To feel very sad that Margaret Becket isn't deputy leader of the Labour Party, instead of Angela Rayner?

[MaMaLa321]

I listened to Margaret Becket's speech at the start of the Labour Conference this morning. Reasoned, intelligent and temperate.
(I watched it live, and can't find a link yet - apologies).
Then read the transcript of Angela Rayner's speech at what seemed to be a fringe meeting yesterday, which was the absolute opposite. No reason. No intelligence. Just a rant.
I'm very off the party at the moment, but Beckett made me think again, while Rayner - well - who would that attract, apart from those who were already going to vote Labour (and feel very smug about it in the process)?
Of course, the latter speech gets loads of media coverage, which is just what the Party doesn't need.

Yvette Cooper or indeed Lisa Nandy would be better than both of them.

The right wing press did a fantastic job of labeling Corbyn a ' communist' when he was a socialist. They will do an even better job of labeling AR as a hysterical woman not fit for purpose and Starmer as boring without any real policies! Easy pickings there. They will be torn apart come election time.
The LP need to win over people again not piss them off! Tough call.

You could certainly imagine her getting into a pub brawl. Mind you John Prescott was the same, he actually punched a potential voter once on the campaign trail!
But I don’t believe he was quite as course as Raynor and had more humour about him and more self deprecating and was respected amongst his fellow Labour mp’s ( iirc). He was also liked by Blair crucially. You just know Keir can’t bear Raynor but can’t get rid of her and I very much suspect there are plenty of Labour mp’s that cringe when she gets up to speak.

@the80sweregreat

The right wing press did a fantastic job of labeling Corbyn a ' communist' when he was a socialist. They will do an even better job of labeling AR as a hysterical woman not fit for purpose and Starmer as boring without any real policies! Easy pickings there. They will be torn apart come election time. The LP need to win over people again not piss them off! Tough call.

Oh the right wing press, that old chestnut. Are you also like the Labour Party, and think that people are just stupid and cannot hold an opinion without interference from right wing press? Nice try Momentum HQ! That worked out well for you at the last GE. She comes across as a nasty woman, as well as a bad politician. She has said and done enough to show herself to be that.

Lisa Nandy who stated on live TV that convicted rapists should be locked up with vulnerable women? I wouldn't compare her with Yvette Cooper at all.

The right wing aren’t really doing anything tbh. Rayner and Corbyn are doing it to themselves. Add McDonnell in and you get a party that are unelectable. How do we know this? The last GE and the next one if it stays as is.

I don’t see anyone in the sidelines who can do anything here. Cooper maybe but she doesn’t want the role (and who can blame her).

So regardless of what Boris and co do Labour are finished for the short to medium term. IMHO of course!

IMO the worst thing about this group of women is that they are setting such an appalling example and giving such a poor impression of women generally. It is just giving ammunition to those who don't think women are capable.

Angela Rayner is a lot worse than Corbyn. At least Corbyn had intelligence.

I don’t see much changing over the next 2 years do you. David Milliband coming back? Having said that people were saying last time that if Starmer had been in place he would have walked it. It’s easy to make excuses, should have, would have, couldn’t have etc.

Rayner is a liability to her party and yes, I agree with a PP who says that Starmer would love to get rid of her.

I really liked Caroline Flint. Also had a lot of time for Alan Johnson when he told Momentum to get a grip on the night of the last election.

Completely agree. Watching ex-postie Johnson (who has experienced actual deprivation) give it to that insufferable privately-educated Momentum millionaire was the only good thing to come out of election night. It summed up precisely how Labour has gone wrong. Unfortunately, it was also very depressing, because everything he said was true, and Labour seemingly has no inclination to listen to people like him.

Just seen AR on Sky news - absolutely uncouth and ranty.
My politics are Conservative but I would certainly consider a suitable alternative. Unfortunately I'm not a fan of far left politics and definitely wouldn't vote for a woman who would be a loud mouthed embarrassment on the world stage and I'm afraid I don't see Lisa Nandy as any better.
I thought Kier Starmer might be a good alternative but feel he/Labour have been completely ineffective.
Why can't they come up with properly thought out policies, rather than just moaning or dissenting?

@Dissimilitude

It’s almost like they enjoy opposition and never want to hold power to actually change anything.

Who wouldn't want a job where you got paid to stand around just saying "we wouldn't have done it that way..." and no-one really caring anymore about how you would have done it, because it's been so long since the last time you actually offered anything constructive.

I have always thought Alan Johnson is a really decent man.
Why are the decent people all sidelined?

I didn't read her speech and I agree calling anyone scum is awful.

But this -
Could you imagine her on the world stage?
We have Boris fucking Johnson.
The man is awful.
He goes around the world insulting people, treats everything as a big joke, lies routinely to everyone, and has turned the UK into an international laughing stock.
The man doesn't even have the decency to try to look smart and brush his hair. Even Trump managed to do that.
I can't imagine anyone worse apart from Benny Hill.

@prynaithda

Yvette Cooper or indeed Lisa Nandy would be better than both of them.

I agree on Yvette Cooper but Lisa Nandy wants to put men in women's prisons. I had a call from her representative during the leadership election and I said I wouldn't vote for her due to this, he wasn't interested in the slightest and was quite hostile to me.

I agree she is as big a problem as Corbyn.

Why do labour promote such warped thinking people into leadership roles?

You have women who think some very strange things in that party about biology and safeguarding.

People do believe the press though !
Maybe it's just my friends and family , but many are swayed by the likes of the daily Mail and the telegraph! People can't deny how influential they are and how people hang on their every word.

I’m a single mum in a council ‘ouse. I’ve questioned my internalised misogyny- but still think AR is a walking fucking ASBO and were she housed next to me, I’d be putting into the council for a transfer!

Who exactly IS feeling allegiance with her?

I was cheering Johnson when he made that statement during election night. But Momentum aren’t interested in winning anything. Ash Sarkar, Owen Jones etc are a disgrace to the Labour Party but I agree with some others. Do they really want to be in power? They don’t give the impression they do at all, just moan, and whinge from the sidelines and is it just me but thinking of Rayner, Abbott and even McDonnell a lot of the time. Do they really believe that what they do and say will help the Labour cause?

Genuinely interested as to whether Rayner thinks what she said on the eve of an important conference has helped the movement and made people think she is leadership material? Looking at what she was saying on Sky earlier made me think she was proud of what she said (and being from up North, and being a single mum at 16 and being passionate) all to excuse what she said and make people want to vote for her.

Ironically I think Labour need more people with Rayners back ground and experience but she's not articulate and seems bitter and angry and wants to punish anyone who she thinks had it good!

Alphabet- Laughed out loud at your comment!

I think a lot of the problem is the level of self absorption. It is very me, me, me.

Was hopeful for Nandy until she revealed herself in the leadership contest regarding men/women and happy to bend to any groupthink of the day.

The only women I've rated in the Labour party were Claire Short (her views were her own and she'd defend them - her comments on Blair/Iraq etc. Caroline Flint. Kate Hoey. All women that were not there to make men feel better about themselves (ie. Rayner who clearly is mouthpiece for misoygnists).

I don't rate Cooper as she does not put her head above the parapet and challenge openly any of the crazy ideas circulating (twaw etc). Cooper must think it's better to be within to know what's going on (I'm sure she can't agree with lots of what happens).

However, that's the wrong position- the only option is to walk away from the Labour party otherwise the new generation of potential "groupthinkers" assume everyone agrees with them. I don't understand why people try to fix this problem from within, it's gone too far. It needs tearing down and starting again and the only way to do that is for people not to continue to vote for a concpet of a Labour party that clearly doesnt' exist anymore.

Votes will be chased when enough people walk away - to continually vote/support the crazy policies which then seep in bottom up (ie no-one elected a Labour government with policies we see touted for schools etc regarding girls losing privacy and seeping into our High Street shops even.

We have schools and council offices where people are in fear of speaking openly against the current groupthink. This is because people with influence in the Labour party are not speaking up and walking out. The debate isn't had as no-one of any standing will challenge them. It doesn't have to be a woman - there are plenty of men in the Labour party too that could stand up against the groupthink, but they don't - it's too neat a way to bash women for them to give up.

They remind me of gamblers, they get something out of misery and want to drag everyone else down with them, they enjoy the occasional good time and just relish misery.

Angela seems to have a different flavor of what her mum has going on, only she wants to present dog food and shaving foam to the entire country instead of her family, or what Abbot had going on with her son in the house and we all now see the brother that Jeremy Corbyn grew up with. We see what Hancock was doing to his wife suffering long Covid and Boris to his wife suffering Cancer, his now departed Mum was vocal about him enjoying making a mess and her having to attend a mental institution as a result.

They do now link DV and political extremists with misogyny and there is a link with those who can't contain misogyny within the home and want to harm the wider public.

Rayner is my MP, can't stand the woman massive chip on her shoulder. Makes me cringe whenever she opens her mouth.