AIBU for thinking hating people for their political leanings is perfectly normal?

[VelvetChairGirl]

I have been reading a brexit thread on here and lots of brexit voters in it seem horrified that they are hated and families have stopped talking to each other, and cut each other off over it.

but its politics nothing affects us more then politics, we have people who cut off others for believing in conspiracy theories and things. Brexit is the biggest shake up in this country in my life time, its taken away our freedom of movement for work and education, needlessly introduced a tonne of red tape, made our rights and standards extremely vulnerable to being destroyed (tories dont like food standards and workers rights this is well documented and they are in charge right now), reduced our standing in the world and will very likely lead us to being the poor man of Europe again, not to mention the fact its cut off vital EU funding to science research, regeneration and education projects up and down the county.

it affects everyone, of course people are perfectly entitled to hate those who voted to hurt them financially, prospects wise etc as much as they would hate someone who physically stole from them, theres very little difference is there?

most pensioners in this country dont realise we have the lowest pension rate in Europe

Here's a link to an article that says the fair comparison is based on what the poorer pensioners get, and the UK is actually better than France, Germany and Spain.

fullfact.org/europe/pensioners-eu-uk/?utm_source=content_page&utm_medium=related_content

As well as the pensions schemes discussed above, France, Spain and Germany all have safety net social assistance payments for the elderly, where income and assets are taken into account so poorer pensioners get more. The OECD last collected this information in all four countries for the year 2016.

Using the 2016 exchange rate, this type of payment could top up pensioners’ income to around £150 a week in France and Germany, and £80 a week in Spain.

The OECD told us these amounts are comparable to pension credit in the UK, which is an income-related benefit that (in 2016) could top up a single pensioner’s weekly income to £155 a week if their state pension and other earnings were below that. For 2015/16, the government estimates that 40% of families eligible for pension credit weren’t claiming it, leaving up to £3.3 billion of available pension credit unclaimed.

So in this respect, UK pensioners can expect slightly more money from the government than their European counterparts, although comparing gross figures doesn’t take into account different average incomes and cost of living in these four countries.

It is very immature to not be able to tolerate views which are not the same as yours, which is essentially what you say when you 'hate' someone for their political views - you cannot tolerate an opposite view.

Since moving from left to right as I have got older, I have definitely grown psychologically from that exploration of the 'other's opinion'. It started with Brexit I suppose - I voted Remain but now can completely understand where the leave voters were coming from. I supposed I used to be a bit Tory bashing in a banter-y type way (not a HATE way), and I feel it is a bit immature when I look back now.

BTW: Being more right wing as I am now has incited many million times more hatred than I ever got being on the Left from Right Wing people. I do think this is more coming from left wing people. Right wing people take down arguments, left wing take down people.

IMHO there is centrist which is meaningless fence sitting, left and right and then the far left and far right

I would add centre left and centre right to those. I'd say centrism is balanced and reasonable, rather than 'fence sitting'. The best of both right and left can be considered for each issue in hand, rather than automatically defaulting to the left or right view. It's the most open-minded place to be in that respect.

It depends on what those leanings are.

No doubt any leanings you disagree with would qualify...

Hatred is a waste of time and energy and a distraction from finding solutions to problems. Or, put more simply, I can't be arsed to hate anybody.

You sound very immature. I wouldn’t like to be your friend.

Right wing people take down arguments, left wing take down people.

I mean this is patent nonsense. All Johnson seems to do at PMQ's is slag off his opposition. No arguments to make so he plays the man rather than the ball. As do all his ministers.

I hated Thatcher and thought those who voted for her were sociopaths. That’s not quite the same thing though.

I dont like centrists I must say, its a cop out stop sitting on the fence, politically its absolutely meaningless,

Right and left are pretty meaningless as well. Few people are in any one box. Some find adding or replacing with open-closed and/or authoritarian-libertarian adds dimension, but there are many options out there.

What you're describing about the far-left and far-right is Horseshoe Theory. It has supporters and criticism. It does require someone to think the left-right way of dividing politics is still meaningful though.

There are many ways to divide up political ideologies. In all of them, you're going to deal with a portion of the population who doesn't have strong opinions on some political topics and those that have opinions that fit in more than one box with no political identity. Calling them fence sitters isn't going to win anyone.

Maybe what we need is politicians who do more listening to people and discussing possible solutions, and less insulting the electorate and making everything an ideological identity pissing match. I mean, we're already divided enough, so we really need to be encouraged more to be divisive so we can be political proper?

@Wroxie

The current Tory party are not "conservative" - they are fascist kleptocrats who will stoop to any low, any lie, to line their own pockets.

The people who vote for them (and who voted for brexit)- unless they are obscenely wealthy - are mind-numbingly stupid, self-sabotaging cretins who would rather burn the whole house country down around themselves than allow anyone else happiness, comfort, or stability.

I am basically so far left as to fall off the map, but I have a grudging respect for politically Conservative people with honest convictions. Sadly, they don't exist anymore- there is no way you could hold honestly conservative beliefs and not be diametrically opposed to the current party that calls itself conservative.

When you have to result to insults, you have lost any integrity you have and ironically it makes you look the less intelligent voter.

Sorry OP I think hating someone because their politics differ from yours is a little immature. I agree with @Angrymum22 who said "Respecting other people’s point of view and beliefs is a sign of tolerance and intelligence."

IMO if there was a bit more mutual respect around the world would be a better place.

It’s not just about opinions though is it - the way people vote is an expression of their morals and values. While I would never hate anyone for disagreeing with me, I do have to question the values of people who (e.g.) vote for a party that presides over massive cuts to welfare. And to be honest this does make me inclined to dislike them

The problem with this is the lack of humility. For this to be a valid way to proceed, you need to assume your own understanding of reality (particularly history and economics) is highly accurate, and that theirs is the same as yours, but they just choose to vote differently because they're evil.

There's a quote from a famous poem

The best lack all conviction, while the worst / Are full of passionate intensity

The more intelligent and educated people are, the more aware they are of the limitations of their own understand, and the more likely they are to express themselves moderately.

People who have simple and clear ideas about things, who have the kind of high certainty about their beliefs that would justify hatred, are generally people who don't know enough to have an inkling about their own limitations.

Hate is a strong word but to me political leanings are a reflection of a person's morality. Your opinions on helping the vulnerable, or discriminating against marginalised group, and how you use your vote to build a better society, are not equivalent to your opinions on whether you like brown or white bread better.

I absolutely determine my social circle by how I perceive someone's morality. I don't want to have liars or cheats in my life. Neither do I want to have callous, selfish people in my life. All of that plays out on both personal and political levels.

I'm acquainted with Tories. Some I'd count as friends - those who are open to different ideas and aren't too far gone. As long as they still vote Tory, there'll be a bit of distance between us. Other Tories I've known, I have definitely hated for their political views.

yes he was a proper socialist, they all seem to have been kicked out the party now I am convinced starmer is a trojan horse paid by the right wing to destroy the party theres no other logical explanation for how anyone can destroy a party so much

Hmm yet Corbyn achieved the worst results of any leader of the Labour Party since 1910 with a low of 13% in the European elections and polling just 18% when he resigned in 2019.

Today Labour is polling 37% just a few points behind the Tories.

The evidence disproves your point but I am sure that wont get in the way of your beliefs.

are mind-numbingly stupid, self-sabotaging cretins

This kind of hatred is part of the problem for the left. It’s rife but not helping anyone.

I think some anti -Brexiteers will have their anger engraved on their gravestones.
I mean, Covid, Afghanistan, no travel, Cop 26, global warming, the world as we know it coming to an end - and still they go on and on and on..................It's funny really imv

I think we should all just cut each other a fucking break personally.

What is all this bashing achieving apart from making people feel superior and righteous?

I personally don't believe in constantly stewing over things unless you are taking proactive steps to make a change. What change are you going to make from constantly berating brexiters? What change are you going to make from hating Tory voters? Would they make you change political party by bashing you? No? Didn't think so...

You are not achieving anything by berating them.

I don't know anybody who has been converted by Jehovah's Witnesses. If anything it feels patronising to have somebody preaching to you about how you should live your life and how your way of thinking is wrong. You are doing the same.

Just let it fucking go.

You hate them? Actually hate them…? All of them…??!! That’s just juvenile, over-simplistic, and a little pathetic. You can’t live your life carrying all that hatred for everyone who disagrees with your politics. It also undermines the credibility of your opinions and convictions.

Hating people because of their politics shows a huge lack of intelligence and maturity. Weird to want to live in a little echo chamber.

@RiotAtTheRodeo

It’s just my experience of being both left and right

When I was on the left I was never called a murderer for example, or told that I couldn’t be associated with if I voted left (ie. hated)

Now I’m more right leaning I’m an automatic nazi murderer for some people ( like OP)

Very long term Tory voters must already know this is the way of the world very acutely as when I’ve disclosed my political opinions they’ve gone “hey me too” which I’d previously had no idea about and I’ve realised they’ve just learned to keep quiet as they’ll just get a load of abuse. The quiet majority!!

Hell, you can barely mention you are right wing anywhere these days without a barrage of abuse and name calling….yet they win elections.

I know the issues are important and can lead to strong feelings but I think hate is too much.

I am a semi old fart and have seen hate in action too many times in my life.

Hatred of that which is "other" to oneself has been responsible for the greatest atrocities in human history and continues to be so.

It starts with persons expressing hate such as you have done here.
It begins to spread.
A person/persons of bad intent sees an opportunity for themselves.
An explosion of division and hate occurs.
Positions become entrenched.
People start to die, killed directly or indirectly, such as by deprivation..

Hate is destructive, divisive, intolerant amongst other negative things and just plain dangerous.

Sorry but you can keep your hate, I don't want any part of it.

You quite clearly think some things I strongly disagree with but I will not hold any bad feeling towards you for that and especially not hate. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion in a democracy.

If someone, for example, voted Brexit because they're racist, I'd dislike them. If they were also generally unpleasant people to, I'd loathe them.

But if someone voted Brexit because they honestly thought it would solve the problem of a different issue they had, and that I knew them to be good, kind and decent, of course I wouldn't hate them. I'd think they were mistaken and I might be disappointed in them if I'd expected different. But no, I'd never hate anyone purely for their reasonably mainstream political opinions alone.

I think it speaks far worse of the person doing the hating. It shows them to be irrational and incapable of understanding the other side of an argument, not to mention being unable to understand that other people are not one dimensional, and have other qualities.

I had a blazing row with a friend who has very different views to me - in the end we formed a truce by agreeing that her life experiences which had formed her views and beliefs were very different from my life experiences which had formed mine.

Nothing to do with either being bad people just different lives.

I suppose I admire OP for having no doubts in their political convictions. That most be a very comfortable position.

@Theluggage15

Hating people because of their politics shows a huge lack of intelligence and maturity. Weird to want to live in a little echo chamber.

Nobody wants to live in an echo chamber but perfectly mature and intelligent people can hate politics they perceive to be unjust. Am I supposed not to hate regimes that legitimise raping and murdering women and children? Does my absolute loathing of them make me immature and stupid?