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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to not pay for his work space?

221 replies

pumpkinsp1ce · 27/09/2021 13:49

NC for this. Bit of background: I line manage an employee who is just finishing his probationary period. He's great, no issues with performance and we are happy to keep him on and he wants to stay. He is a junior team member, works in a non client facing role and since he started with us he has worked from home 3 days with 2 days in the office, which works for him and us, and we're happy for him to continue with that arrangement for the foreseeable future.

However he has just let me know that he is moving a 3 hour journey from the city where we are based, and going forward he wants to request that we pay for a co-working space in his town of residence where he can work for his "home working" days. The place he has found is NOT cheap, though I'm not sure of the going rate for such as everyone here either works from our (perfectly fine) office or from their home. He would still travel into the office for the 2 days a week.

The reason for him "needing" the co-working space is that he is moving in with his partner and child and there is "no space" there for him to work from home.

Not sure what to do in this situation. We have been happy to continue to accommodate hybrid working since COVID where it is the employees' choice, which seems to presume they have the space at home to work from home. We aren't a big business and we pay our employees decently due to the city where we are based, but this co working space is a fairly big overhead when technically he does have an office here should he need it.

AIBU to refuse this request to cover the cost of his "wfh" space? Happy for him to continue to wfh 3 days a week if he has the space and resources to do so, but he's now saying he doesn't! WWYD?

OP posts:
lovemelongtime · 27/09/2021 15:25

Also depends what his contract of employment says - I would guess he has an Office Location in his contract rather than him being a home worker. If so, the WFH arrangements are optional and you are not there to fund or support his lifestyle choices.

BungleandGeorge · 27/09/2021 15:26

Do you have a policy about how far away people can be? What about if he needs IT support/ team meetings/ reviews/ performance management/HR? He’s never going to want to travel 6 hours just to attend a meeting, you’ll never see him. It would be a no to that distance and a no to additional payment for working space from me! It’s amazingly cheeky to demand this, I’m not sure he’ll continue to be a good employee...

daisyducky · 27/09/2021 15:28

Haha!! Next he'll be asking for you to pay for his commute!

Absolutely not. You do it for him you have to do it for everyone

GertrudePerkinsPaperyThing · 27/09/2021 15:35

Total CF! Of course you don’t need to pay for this. You’re providing an office space already, which I assume he’s welcome to use 5 days a week.

If he wants to wfh he needs to make his own arrangements not charge them to you. I’m guess lots and lots of people would like to rent a space outside of their home , but nearby, to work in for free!

Muchmorethan · 27/09/2021 15:37

Do it for him, you set a president for other's to ask.

ittakes2 · 27/09/2021 15:40

I would speak to HR but I think that for an employee to put you in that position feels like a red flag of entitlement to be honest. Since he has only been there 3 months sounds like he took the job knowing his partner lived 3hrs away and its a bit cheeky of him asking you to pay for space. And how long will it be before he says travelling the 3hrs to the office is not great either. I think he's in his rights to ask you to pay for his home expenses related to working from home or I guess a similar amount for a desk somewhere but paying a pricey amount for a junior staff member doesn't make sense.

whiteonesugar · 27/09/2021 15:43

Erm, No. He's chosen to move. His issue.

PearLime · 27/09/2021 15:43

@sirfredfredgeorge

Eh? How did one person's request suddenly become all about women negotiating?

It's the many responses here suggesting asking was completely out of order - the "cheeky", "wrong", "a CF", "If he was working for me- he soon wouldn't be..."

There's nothing wrong with asking, those attitudes will discourage others from asking and negotiating their role, that's what depressed me.

I disagree.

I think part of negotiating well is knowing the position you're in and making requests that are reasonable and likely to be accepted, or met half way.

I agree women should be encouraged to negotiate well. That's not what's happening here.

In this context the man has overestimated his value to the company and also hasn't considered the fact that he is very new. This is why people are saying he is cheeky.

An example of a good negotiation for this man would be to ask whether, after the end of his probation, he could drop from two days working in the office to one day, due to a relocation. He could suggest a review after 3 months to see how it's going for both sides.

This approach is far more mature and reasonable.

Key message- good negotiation isn't about making lofty demands.

RedToothBrush · 27/09/2021 15:48

If you pay for him to have an extra space it will have to be taken out of his wage / tax allowance (Remembering it will be a taxable benefit of the job).

He would only be eligible for a perk like this in lieu of a pay rise - otherwise it would have to be a pay cut.

Otherwise he will have to make his own arrangements, or be in the office full time if he can no longer work from home.

A reasonable adjustment is to allow him to work from home if he choses, with working in the office the default choice. If arrangements at home are not suitable for home working thats his problem as there is an alternative option available to him.

You have no obligation to fund his lifestyle choices or his relationship choices.

If he does not like this, then he should find another job.

He's definitely trying it on.

CharityDingle · 27/09/2021 15:48

@C8H10N4O2

Not afraid of saying no, I just have never come across this type of request before

I have. I've had people wanting pay rises because they were getting married, people wanting relocation costs because they were moving house (not at our request, they were working out of town and elected to move) and various other personally incurred expenses.

The answer is simply "no" unless as an organisation you have a policy to pay for remote office space in lieu of business premises office space.

During actual lockdown we did take out contracts with agencies for emergency childcare and support additional equipment etc but all aligned with the HMRC rules for reimbursable expenses (which is another factor to consider).

I remember someone telling me about a junior team member who returned from a week's A/L and announcing that she had been ill one of the days she was off, and was therefore entitled to another annual leave day. And could not understand why the answer was no.

(If an employee fell ill, during A/L and was medically certified by a doctor, then they could subsequently recoup the A/L they lost out on.
But not just a random day, that you announced on return to work!)

IveGotASongThatllGetOnYNerves · 27/09/2021 15:50

No chance.

Original poster
pumpkinsp1ce · 27/09/2021 15:50

Thanks @PearLime - that's a good suggestion re the 1 instead of 2 days in the office, I will suggest that in lieu as I don't see that 4 days wfh would be an issue - though if his home environment is unsuitable for working it's a moot point I guess. Suspect the home environment will become less "unsuitable" if the alternative is a 5 day a week commute though.

OP posts:
MatildaIThink · 27/09/2021 15:50

You are being totally reasonable, he is effectively making himself redundant, that is his choice.

IM0GEN · 27/09/2021 15:58

@PearLime

Don't want to lose him

Take a step back- he is new, junior, and made a ridiculously impractical (cheeky!) request in his probation period.

I don't think you're losing that much tbh.

This.

Lord grant me the confidence of a mediocre white man.

TractorAndHeadphones · 27/09/2021 16:00

@sirfredfredgeorge

Eh? How did one person's request suddenly become all about women negotiating?

It's the many responses here suggesting asking was completely out of order - the "cheeky", "wrong", "a CF", "If he was working for me- he soon wouldn't be..."

There's nothing wrong with asking, those attitudes will discourage others from asking and negotiating their role, that's what depressed me.

There's nothing wrong with asking - when it makes business sense. Negotiating a job offer, counter-offer, part-time, sure.

But asking based on a personal decision without presenting a valid business case is CF behaviour.

HermioneWeasley · 27/09/2021 16:01

OP, I’d start recruiting. He isn’t serious about your job or your company. He can’t effectively WFH in his new set up and he’s not going to do a 6 hour round trip every week.

muddyford · 27/09/2021 16:02

You have a work space for him. It's called an office.

TractorAndHeadphones · 27/09/2021 16:02

Also to add - PP have made the example of asking for higher pay based on marital status. That's being a CF.
Even for part-time requests the onus is on the employee to explain how they will make it work. Technically you should be able to ask for PT and if it suits business needs it should be granted.
Whether it's for the school drop-off, feeding a pet cat or pole dance lessons is irrelevant.

TheOrigRights · 27/09/2021 16:03

He's new, he 'wanted to request' (your words from the OP, he didn't demand), work patterns have changed.

What's wrong with him asking? You just say no.
If he then can't meet his contractual expectations then you have an issue.

GatoradeMeBitch · 27/09/2021 16:04

I would consider it a red flag. He sounds very entitled. Way too early to start requesting things like this.

Biancadelrioisback · 27/09/2021 16:05

Loads of companies downsized as a result of lockdown and realising they don't need big offices for 100% of their staff 100% of the time. These places have been allowing staff to have a budget to work remotely, in some cases it's being able to set up a home office, pay the added electricity bill, or in some cases use a co-working space.

If your company had done this, I could understand him asking. However he decided to move somewhere not suitable. He doesnt get 2 work spaces while everyone else gets one and makes do at home

sirfredfredgeorge · 27/09/2021 16:11

An example of a good negotiation for this man would be to ask whether, after the end of his probation, he could drop from two days working in the office to one day, due to a relocation. He could suggest a review after 3 months to see how it's going for both sides

But that gets him nowhere towards what he wants, so it's a pointless negotiation, he doesn't want to work from home more, the home is not a viable place. I am quite sure they don't expect the negotiation to work, but going for something they don't want doesn't make honest negotiation.

If he's easy to replace, it's probably easy for him to get a new job too.

thepastisanothercountry · 27/09/2021 16:12

Unless he is

a) Indispensable

AND

b) irreplaceable

The answer is no.

OakPine · 27/09/2021 16:13

The fact that he had the front to make this ill considered request would be a massive red flag to me.
I would not be offering up any concessions like 1 day in the office instead of 2.
In fact if he is moving a 3 hr commute away, I'd be questioning whether he would actually make the journey twice a week.
If you pass his probation, be very clear that the 2 times in the office is not optional/dependent on the weather/trains/etc.

NameChange2PostThis · 27/09/2021 16:16

@pumpkinsp1ce
This is an unreasonable request. I expect you are blindsided because it is sooo unreasonable. Unless the individual has a rare, highly specialised skill set, there is no way I would countenance this request. It would set a very dangerous precedent. What if the next request is a move to a different country, come to the office once a month, and you pay all flights and hotel costs? It is a standard expectation that employees who choose to wfh as a flexible option instead of commuting to the office, ensure they have the facilities to work effectively. You should remind him that you do not require him to wfh and if he is unable to do so properly he can revert to 5 days a week in your office.

Also, he needs to be careful what he wishes for - if you do choose to fund another workplace for him, as it’s not a job requirement, it would be a benefit in kind, and taxable at his marginal rate.