AIBU to want my 5 yr old to go sleep by herself?

[MarshmallowX1983]

DD is 5yo and has never fallen asleep by herself. Every night we sit by her bed and sing to her till she drops off. Some nights this is 5 mins other nights it’s 40. Some nights I have plenty of patience for it and other nights I’m tired and hungry and I find it unbearable. We’ve tried multiple times to leave her to it, leaving a night light and a Moshi story on, she just screams the house down. CIO does not work, she just screams and screams, and it never did when she was a baby (she would scream till she threw up)

DS is 7 and has been falling asleep by himself since he was about 12 weeks old. DD has always been a bad sleeper which I blame myself for as when she was born I was dealing with a 2 year old and a baby and I just wanted to get her to sleep so singing and rocking seemed like the quickest way. Talk about a rod for your own back! Here we are 5 years later.

Should I keep going and expect her to eventually grow out of it? Or will she be calling me from Halls of Residence at uni when she’s 18, asking me to sing down the phone to her?!

If you say you are just popping to the loo or to get a drink then go back and check on her would she be ok? Then try to increase the intervals?

At that age can you just talk to her a bit? Explain that you are just going for a few mins & will pop back etc and that she isnt allowed to scream, because you know, she is 5 and is a bit big for that?!

Treat it like any other undesirable behaviour - star charts or rewards for working towards something better?

How is her behaviour in other ways, is she managing ok with school etc?

Could you try audio books on an Alexa?

Ds is 6 and he will listen to stories for 15 mins and 9 times out of 10 he's asleep before the time is up.

Mine was like this, had to cuddle her until she was almost 6. Started as soon as we put her into a bed rather than cot. She's so stubborn that all the methods we tried she just wasn't having.

What eventually worked was pure bribery. If she let me go she got a reward. Then she had to do it 5 times to get one and then 10. But wouldn't have worked when she was younger, eventually she just accepted it and has been ok since then.

She does listen to an audiobook now still.

Thanks guys. We have tried the ‘Mummy will come back and check on you in 5 mins’ thing and she always ends up calling out for us when we don’t go back, or crying. Have also tried explaining that she needs to learn to fall asleep by herself for her own good but she doesn’t want to hear it. I left her tonight and came downstairs and she just sobbed ‘Can I just get a little bit of help?’ like a bloody strung out drug addict asking for one more hit!!!

@DeepaBeesKit her behaviour is fine otherwise - still throws the odd tantrum but generally fine and she enjoys school and learning.

I could try both the audio book and the bribery.

Following with interest. Same issue with my 4 year old. It's so hard.

Is she definitely tired enough or is bedtime too early?
Does she have enough wind down time/ time with you before bed?
Could you wean her off the singing so you just sit in her room (least you could maybe listen to an audio book with headphones on or faff on your phone!)

We had this with our DD and it used to drive us totally nuts, like you said, we wanted to have our dinner, or needed to work, tidy up, or just wanted to watch some bloody tv! Used to nearly drive me to tears some nights in frustration.
We tried everything but the only thing that worked was getting her a Yoto (which plays white noise, sleepy songs, and you also buy story cards for it) however, I do think that we also bought it just as she was starting to be ready to go to sleep on her own anyway, I don’t think it was necessarily the Yoto alone. She was 6 nearly 7.
She still wants us to stay with her as she falls asleep, and sometimes we will hold her hand, but literally just for a few minutes and then she’s happy for us to leave.
Good luck, keep going, she will get there, I could never have imagined it not too long ago!

The issue might be that you "don't" go back when you leave the room, or that you are out of the room long enough for her to call for you to return. I would suggest popping out as you do, but step outside the room for literally 10 seconds to start with and come straight back. Work on increasing your time spent out of the room gradually but always come back. The idea is to build her trust in you always returning. You can use various excuses as to why you're leaving the room - putting washing away, going to toilet, changing into pjs... eventually she will get used to you popping in and out whilst she's in bed and she will fall asleep by herself, almost accidentally.

Once this has happened I would suggest plenty of praise and as PPs have said, a reward chart could also work well once you reach this stage.

@MarshmallowX1983

Thanks guys. We have tried the ‘Mummy will come back and check on you in 5 mins’ thing and she always ends up calling out for us when we don’t go back, or crying. Have also tried explaining that she needs to learn to fall asleep by herself for her own good but she doesn’t want to hear it. I left her tonight and came downstairs and she just sobbed ‘Can I just get a little bit of help?’ like a bloody strung out drug addict asking for one more hit!!!

@DeepaBeesKit her behaviour is fine otherwise - still throws the odd tantrum but generally fine and she enjoys school and learning.

I could try both the audio book and the bribery.

The leaving for 5 minutes thing only works if you actually do go back and check on her though surely? 🤷🏻‍♀️ I feel your frustration, I have a very similar 5 year old ds, he goes through phases of being a bit easier but right now with the change of new school year he’s tricky again..
What has worked a bit in the past is giving him 3 ‘tokens’ worth 10 minutes of iPad time each at bed time (actually we started with 6 tokens worth 5 minutes each) and every time he got up he has to give a token back. However many he had left when he fell asleep was how much iPad time he got the next morning. As we don’t usually let him have it in a morning this was a big bribe! This, plus an audio book (the rabbit who wanted to fall asleep type thing), plus me telling him I’d check on him after (5 minutes/ I’ve eaten my dinner/ I’ve hung up the washing etc) worked enough that we could get rid of the tokens. He still needs the audio book though, and sometimes for me to check on him (but is willing to wait much longer now and usually drops off before I go back)

As I said though, the change of a new school year has fucked it all and he’s back to being pretty clingy, but he’s also knackered from year 1 so falling asleep pretty fast anyway.

Good luck, bad sleepers are soul destroying!

You actually have to go back after five minutes (or less). Keep that up for a while until she trusts that you will. I used to say “I’m popping to the loo” and remain within earshot.

Now, after years of assisted sleeping, both dcs settle themselves. Ds tells us to shove off (he’s 11) and dd colours or reads until she passes out (she’s 9). They both wanted company for a long time!

I'm sorry OP that's ridiculous. Tell her to go to sleep - she's 5!
Put a gate up if you need to.

I must be in the minority as my 5 year old can't fall asleep by herself but I don't mind, it won't be forever and one day she won't need us!

I don’t subscribe to the sitting there for hours book and know they grow out of it in 7yrs. I walk away, surely she’s tired enough with school that even with a bit of crying she eventually will fall asleep?

I feel your pain. I was there for years with one of mine

Also v stubborn and wasn't having any of the usual tactics. If I walked away she'd follow me. Or just scream at full pelt then the whole thing would go on for hours longer. I had to stay with her for my actual sanity.

Eventually improved with age and audio books and also giving her something to do after live left for a set period. Eg. Puzzle book, small toys to play with.

Age and the above and it's much better but it's very very painful at the time. As single parent with MH issues made worse by crying kids, it more or less broke me.
It does get better !

@underneaththeash

I'm sorry OP that's ridiculous. Tell her to go to sleep - she's 5! Put a gate up if you need to.

It may be ridiculous but it depends on the child. Some you can just say go to sleep and they will. My oldest was of this variety.

Youngest no fucking way that would have worked without total carnage.

When my DC is not getting off to sleep, I let them go to sleep in our bed and then walk them through to their bed (practically still asleep) when I go to bed myself. The change of scene seems to work for them and they're too sleepy to protest when subsequently put in their bed.

Exactly! It works fine with DS and always has. He can self settle. DD simply can’t and whenever we try to just walk away (and we’ve all but locked her in her room!) she screams the house down. Perhaps some people would see her behaviour as manipulative but at the end of the day she’s 5 and even if she is screaming to get her own way, it’s not like she’s purposely trying to ruin our evenings.

Watching this for some tips!!!

My eldest is 4 and she will not stay in her bed if we leave the room. Will follow me out straight away. Could put her back in her bedroom 50 times and she'd keep running back out!!! Only falls asleep if I stay with her and lay next to her urg

Going through this with 3 yr old which I think is actually much easier as a 5 yr old will have reserves to fight you! We are going small steps - so starting with sitting outside the room in her view. She is very tired when we put her down so I know won’t last long. Tries to chat but I tell her I can’t stay there with her if she’s talking. I can only stay if she’s quiet. Reward every day for falling asleep in bed on her own. Next week will start coming and going but at start you need to be back every 30 seconds otherwise they come looking for you. Then build up from there. Sounds like a pain in the ass but if they are confident you are returning then they relax and sleep. Then you can stretch the times. Five mins is an eternity at that age.

Sorry to sound doom and gloom but DS is 10 in Dec and still
Sleeps on a mattress in our room and I have to sit on the bed till
He falls asleep
Otherwise he just comes down and complains. I have no answers. DS is happy and sleeps. 🤷‍♀️

It really is a rod for your own back - I wish people like you would pop up on some of the sleep threads. Children need to be taught to self settle. I can’t imagine a life where I have my evening revolving around my child for 5 years!

At that age bribery to resolve. She is old enough to understand. You need to do it gently and don’t over complicate but she needs to learn this!

Just pop in every 10 minutes and after a week do 15 and so on maybe show her the clock mummy will be back when the hand gets to number 3 ect.

My 7 year old is like this I have truly tried everything she goes berserk screaming if left

She did self settle as a baby !! She was an amazing sleeper when little and as a toddler would literally fall asleep anywhere.

My one tip OP is meditation music for kids on Spotify. That and bribery .