being women that the Met is less sexist than say 10 years ago - but the abundance of online porn, 'normal' watching porn videos in public, 'banter' between men on watsapp or wherever scoring women on looks etc is now common and seems to be accepted behaviour in normal life . So it stands to reason that some of this will be found in the police.

There's also the proposal of an app where a vulnerable woman walking home can 'check in' when she gets home safely and which will alert people if she doesn't

And it gives people even more opportunity to blame the victim rather than the perpetrators- "Well why didn't she use the app!? She was obviously looking for trouble"

One evil individual, who I have no doubt would have found a way to commit a crime no matter what his job, does not represent us all.

Perhaps. But, big old but time, there were plenty of officers around this one that knew or were in the WhatsApp group, knew or actually called him the Rapist, that line managed him and those officers in a culture where it seems his behaviour and that of those in the know wasn't acted on.

So, that one officer has tentacles of those in the know that did nothing.

Now the Met are, at least visibly, making offensive suggestions on what women should do when the onus is on the Met to undertake root and branch analysis of what it should do.

We should be writing to our MPs - not about policing alone but about lax sentencing, lack of prosecutions in rape cases etc etc etc
The Gov seems to be keeping out of these discussions if it can, letting C Dick take the criticism, but it is a societal problem everyone needs to be involved.

knew or actually called him the Rapist,
This was found to be not true.

@PattiPritell

REquiring two officers to be present at an arrest is sensible. Most officers are in twos I thought anyway. Other suggestions *@Sametoo*?

Cameras? They have to wear a camera at all times and if an incident is flagged and their camera was off, they’re automatically sacked, no pension.

Give some suggestions as to what the Met should do to make women safe - without referring to WayneC preferably.

I think they do wear cameras

@PattiPritell

I think they do wear cameras

All of them? Do they have to have them on at all times? Are they sacked if their camera is off?

A bus driver refused to let my 11 year old on a bus in the pouring rain and dark, a few weeks into the term at her new secondary school (In an unfamiliar area, not that he’d know that in fairness) , because she didn’t have the right change.

If you can be that much of a thoughtless cunt I’m not sure they’d be coming to the rescue if they saw someone being arrested

@PattiPritell

Give some suggestions as to what the Met should do to make women safe - without referring to WayneC preferably.

Any hint of misogyny at all, sacked: no pension.

Give some suggestions as to what the Met should do to make women safe

Get its house in order, root out the misogyny and sexism.

Take reports of assault, rape, and domestic abuse seriously. Come down hard on the perpetrators instead of the current "well its unlikely to make it to court...". Fuck that, arrest and charge them anyway, it's not an excuse to let it slide and if they actually arrest them then it puts pressure on the court system to actually bring the cases.

When policing in the community, at venues, in the street, etc tackle misogynistic behaviour. If a woman reports being harassed, don't tell her to "just stay away from him" (happened to a friend if mine who had some guy at the funfair hassling her), go and sort it out, move him on, arrest him if he persists.

The fact that the government, posters on forums, commentators, etc are saying the police would be overwhelmed just goes to show the extent of the problem.

The sentencing is the effect.

The cause has to be eradicated.

Ok, let's start by making the Met (insert also regional police force) a zero tolerance organisation for the bantsy style behaviour you describe.

Change the culture, like many organisations have chosen to do to attract a diverse workforce. Such behaviour not tolerated. Disciplinary to follow when spotted.

This will necessitate policy, procedure and training for line managers but isn't completely unrealistic.

As to Cressida Dick, if you are the head of an organisation and it systemically fails, you take accountability.

And none of us should forget this case www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2156000/amp/Women-raped-Joseph-Moran-thrown-bus-20p-short-fare.html

She was thrown off the bus because she was 20p short! 20p!! Bus drivers I’m sorry if i offend any but they are not actually known for being helpful or friendly! Most I’ve come across have been quite rude. One laughed at me for only going one stop. My card hasn’t gone through on the bus a few times when the contactless wouldn’t work and the driver told I had to get off. And we should rely on them should we? Also not one single person offered to give her the 20 though sadly that doesn’t surprise me.

So, without breaking sweat 3 posters have made the same suggestion in less than 15 minutes.

Can't see why this is such a head scratcher for Cressida.

The more i think about that fucking App the angrier I am getting.

@PartyStory

They need to change the law so that they require two officers for arrests, like in Scotland. It won’t mean something like this can never happen but it will be a lot less likely. I can’t see any other possible solutions (and clearly neither can they if flagging down a bus is the solution offered).

That

The bus thing is ridiculous.
The MET need to address the issues within the police.

The entire “Well maybe if women do THIS-“ thing needs to go away. Male violence needs to be addressed at the source, and the source is not women.