AIBU to think that the BBC and other news outlets are reporting that the lack of lorry drivers and care workers is caused by Covid alone and that they are deliberately ignoring Brexit?

[Aurorashields99]

And if you agree, why do you think this is the case? Surely Brexit is as much to blame for these issues so why are they not reporting this fairly?

I must have watched half a dozen news stories over the past few days in which reporters only mention Covid as being the cause of empty shelves in the supermarket and the shortage of care workers. If Brexit is referred to at all, it is only mentioned fleetingly.

Of course Covid has had a heavy impact on these sectors too but it's not the only factor is it? So why is Brexit being ignored?

I am not a journalist or a troll. I have been a member of Mumsnet since 2003.

And yes I know there is a Brexit topic elsewhere but (a) I am interested in people's votes and (b) not being able to discuss this in AIBU and confining this thread to the Brexit topic is the perfect example of the issue I am complaining about here.

And it is allowing Boris Johnson and Michael Gove to cover their tracks and not to have to face the consequences of their actions. Covid is providing the perfect cover for them both.

Why aren't reporters doing their job and reporting the facts fairly? Why is Brexit being swept under the rug? Is it because Johnson and Gove were former journalists themselves and know how to spin events in their favour?

Or is Brexit a dirty word now even though we are all living with consequences?

@Annoyedanddissapointed

Sometimes it's nkt a shortage. The goods are in the shop, but the quality is abysmal. Veg and fruit are going off basically on a way home...

In a way though that will be due to the shortage.

If things can’t get picked on time (another brexit issue) then the issues around logistics mean they are delayed getting to the shop then that will impact on quality

@Aurorashields99

Here you go, of you're interested.

@TheNatureOfTheCatastrophe

It's actually interesting to see the government standing firm on refusing to grant skill shortage visas for lorry drivers.

If you take the party branding off this is a government refusing to bail big business out of a hole by enabling them to import cheap labour and keep pay and conditions low. Instead they're insisting that employers improve pay and conditions to provide good quality skilled non-graduate jobs for British workers. It's pretty old-school TUC.

I thought the government had given the go-ahead to extending the already long hours of lorry drivers?

Thanks for link Wotwhywhen!

I live in Europe and can confirm that we do not have the shortages the UK does.

@NantesElephant

Are other European countries who have been dealing with COVID but not Brexit in the way we have experienced similar shortages? Honest question as I don’t know the answer.

I'm in Spain and I haven't noticed any shortages whatsoever.

Yes I've just read this article in the guardian about how the shortages have been brewing for years -

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/sep/17/empty-shelves-covid-brexit-britain-lorry-drivers.

Yes I've just read this article in the guardian about how the shortages have been brewing for years -

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/sep/17/empty-shelves-covid-brexit-britain-lorry-drivers.

That article hits the nail on the head!

"Being outside the EU single market and customs union imposes bureaucracy and friction at borders that British businesses did not previously face. Ending freedom of movement for EU nationals has drained the labour pool from which many industries recruited. Without agricultural workers, food rots before it can get to market. Without hauliers, goods sit unshipped in depots."

"Pay is going up in some sectors, but not by much, and it is too early to identify a sustainable boost to workers’ power in negotiation with bosses. One-off bonuses to lorry drivers do not yet presage that overdue rebalancing of industrial relations. Low pay, antisocial hours and insecure contracts are entrenched features of Britain’s economy that cannot be upgraded overnight. It is a model that relies on a workforce that is insecure and financially precarious – conditions that generated the craving for control that was so deftly exploited by the leave campaign."

"The pandemic functions as political camouflage for Brexit-related problems. The two issues are interlinked and ministers steeped in Eurosceptic mythology are motivated to highlight the Covid dimension. But the excuses will run out before any upside to life outside the single market materialises. It is still unclear what that bounty might be."

"Businesses also have incentives to downplay logistics problems. Supermarkets do not want to trigger panic buying and suppliers do not want to advertise their commercial vulnerabilities. But sparsely stocked shelves and unfilled orders cannot be hidden from consumers, nor will it be feasible for the government to pretend that they are accidents of nature. Covid is part of the story but, as so often, the pandemic has exposed structural weaknesses in Britain’s society and economy. Some of those flaws have developed over generations. But not the hard Brexit that is sabotaging Britain’s recovery. That was a choice, sold energetically – and dishonestly – to the public by the current prime minister. The financial costs might be borne by consumers and businesses, but the blame belongs to Boris Johnson."

I make no apologies for still "banging on about Brexit".

I read an article in the New York Times saying there were worker shortages and big issues with food supply chain in the US due to covid. I thought it was a combination of the two over here but who knows which is the most to blame.

There have been many items on BBC about others going back home. Not just truckers. Polish 'plumbers' because wages in home countries have improved.
There were many foreign trucks on our roads that were run by very large companies in France or 'Eastern' Europe. Their drivers could be away from their home depot living in the cab for a month or longer.
Their journeys crossed several borders, with covid those crossings were discouraged even within mainland Europe.
I used to drive a 7.5t and it has got very difficult to get around, even trying to stop and find a loo. Having to carry old bottles to piss in then carry it in the cab till finding somewhere to dump it.
Improve the roads and conditions for driving especially if you want to encourage women to drive trucks.

Are other European countries who have been dealing with COVID but not Brexit in the way we have experienced similar shortages? Honest question as I don’t know the answer.
I live in Spain. There are no food shortages here and there isn't really a pingdemic in other sectors either.

@Linguaphile

I live in Europe and can confirm that we do not have the shortages the UK does.

Back from 4 weeks in Italy, no shortage seen.

DS also needed 2 non urgent blood tests when there - no issues with same day appointment & no shortage of blood vials.

@Eve my family in CE have been visiting doctors and dentists since last summer with no issue...

I'm in France. There are no food shortages as far as I know. The supermarkets are as normal.

I have noticed shortages of manufacturered goods from China however. My DD wanted to buy apple earphones (regular ones not airpods) last week and we tried 3 different electronics shops. All of them said they were out of stock and they didn't know when they would get them back in.

Not much point banging on about Brexit now it's done and dusted

@Kendodd

YANBU Covid has been an absolute gift for Brexit politicians.

This ^ x100

It’s “done” but definitely not “dusted”

The effects are being felt in the supply chain, on farms, in hospitality & in the care sector and will be felt for years to come

Still blue passports eh

@roarfeckingroarr

Not much point banging on about Brexit now it's done and dusted

Not much point banging on about anything then...

Of course there is a point. Someone needs to be held responsible

@roarfeckingroarr

Not much point banging on about Brexit now it's done and dusted

It’s done but really we are still very much living under the cloud of dust it created

It’s done but really we are still very much living under the cloud of dust it created

And there's more to come ...for years ... but starting 1st of next month when the UK will tighten the customs formalities quite sharply.

Are other European countries who have been dealing with COVID but not Brexit in the way we have experienced similar shortages? Honest question as I don’t know the answer.

I live in a EU country.

There are vacancies for HGV drivers, but that is not the same as "shortages" - i.e. deliveries are not being impacted to the extent that they are in the UK. There are no empty shelves in the supermarkets or in the builders' merchants or white goods shops. One Brexit-bonus for the EU has been the return of hundreds of thousands of EU citizens who were previously working in the UK.

There are likewise vacancies for nurses and care workers, but again, this is not such a shortage that is stretching the service to the point where patients are suffering. Despite Covid, the local hospital here actually considered moving to short-time working in the Spring, as some departments had no waiting lists. I have a family member working in heathcare in another EU country - there the hospitals had caught up with the Spring 2019 backlog (caused by Covid) by the end of the Autumn last year, and have since remained on top of waiting lists. The idea that 10% of the population might be waiting up to 3 years for an operation, as is the case now in England, would fill the population with horror and political heads would roll. Where I am, GP appointments are available every day - I have on occasion just walked in and been seen within 30 minutes.

Brexit is certainly not the sole cause of the shortages facing the UK - there has been a lack of investment in training, the NHS, hospitals, factories, infrastructure etc. for decades. Covid has had a more immediate effect of exposing weak points in the UK, but many of these weaknesses have been caused by Brexit. In addition, over the last 40 years the UK economy has become hugely integrated with the EU - the UK imports a huge percentage of food, ingredients, chemicals and components from the EU, as well as a large number of workers.

It is impossible to imagine that making trade between the UK and EU more difficult, and losing hundreds of thousands of EU workers over the last 2-3 years would not have an effect on the UK. Rising wages are all very well - but then prices rise as a result, so the employee is in effect no better off. This is not a problem for those able to sell their labour to the highest bidder, but it means that those on fixed incomes or who cannot negotiate wage increases (e.g. pensioners, public sector workers, those on benefits) get left further behind as prices rise and their food, energy, care and housing bills get ever bigger.

No shortages in German supermarkets whatsoever. There were empty shelves for a few weeks at the beginning of the pandemic last year and people hoarding toilet paper but nothing since.

I was on the fence re Brexit but not one of my leaver friends gives a toss about blue passports. But something to bash the ignorant thick racists with, yeah?

@londonrach

Shortages are worse in the EU. M&s closed shops in France due to no delivery.

Well I guess that is because they can‘t get deliveries from the uk 🤔

@NantesElephant

Are other European countries who have been dealing with COVID but not Brexit in the way we have experienced similar shortages? Honest question as I don’t know the answer.

Here in Germany I certainly wouldn't say there are any shortages or empty shelves, and there's nothing I haven't been able to find. There was a sign up in our local supermarket saying that a few products might not be available in the short term due to logistical issues, with no further explanation as to why (the recent floods might play a role too) but it certainly isn't noticeable (by comparison with the panic hoarding last March, where there WERE empty shelves for a few weeks). So I can imagine that Brexit in combination with the UK's more isolated geographical position plays a big role for you.

this is a government refusing to bail big business out of a hole by enabling them to import cheap labour and keep pay and conditions low. Instead they're insisting that employers improve pay and conditions to provide good quality skilled non-graduate jobs for British workers.

Now the government needs to go further and apply the same policy to itself. We shouldn't need to import doctors and nurses, we should improve pay and conditions (and possibly increase training places) until we have more than enough UK people.

(I've nothing to do with NHS and nothing against immigrants, I was born and grew up outside the UK myself. I just don't like seeing rules being bent. If the rules are right, stick to them, if not, change them. Don't put them in place then pretend you have no other option than to treat yourself as an exception.)