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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to not pay for his work space?

221 replies

pumpkinsp1ce · 27/09/2021 13:49

NC for this. Bit of background: I line manage an employee who is just finishing his probationary period. He's great, no issues with performance and we are happy to keep him on and he wants to stay. He is a junior team member, works in a non client facing role and since he started with us he has worked from home 3 days with 2 days in the office, which works for him and us, and we're happy for him to continue with that arrangement for the foreseeable future.

However he has just let me know that he is moving a 3 hour journey from the city where we are based, and going forward he wants to request that we pay for a co-working space in his town of residence where he can work for his "home working" days. The place he has found is NOT cheap, though I'm not sure of the going rate for such as everyone here either works from our (perfectly fine) office or from their home. He would still travel into the office for the 2 days a week.

The reason for him "needing" the co-working space is that he is moving in with his partner and child and there is "no space" there for him to work from home.

Not sure what to do in this situation. We have been happy to continue to accommodate hybrid working since COVID where it is the employees' choice, which seems to presume they have the space at home to work from home. We aren't a big business and we pay our employees decently due to the city where we are based, but this co working space is a fairly big overhead when technically he does have an office here should he need it.

AIBU to refuse this request to cover the cost of his "wfh" space? Happy for him to continue to wfh 3 days a week if he has the space and resources to do so, but he's now saying he doesn't! WWYD?

OP posts:
thelastgoldeneagle · 27/09/2021 18:00

If you say yes to him, then it opens the door to other employees who may want the same...

And will he really travel 6 hours two days a week? Seems bonkers.

Howshouldibehave · 27/09/2021 18:03

He’s a chancer!

NumberTheory · 27/09/2021 18:11

@pumpkinsp1ce

Not afraid of saying no, I just have never come across this type of request before. We didn't have any homeworking pre COVID except at director level and then only occasionally. We have been accommodating hybrid working as we know it makes us a more attractive employer which for some roles that are harder to fill, is important. But this one has blindsided me as I thought he was happy with the arrangement. Would rather not lose him because he has been working on some key projects that will flow into next year, but he's not irreplaceable. Guess the request blindsided me.
He's just asked.

Maybe he knows someone where the company pays for a co-working space and they suggested he ask, or he's desperate to stay working for you but really doesn't see how if his personal life continues to move forward and this is an attempt to keep having it all. Or something else.

He probably has no idea about the budget and what the relative impact is. Doesn't know whether it's something to be brushed off or whether it will, as it has, startle you. Is there a lower cost you would be happy with? There could be some benefit to not having everyone have a permanent desk in the main office. Especially if the workforce fluctuates in your business. Though that's probably a more strategic decision, not a reason to acquiesce to a one off request.

In any case, he's just asked. And you can just let him know it's not on the cards. Then he can consider what he's actually going to do.

Raaaaaaarr · 27/09/2021 18:13

Ba ha ha ha. I can't believe they have requested this. No!

minimecantrollerskate · 27/09/2021 18:15

I would say no. If he is unable to WFH then he needs to come into the office. Those are his 2 choices. Why on earth would a firm spend out more money on office space when you have perfectly good premises that he can go to.

The sense of entitlement is just breathtaking. He chooses to move 3 hours away, he chooses to move into a home with no WFH space, but expects his firm to suck it up and sort it out. No way.

I agree with PP that the employment contracts need to be watertight. WFH means just that, and if they can't do that then they must attend the office. Two locations only, here or there. There are issues like GDPR and confidentiality etc as well to consider if he is using other premises not that you should even consider doing that.

Myusernameisnotmyusernameno · 27/09/2021 18:35

Yes I would expect him to work in the office then.

Mummyoflittledragon · 27/09/2021 18:46

Any change he is playing the long game and angling to try to set up that office as his main place of work and claim he is fulfilling the hybrid contract of “going into his place of work” by working from this office?

In any case, a flat no. If he doesn’t have space at his gfs place, they need to move somewhere else. He has office space in the city.

QueenBee52 · 27/09/2021 19:06

I can't believe you are struggling over telling this Chancer.. NO..

why is that ? 🤔

NumberTheory · 27/09/2021 19:13

@1FootInTheRave

He is cheeky as fuck!

Bet he'll be a nightmare down the line. This type usually are.

I disagree. At least so far. He's just asked. He hasn't made a fuss about it. He's identified what would be best for him and he's asked to see if it's possible. That seems ideal in an employee. The telling bit will be what he does when he's told "No.".
TractorAndHeadphones · 27/09/2021 19:14

@BoredZelda

We aren't a big business and we pay our employees decently due to the city where we are based

No, you pay the competitive rate for the job because if you didn’t nobody would work for you. Where you are based is only a small part of what makes the rate competitive unless you live in a city which doesn’t have any way for people to commute from cheaper areas. This sounds a bit like one of those “people working from home should expect a pay cut if they aren’t travelling to cities.

As for the request, it surprises me that you run a successful business but are confused about whether you have to agree to it.

In the short term there won't be a pay cut (unless there's a clear 'London Weighting' or similar) but there will be a levelling of salaries which could be interesting. Employers will pay what they need to recruit for a role. It's then up to the employee to make what they can of it. This benefits people living in cheaper, more rural places but disadvantages those who continue living in cities.

How employers will determine an appropriate salary is still a mystery...

ChristmasPlannier · 27/09/2021 19:19

@C8H10N4O2

Not afraid of saying no, I just have never come across this type of request before

I have. I've had people wanting pay rises because they were getting married, people wanting relocation costs because they were moving house (not at our request, they were working out of town and elected to move) and various other personally incurred expenses.

The answer is simply "no" unless as an organisation you have a policy to pay for remote office space in lieu of business premises office space.

During actual lockdown we did take out contracts with agencies for emergency childcare and support additional equipment etc but all aligned with the HMRC rules for reimbursable expenses (which is another factor to consider).

This

Little surprises me.

TractorAndHeadphones · 27/09/2021 19:19

@NumberTheory the issue is that he made the move before asking work.
If he said 'I'm considering moving, is this possible' then it would be completely above board.
However he has announced that he's moving and claimed that his new home has no home working space.
So how is he going to WFH?
If he continues as he is then it's clear that his request was bollocks and he can indeed find space.
If he doesn't then he will have to leave his job unless he wants a 3 hour daily commute.

Either way it's not a good look.

Shehasadiamondinthesky · 27/09/2021 19:20

CF!!! If he can't work at home then he must come into the office all the time.
I want to move to the top of a mountain - please fund my mountaintop shed, I don't think so buster.

Curerofsouls · 27/09/2021 19:20

I woulf get laughed oit of the office if I chise to move three hours from my work place then try to get them to pay for an office. Tell him he needs to find a job clowr to home.

ThinWomansBrain · 27/09/2021 19:26

you also need to be careful that if you are providing a place of work close to his home, that he doesn't claim that that is his place of work and expect you to pay for his commute on the days he does travel to the office.

PearLime · 27/09/2021 19:28

@ThinWomansBrain

you also need to be careful that if you are providing a place of work close to his home, that he doesn't claim that that is his place of work and expect you to pay for his commute on the days he does travel to the office.
Why would they ever have to pay his commute? They can literally sack him for no reason whatsoever as he has only worked there a few months'
thinkfast · 27/09/2021 19:40

No sensible employers pay for junior employees to rent their own personal office space when the business already has offices that the employee can work from.

Many employers have a contractual requirement for employees to live within a reasonable commuting distance of the office. Does his contract include this? 3 hours commute is too far IMO. Is that 3 hours each way?

Employers' hybrid working policies which permit wfh ought to provide that where employee wishes to work from home, their home must be a suitable working environment. That doesn't sound like this will be the case here.

I think you can just say it doesn't sound like his new home will be suitable for wfh, and that he'll therefore be expected in the office 5 days a week.

Cherrysoup · 27/09/2021 19:43

Totally unreasonable of him to move 3 hours away and expect the employer to pay for a work space. Is he quite mad?

rookiemere · 27/09/2021 19:45

The only conceivable reason I can think for any vaguely sane person to propose this is if he has an offer elsewhere and is chancing his arm to see if you'll up his salary. He'd have been better telling the truth though as this is such a CF request.

ThinWomansBrain · 27/09/2021 19:53

@PearLime - yes, I agree, pragmatically no one would agree to this

  • but if daft enough to do it, establishing a place of work close to his home, "his" office could be construed as his place of work - travel to a central office 3 hours away would then be business travel, rather than a commute that he is personally responsible for.
JacquelineCarlyle · 27/09/2021 19:56

Massive red flags Op - definitely say no to this.

I do agree with pp that you should have a WFH policy also. That keeps all requirements clear and up front, including the individual having space to work from that's DSE compliant. You should be getting confirmation of this anyway, so best to get it all written into a policy.

Fluffycloudland77 · 27/09/2021 20:05

I’d get rid now, he’ll have you taking his morning coffee in bed next.

Flufferty · 27/09/2021 20:09

Cheeky bugger. I wouldn’t even consider this.

CityMumma78 · 27/09/2021 20:57

No way, so cheeky! My opinion of him would instantly change too based on his request!! Unreal.

T0p0ftheW0rld · 27/09/2021 21:10

He is moving 3 hours away
Is he moving abroad to another country ? because this could have tax & data protection implications

If it is in the same country, you are under no obligation to pay for a working space

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